Compare Dallas final play to win vs Eagles..

Swedishhawkfan

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To our fade play. They end up having a coverage breakdown and Witten is wide open for the game winner. Now the reason I think the fade is such a stupid call here is that it is a fairly safe but low percentage call = perfect for 2nd and goal when you have more downs to work with, but crap when you essentially have a hail mary from the 10 yd line.

The only thing that matters, is the highest possible chance that the outcome is a touchdown. Int does not matter, sack does not matter etc. By throwing a quick read throw like a fade (to Kearse also, one thing if its jimmy vs 4th string 5'2" CB..) You eliminate all possibility of the following:

Rw buys time and someone gets open, scramble and coverage breakdown etc. Or simply stand in the pocket, count to three and throw a bullet to someone in the endzone, since it is still a higher % than a fade.

It is sort of the same as when we where mad at holmgren for throwing a fade on 4th and 2. A fade COULD work, but it is not a high percentage play. The main advantage with a fade is that it is very quick and safe with a low risk of sack or pick, but that is exactly why it is so stupid in a hail mary situation where only probability of a touchdown matters.

A complete backyard play, where everyone just runs into the endzone and try to get open, would have had a higher chance of getting us a touchdown because it gives you options. It also puts pressure on the D when they have to cover a long play, knowing that even an injured Russ could easily run it in if everyone is covered.

But a fade in that situation slams the door on 80% of the ways you could win the game as soon as the ball is released, and you depend on luck and perfect execution instead of giving yourself the best possible chance to win. All easy ways to potentially win the game are instantly eliminated.

Put it this way. If you were a saints fan, and you know Seahawks final play is a combination of routes in the endzone, where Wilson will throw it hard to someone after buying time or run it himself.. or that hawks throw a quick fade to kearse, which one do you hope for?
 

gowazzu02

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Didn't read your entire post. But i'lll just say this:

Dallas has A: a Healthy Mobile QB, and B: the best offensive line in football.......

Wilson threw a fade and barely got the damn ball off.....
 

Ozzy

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The fade call wasn't the right call and Pete even alluded as much on Brock and Salk. With the defense in place it should of been audibled to some sort of slant type play because of the inside pressure. Wilson ran out of time before he could make the switch and here we are. I also agree with Salk that it looked designed to isolate Kearse which is weird as he is your 4th best receiver. You had Graham and Baldwin on the other side. It just doesn't make any sort of sense. Bevell was wrong, that's the bottom line.
 
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Swedishhawkfan

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Even a slant has to be WIIIIDE open to be a good call. I think the "everyone run into the endzone and find a seam" play has a higher touchdown % than both fade and slant (unless ofcourse the slant is blatantly open but even then you are screwed if they fake pressure).
 

Sports Hernia

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Dallas O-line gets away with more obvious offensive holding than any team in the NFL.
The narrative was they were "all world" before game one of their careers.
I think they are very good, throw in the refs swallowing their whistles when Dallas has the ball, that's what makes they great.

As for the last play comps, I think it's a poor comp for the reasons that have been pointed out.
 

RichNhansom

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austinslater25":34oaxicd said:
The fade call wasn't the right call and Pete even alluded as much on Brock and Salk. With the defense in place it should of been audibled to some sort of slant type play because of the inside pressure. Wilson ran out of time before he could make the switch and here we are. I also agree with Salk that it looked designed to isolate Kearse which is weird as he is your 4th best receiver. You had Graham and Baldwin on the other side. It just doesn't make any sort of sense. Bevell was wrong, that's the bottom line.

But the defense wasn't in place when the call was sent in. It's the QB's job and QB alone to audible to the slant when he see's the DB playing off instead of press which he was. So you are correct right up to the last line.. Wilson was wrong, that's the bottom line.

I feel ya though, this old lady cut me off in traffic today and I screamed BEVELLLLLLL!!!
 

sdog1981

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Cable and Bevell are the dead weight that is sinking this team.
 

joeseahawks

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What if we have Bill Belichick as coach?
I just believe we don't use the strength of our best offensive players.
Our Money players MUST get the ball. I remember, when Lynch was our best player ... we would feed him until he gets through. Graham and Baldwin MUST be the guys getting the ball on offense.
When you go down, you go down with your best weapons ... PERIOD. Graham and Baldwin are better weapons than Kearse. We just don't feed our best guys enough.
RussB":2b9blne0 said:
Imagine if we had the cowboys o line.
 

SeaToTheHawks

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Swedishhawkfan":1a6ww460 said:
To our fade play. They end up having a coverage breakdown and Witten is wide open for the game winner. Now the reason I think the fade is such a stupid call here is that it is a fairly safe but low percentage call = perfect for 2nd and goal when you have more downs to work with, but crap when you essentially have a hail mary from the 10 yd line.

The only thing that matters, is the highest possible chance that the outcome is a touchdown. Int does not matter, sack does not matter etc. By throwing a quick read throw like a fade (to Kearse also, one thing if its jimmy vs 4th string 5'2" CB..) You eliminate all possibility of the following:

Rw buys time and someone gets open, scramble and coverage breakdown etc. Or simply stand in the pocket, count to three and throw a bullet to someone in the endzone, since it is still a higher % than a fade.

It is sort of the same as when we where mad at holmgren for throwing a fade on 4th and 2. A fade COULD work, but it is not a high percentage play. The main advantage with a fade is that it is very quick and safe with a low risk of sack or pick, but that is exactly why it is so stupid in a hail mary situation where only probability of a touchdown matters.

A complete backyard play, where everyone just runs into the endzone and try to get open, would have had a higher chance of getting us a touchdown because it gives you options. It also puts pressure on the D when they have to cover a long play, knowing that even an injured Russ could easily run it in if everyone is covered.

But a fade in that situation slams the door on 80% of the ways you could win the game as soon as the ball is released, and you depend on luck and perfect execution instead of giving yourself the best possible chance to win. All easy ways to potentially win the game are instantly eliminated.

Put it this way. If you were a saints fan, and you know Seahawks final play is a combination of routes in the endzone, where Wilson will throw it hard to someone after buying time or run it himself.. or that hawks throw a quick fade to kearse, which one do you hope for?

Excellent analysis.
 

Flyingsquad23

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First off did you see one of the reasons Dak had to throw that pass in overtime? It was your high percentage bullit pass to SOMEONE open in the endzone play that was picked off at the goal line. We all agree a Wilson that can scramble would have made for many different options, the fact is the throw he chose has won games at all levels and situations through out the history of the game. This time it missed...by inches


By the way, the minute the ball is released that ends 99% of "other" options. And that's exactly the same for every pass play called.
 

lobohawk

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As mentioned already, Pete noted that Russell would have changed the play, but ran out of time after getting protection set. Sounded like something they'd gone over, from his tone.

Now I don't know if that took too long or if he was short on clock by the time they lined up. Pete also mentioned that it took time for NO to show their coverage or lack thereof.
 

MarylandHawk

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Wilson threw the ball late on the fade. If he'd thrown it earlier when the defenders hands were all over JK... At the most Kearse has a chance to catch it before it goes oob.... And at the least you get defensive holding cause the guys arms were draped over him.... It was a bad call that could have been overcome with a better throw. Never throw the ball out of the end zone on the last play of the game... You take away any chance for something good to happen.
 

Fade

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joeseahawks":3272x7ac said:
What if we have Bill Belichick as coach?
I just believe we don't use the strength of our best offensive players.
Our Money players MUST get the ball. I remember, when Lynch was our best player ... we would feed him until he gets through. Graham and Baldwin MUST be the guys getting the ball on offense.
When you go down, you go down with your best weapons ... PERIOD. Graham and Baldwin are better weapons than Kearse. We just don't feed our best guys enough.
You see that works against Darrell Bevell's #1 philosophy of "they will never see it coming." Jimmy Graham doesn't have 0 red zone TD's in his last 16 games played for no reason. :D
 

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