Cowboys to sign Greg Hardy (Seahawks out)

[12thbrah]

If we sign Hardy the Hawks hatorade will be spewing online like a geyser.

Do etttt!!!

 

[drdiags]

My thinking is he signs with the Cowboys. DV is pathetic but I do know Leroy Hill had to go through a couple of incidents, one requiring probation, the other was dropped. Since he has retired, I don't know if the pattern stopped or not but Hardy will get a second chance with someone. Here or elsewhere and some fans are going to be very upset with it.

Hardy could be a monster but only the folks in the incidence know all the details, depending on their level of sobriety.

EDIT: Got off track, removed comments

 

[Seafan]

If Pete and John are actually interested they must have a different view of him than most. I'm not worried. I doubt they sign him.

 

[ctrcat]

Personally, I would love to hear what the Carolina Panthers community thinks of this guy. Any Carolina fans in here, or people from the Carolina area? We are all on the outside here, I'm sure people closer to the Panthers community have a better idea of who Hardy is.

Love the guy. IMHO Hardy and/or the Panthers should be compensated heavily for paying for the sins of another man (Rice). If that's not true, then why did he play in week 1 with no problem before the Rice video came out? GM Dave Gettleman and Rivera have nearly gone nuclear at press conferences, and many fans have wondered if Jerry Richardson's love of the league (only former player to own a team and only team other than Jets/Giants to have NFL logo at midfield) over his own team forced the team/fans to take the uppercut. Richardson is extremely close to Goodell and the Panthers fell on the grenade. IMHO the verdict by Becky Thorn Tin was a sham and based on the facts available (because who REALLY knows?) there was no way it was ever ultimately going to be anything other than an acquittal.

And don't think just because the Panthers aren't bringing him back it raises another red flag. Regardless of the charges, he was not coming back. Charles Johnson is a good but overpaid player from a previous GM, and Gettleman did not want to have too much $$$ tied into the DE position. Kony Ealy was drafted in the 2nd last year before the incident and I look for them to draft another this year at some point. Newton and Kuechly are getting contracts soon and the team will have an estimated $70 million in cap space next year. In 2013 the Panthers were the 3rd best team in football, narrowly losing to the Hawks aided by DeAngelo Williams fumble and actually beating the 2nd best, San Fran, on the road in the regular season. The tag was placed on Hardy to make a run at the big prize in 2014 with a front 7 that had produced 60 sacks the year before.

Make no mistake, Hardy has a screw loose (obviously), but I think some team will get a steal. I think his 2nd team All-Pro selection is accurate and warranted. I don't think he's close to Watt and he was beaten by Joe Staley (1st team All-Pro) in the playoffs, but he'll be a fantastic player and is worth the risk (which there is some).

THIS is the kind of thing I'll remember him for https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O5QtpXsWuTM. 2012 vs the falcons after losing a heartbreaker in the ATL which Ryan infamously stated "GTFO our field!", Kraken went unglued and stomped the NFC top seeded falcons, and returned the favor in style. Also went off on them last year in the dome. He's a madman (in good ways as well, not just bad).

 

[Cyrus12]

Ray Lewis murdered someone in cold blood, got away with it and was the hero of Baltimore....now on national tv as an icon.....it could be worse...

 

[titan3131]

Women get a benefit of the doubt.

Just because a judge ruled assualt damage to her body she claims then fine he did it. But until that comes out his innocent.


this isnt aldon smit crashed in a tree arrested for dui and drug the morning of practice. This is a She said he said.

 

[Scottemojo]

Ray Lewis murdered someone in cold blood, got away with it and was the hero of Baltimore....now on national tv as an icon.....it could be worse...

This is only evidence of your ignorance. But talk away.

 

[-The Glove-]

Ray Lewis murdered someone in cold blood, got away with it and was the hero of Baltimore....now on national tv as an icon.....it could be worse...

No, he didn't. Google is your friend

 

[kobebryant]

The situation seems to grey for me to form an opinion of a man I do not know regarding a situation that I have no first hand knowledge of.

Can he help the Seahawks win a Super Bowl? Does he have good football character? Is he a good teammate?

I do not look to pro sports for morals, I loom to pro sports for entertainment knowing that any given team may have guys ranging from Justin Forsett to Jerramy Stevens on the character spectrum.

 

[kobebryant]

Ray Lewis murdered someone in cold blood, got away with it and was the hero of Baltimore....now on national tv as an icon.....it could be worse...

No he didn't. Citation needed.

 

[Basis4day]

Until I have some proof that he actually did what she accused him of. He is innocent till proven guilty.

And there is still confusion regarding the circumstances of his case.

AGAIN, he was FOUND GUILTY in a bench trial. Not a preliminary hearing, not grand jury declining charges. He was found guilty in a legal proceeding.

He appealed and by law the verdict was set aside for a new jury trial. This is different from the conviction being overturned.

This is his legal right under North Carolina law. This trial was considered a new proceeding.The evidence as presented in the bench trial was inadmissible. But this does not remove the fact in the public knowledge that he was previously convicted of a crime.

The jury trial was dismissed, largely as a result of the accuser declining to testify in the new trial.

Think whatever you want about the Greg Hardy situation. But do so based on the facts.

 

[Sac]

I'll pass.

 

[TwistedHusky]

And if he was found guilty, should he be prevented from playing because of it?

Regardless, he was found guilty but the process did not continue. Unless he is enjoined from playing, he is able to. And it seems the 6 game suspension aside - he is able.

Can he help the Seahawks to be better, win more and perform better on the field - with ultimately a better outcome?

Yes.

Does his addition to another team present a more difficult hurdle for the Seahawks to potentially overcome?

Yes.

Those are the ONLY issues I care about. There are multiple areas where a player's conduct might make me pause at whether or not I would be OK supporting his inclusion on the team. This is not one of them.

The "evidence", whether guilty or not, still comes down to whether or not you believe one party over the other. The stories from both camps do not mesh with the physical evidence. And I don't believe these kind of accusations are the kinds that warrant giving the accuser the benefit of the doubt.

 

[olyfan63]

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=11513357

Watch that link and tell me if you still want him. This guy is 100x worst than Ray Rice/Adrian Peterson/Aldon Smith/etc.

I've watched it, and yes I still want him. His "girlfriend" is a shameless and notorious groupie who made a number of baseless claims against Hardy. If Hardy had done the all the things that she alleged, and she legitimately thought that he was going to "kill (her)," she surely would have prosecuted him to the fullest extent of the law (as her attorney also alluded to in that clip). Instead, when Hardy requested a jury trial, she chose not to pursue it and gladly took a nice fat check instead....which tells you all you need to know about her credibility and motives. Hardy has already paid a huge price, both legally and in the court of public opinion, now it's time to move on and get back to football. Bringing him in on a short term (even 1-year) deal where he's motivated to rehab both his football value and public image makes a ton of sense for both sides, and if he screws up again, you just cut him.

This Nicole Holder chick is checking a lot of boxes for Borderline Personality Disorder. (BPD) Right now the data says 80% likelihood. Her account seems to have a lot of exaggerations and embellishments in it.
These chicks are experts at setting men up. They are expert at using the legal system against men and knowing when and how to do so, and take pride in their ability to deceive others. They know the system is set up to believe the woman first and assume the man is an evil abuser. Sometimes that's the case, sometimes not. These chicks know how to exploit it.

* The bit about being thrown onto a couch full of loaded assault rifles (he bragged that they were loaded) strikes me as a BPD embellishment.
* The continuous emphasis in her reported comments about how demonic he was, saying he would kill her, making sure to paint him as an extremely evil man, and paint her as an innocent, helpless victim, strikes me as a calculated embellishment.
* The reported information she was on coke at the time diminishes the reliability of her account, and the likelihood of embellishment.
* The data that Hardy called police first to report her being rings true; Hardy would have started to realize that he's being set up and would want to involve outside attention and witnesses.
* Ms. Holder being unwilling to testify and proceed to a jury trial checks a few more boxes. If she is what I think she is, she probably knew a few jurors would see through her and realize what she is. It's much easier to fool one judge than to fool 12 jurors over several weeks.
* Hardy apparently kept going back for the sex. BPDs are mind-blowing sexually; it's their core competence, how they lure their victims in.
* Apparently she was able to get Nelly to hit that too. BPDs can be appealing and quite intoxicating in luring men in. And they're generally not just teases.

Review Duke Lacrosse and how those young men were "convicted" in the media and by overzealous campus administrators, when there was no reliable evidence.

Here's a good one: It took FIVE false rape allegations for this woman to go to jail, after she in effect raped at least FIVE men with her false allegations. False allegations are worse than rape, because they send innocent men to jail where they likely will get raped by other inmates, in addition to losing their life as they know it. Yet false allegations are rarely punished, so we get more of them.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... years.html

Male borderlines do false allegations too:
http://bpdfamily.com/message_board/inde ... sg12285448

I'm not saying Greg Hardy was or wasn't violent. I'm saying that he's been "convicted" in the court of public opinion, on questionable evidence, by a witness who appears to have credibility and reliability problems.

I think Pete and John should pursue Greg Hardy, and have the team do enough independent investigation to see if Ms. Holder is in fact a black widow spider who sucked a naive, inexperienced Greg Hardy into her web.

To me the data and evidence is 80-20 or better in Hardy's favor, based on what I've seen thus far.
If others have more reliable and credible witness testimony, forensics, etc., please share. At this point, it's mostly in the he-said, she-said category.

Oh yes, and does anyone remember the Brian Banks story? The falsely accused guy Pete brought in for training camp?

 

[olyfan63]

Until I have some proof that he actually did what she accused him of. He is innocent till proven guilty.

And there is still confusion regarding the circumstances of his case.

AGAIN, he was FOUND GUILTY in a bench trial. Not a preliminary hearing, not grand jury declining charges. He was found guilty in a legal proceeding.

He appealed and by law the verdict was set aside for a new jury trial. This is different from the conviction being overturned.

This is his legal right under North Carolina law. This trial was considered a new proceeding.The evidence as presented in the bench trial was inadmissible. But this does not remove the fact in the public knowledge that he was previously convicted of a crime.

The jury trial was dismissed, largely as a result of the accuser declining to testify in the new trial.

Think whatever you want about the Greg Hardy situation. But do so based on the facts.

Hardy was, fortunately for him, able to afford competent attorneys. Those attorneys advised him well, and took advantage of knowing North Carolina's laws. They knew they had two chances to get Hardy off--the bench trial, and on appeal, a jury trial.

When your client is dealing with jail time, keeping out of jail is the key factor in defense strategy, not public relations. The bench "conviction" means nothing. It just means that Hardy's defense lawyers wanted to get the state to tip their hand, so they would know how to prepare for a jury trial, and WIN at that stage. To me, it sounds like a sound strategy. With the added plus of having a chance to win at the bench trial stage.

It also sounds like the State realized they would lose in a jury trial, and decided to quit while they were ahead and blame Ms. Holder.

As I understand it, the FACT is the "conviction" was SET ASIDE, for the new trial, basically with an effect as if the conviction NEVER HAPPENED. So there is no current, valid "conviction" that Hardy is serving any sentence under.

 

[XxXdragonXxX]

The decision of a single (possibly biased) judge in a bench trial doesn't hold much weight to me, especially when the DA decided not to submit the testimony of the "victim" from said bench trial due to a lack of credibility and inconsistencies in her story.



Holder running off with all the money she got from the settlement screams that she was in it for the money all along.

 

[olyfan63]

The decision of a single (possibly biased) judge in a bench trial doesn't hold much weight to me, especially when the DA decided not to submit the testimony of the "victim" from said bench trial due to a lack of credibility and inconsistencies in her story.

Holder running off with all the money she got from the settlement screams that she was in it for the money all along.

There's a certain percentage of Boy Scout males who put all women on a pedestal and refuse to believe there are women so devious, and that it must always be the evil man's fault.

Holder knew she would lose in a jury trial, and not just lose, but be ripped to shreds in public, exposed as an evil, mentally ill fraud. Accepting a "generous settlement" and maintaining a veneer of victimhood would sound a lot more appealing as an alternative.

 

[Hawks46]

Also worth noting that the judge for the bench trial was female.

Surely you can find out more information than that.

I was actually looking for some information about how and when our justice system was set up. I really can't find anything where it's legal to have one person be judge, jury and executioner (sentencing). I did, however, find that it is our inalienable right to a trial by a jury of our peers.

A "bench trial" sounds like something the government set up to save time and money. Just get the perp into the system with the least amount of fuss. Funny thing, as it goes with the government, it typically ends up costing more, as you get two trials...for the price of two.

On topic, I would love Hardy to be here. Anyone with the nickname the Kraken is alright on the football field in my book. I haven't heard of any other DV problems Hardy has ever had. He wasn't conficted, and that's good enough for me. If it pops it's head up again, then I'll judge.

 

[olyfan63]

I'm certainly not saying Hardy is an angel or even a Boy Scout. I'm saying it's very likely he's just a regular guy who's been railroaded.

To me this situation has personality-disordered sociopath fingerprints all over it. The hard part is figuring out which of the parties is the one matching those prints. I think it's 80/20 Ms. Holder, maybe more like 90/10 Holder.

Unleash the Kraken! In Seattle!

 

[nash72]

We don't need that Hardy stuff hanging over our heads all season. I don't want him.