All 22 notes, Indy.

[TJH]

LOL. You're the one regurgitating stats to make your argument, not me.

 

[volsunghawk]

LOL. You're the one regurgitating stats to make your argument, not me.

Stupid facts, always getting in the way. :mrgreen:

 

[Sarlacc83]

You're right. I totally haven't watched the games. You've got me....Especially since you don't (or can't) back up your assertions with any type of football knowledge,

LOL. You're the one regurgitating stats to make your argument, not me.

It's physically painful to see something this stupid in print.

 

[TJH]

You're right. I totally haven't watched the games. You've got me....Especially since you don't (or can't) back up your assertions with any type of football knowledge,

LOL. You're the one regurgitating stats to make your argument, not me.

It's physically painful to see something this stupid in print.

THe funny part is you argued against your own point.

 

[Sarlacc83]

You're right. I totally haven't watched the games. You've got me....Especially since you don't (or can't) back up your assertions with any type of football knowledge,

LOL. You're the one regurgitating stats to make your argument, not me.

It's physically painful to see something this stupid in print.

THe funny part is you argued against your own point.

I find that unlikely given your admission that you're just making everything up to match your desired outcome. At least we can now ignore you completely from now on, given the fact that even you know you're full of hot air. Cheers!

 

[drdiags]

I encourage any of you that can afford it to get NFL rewind the entire package so you can see all plays in the all 22 and endzone cameras that you don't see on tv. it will tell you Who is open who isn't, who fails etc.etc. then its all open to conjecture on WHAT is really going on because you have all the data. My wife loves it because she can totally get her head around what happened and why..

peace.

I have this and it is worth the subscription. I find it hard though to watch all the games before the next week's games roll around. The condensed version is cool and a split view of the All-22's could speed that up though you can just click through the plays you want. The only part that bugs me is the play diagramming feature that as far as I know, only exists on iPads, also the ability to snapshot the plays and save them off for later export to Photobucket etc. I see many bloggers have built articles around stills from the All-22 screen shots and diagramming (Matt Bowen etal).

Would love to make a gif of plays being debated without having to have a DVR of the game.

 

[MysterMatt]

So, one of my original gripes rang true; Willson is just as great as Sweezy in coaxing a head-tilt and blurted out curse word. He's just not ready for prime time, period. I REALLY wish they'd ditch the need to get cute with him, like REALLY.

I'm pretty much sick of all the "cute" we seem to be attempting almost all season long, but when are practically averaging 10 yards a run on BASIC running plays against Indy, it gets really annoying. I've no idea why we messed with anything else when we didn't need to.

I'm no coach, and maybe Bevell was seeing something the rest of us weren't, but why we aren't simplifying things and letting our best players just make plays is beyond me. We were treating the Indy D like they're Houston or something, and we didn't have to. At the very least, we need to wait for our best TE and OL to come back before we get too exotic.

I've had a couple days to settle down, but what bothers me most (STILL) about the loss to Indy, a fine team no doubt, is that we left so many gawddamned points on the field due to our own poor execution. I think Pete and Bevell need to face reality and accept that the 2nd stringers we have out there aren't ready to deal with the pressure that's being put on them.

 

[HansGruber]

So, one of my original gripes rang true; Willson is just as great as Sweezy in coaxing a head-tilt and blurted out curse word. He's just not ready for prime time, period. I REALLY wish they'd ditch the need to get cute with him, like REALLY.

I'm pretty much sick of all the "cute" we seem to be attempting almost all season long, but when are practically averaging 10 yards a run on BASIC running plays against Indy, it gets really annoying. I've no idea why we messed with anything else when we didn't need to.

I'm no coach, and maybe Bevell was seeing something the rest of us weren't, but why we aren't simplifying things and letting our best players just make plays is beyond me. We were treating the Indy D like they're Houston or something, and we didn't have to. At the very least, we need to wait for our best TE and OL to come back before we get too exotic.

I've had a couple days to settle down, but what bothers me most (STILL) about the loss to Indy, a fine team no doubt, is that we left so many gawddamned points on the field due to our own poor execution. I think Pete and Bevell need to face reality and accept that the 2nd stringers we have out there aren't ready to deal with the pressure that's being put on them.

Completely in agreement with this.

I noticed against Indy and Houston that we are running TONS of plays with 4 WRs and only Marshawn in the backfield, often lining up to the right/left of Wilson in the shotgun in a "read option" formation.

Marshawn was absolutely destroying the Indy defense, but we only run the ball 6 times in the second half? WTF?? We've got 3 backups on the OL, and we're running 4-WR sets on almost every down? I just don't get it. Am really unimpressed with Bevell so far this season. Had Lynch gotten a dozen or so runs in the second half, we'd have won that game handily.

 

[Tical21]

Great post! Just a couple quick things. We don't run read-option. We either run a dive or a keep. We have taken the read away from Russell. I know it is very nitpicky of me, but it has lately become a pet peeve of mine, much like an English teacher hates to read imperfect grammar. Right now I despise seeing the words "Read-option" when talking about the Seahawks. We haven't run a read-option all year. We're hoping to run the give until they stop it consistently, or crash it so hard consistently that we'll get a free first down later when Russell keeps it. They use the give to setup the keep, but it is all determined in the huddle. If I am wrong, Russell is the worst read-option QB in the history of read-option QB's, making bad read after bad read, all season long.

The "spy" isn't usually a spy at all, although they did deploy one some of the time. What you are seeing when Wilson gets chased by an ILB in the read-option game usually isn't a spy. It is just assigning a guy to the QB in read-option plays. The outside LB/DE crashes hard on the back, the ILB scrapes to the outside. Most teams are defending the read-option look in this way and have become very effective. But if you were to see a more traditional pass, that LB usually wouldn't have a "spy" responsibility.

Also, we are atrocious out of empty or 4 WR sets. Wilson appears to have too much on his plate. You give him this many options to get rid of the ball quickly, and we never execute it right. More often than not, Wilson ends up holding onto the ball. I don't know if it is poor design, or if Wilson just doesn't want to pull the trigger in the quick game, but if you've got 4/5 receivers out there, and the defense is sending 5/6, you've got to get rid of it quickly. You just have to. And we are absolutely horrible at it. Wilson can make his magic more often than he should have to, but that is just no way to live.

 

[hawks4thewin]

I encourage any of you that can afford it to get NFL rewind the entire package so you can see all plays in the all 22 and endzone cameras that you don't see on tv. it will tell you Who is open who isn't, who fails etc.etc. then its all open to conjecture on WHAT is really going on because you have all the data. My wife loves it because she can totally get her head around what happened and why..

peace.

I have this and it is worth the subscription. I find it hard though to watch all the games before the next week's games roll around. The condensed version is cool and a split view of the All-22's could speed that up though you can just click through the plays you want. The only part that bugs me is the play diagramming feature that as far as I know, only exists on iPads, also the ability to snapshot the plays and save them off for later export to Photobucket etc. I see many bloggers have built articles around stills from the All-22 screen shots and diagramming (Matt Bowen etal).

Would love to make a gif of plays being debated without having to have a DVR of the game.

I will try it on my windows tablet tonight, i haven't tried that feature yet...

 

[Scottemojo]

Great post! Just a couple quick things. We don't run read-option. We either run a dive or a keep. We have taken the read away from Russell. I know it is very nitpicky of me, but it has lately become a pet peeve of mine, much like an English teacher hates to read imperfect grammar. Right now I despise seeing the words "Read-option" when talking about the Seahawks. We haven't run a read-option all year. We're hoping to run the give until they stop it consistently, or crash it so hard consistently that we'll get a free first down later when Russell keeps it. They use the give to setup the keep, but it is all determined in the huddle. If I am wrong, Russell is the worst read-option QB in the history of read-option QB's, making bad read after bad read, all season long.

The "spy" isn't usually a spy at all, although they did deploy one some of the time. What you are seeing when Wilson gets chased by an ILB in the read-option game usually isn't a spy. It is just assigning a guy to the QB in read-option plays. The outside LB/DE crashes hard on the back, the ILB scrapes to the outside. Most teams are defending the read-option look in this way and have become very effective. But if you were to see a more traditional pass, that LB usually wouldn't have a "spy" responsibility.

Also, we are atrocious out of empty or 4 WR sets. Wilson appears to have too much on his plate. You give him this many options to get rid of the ball quickly, and we never execute it right. More often than not, Wilson ends up holding onto the ball. I don't know if it is poor design, or if Wilson just doesn't want to pull the trigger in the quick game, but if you've got 4/5 receivers out there, and the defense is sending 5/6, you've got to get rid of it quickly. You just have to. And we are absolutely horrible at it. Wilson can make his magic more often than he should have to, but that is just no way to live.

I know read option look is more accurate, though I think they are mixing gives, keeps, and real options from the same look. I also know scrape the safety or linebacker is a more accurate way to describe how they are assigning a player to take Russell from the read option look, but i thought people would understand spy a little bit better. Spy is a pretty common term for a player assigned to track a mobile QB, right?

Just my two cents on formations: We sting from the I formation, Lynch does not trust anyone we have put there. When the FB flanks the QB, offset to Lynch, we have run well. very well.

4 WR and empty are bad for us because they license defenses to blitz. It has long been my opinion that the best way to beat blitzes is to run routes right behind them, but that just isn't something our offense does much of. Russell's worst numbers last year were vs blitz, and I am guessing that is unchanged this year. I am assuming some of that is what you meant by quick game. Bevell's quick game seems to mostly consist of a few one step drop quick hitters if the DB is playing off coverage.

 

[Tical21]

Great post! Just a couple quick things. We don't run read-option. We either run a dive or a keep. We have taken the read away from Russell. I know it is very nitpicky of me, but it has lately become a pet peeve of mine, much like an English teacher hates to read imperfect grammar. Right now I despise seeing the words "Read-option" when talking about the Seahawks. We haven't run a read-option all year. We're hoping to run the give until they stop it consistently, or crash it so hard consistently that we'll get a free first down later when Russell keeps it. They use the give to setup the keep, but it is all determined in the huddle. If I am wrong, Russell is the worst read-option QB in the history of read-option QB's, making bad read after bad read, all season long.

The "spy" isn't usually a spy at all, although they did deploy one some of the time. What you are seeing when Wilson gets chased by an ILB in the read-option game usually isn't a spy. It is just assigning a guy to the QB in read-option plays. The outside LB/DE crashes hard on the back, the ILB scrapes to the outside. Most teams are defending the read-option look in this way and have become very effective. But if you were to see a more traditional pass, that LB usually wouldn't have a "spy" responsibility.

Also, we are atrocious out of empty or 4 WR sets. Wilson appears to have too much on his plate. You give him this many options to get rid of the ball quickly, and we never execute it right. More often than not, Wilson ends up holding onto the ball. I don't know if it is poor design, or if Wilson just doesn't want to pull the trigger in the quick game, but if you've got 4/5 receivers out there, and the defense is sending 5/6, you've got to get rid of it quickly. You just have to. And we are absolutely horrible at it. Wilson can make his magic more often than he should have to, but that is just no way to live.

I know read option look is more accurate, though I think they are mixing gives, keeps, and real options from the same look. I also know scrape the safety or linebacker is a more accurate way to describe how they are assigning a player to take Russell from the read option look, but i thought people would understand spy a little bit better. Spy is a pretty common term for a player assigned to track a mobile QB, right?

Just my two cents on formations: We sting from the I formation, Lynch does not trust anyone we have put there. When the FB flanks the QB, offset to Lynch, we have run well. very well.

4 WR and empty are bad for us because they license defenses to blitz. It has long been my opinion that the best way to beat blitzes is to run routes right behind them, but that just isn't something our offense does much of. Russell's worst numbers last year were vs blitz, and I am guessing that is unchanged this year. I am assuming some of that is what you meant by quick game. Bevell's quick game seems to mostly consist of a few one step drop quick hitters if the DB is playing off coverage.

My bad dude, I didn't mean to come off like that. Rough day at work got all my panties in a bunch. I probably would have described it the same way. The one thing I do like about our I formation is, and forgive me if I'm wrong, I think we usually have pretty good success in the naked game out of it.

As far as the 4-wide set, we should be salivating when they blitz!! It really bothers me that we can't get a quick game going out of this, as it does you. We should be able to hit Tate on something quick, and then if you make one guy miss, you should be able to take it a long ways. You should be able to get single coverage for Rice/Kearse down the field. You should be able to hit quick posts/corners to the TE's. You would think Russell would be great at making people pay for blitzing when he has so many options out there in routes. Right now, he usually pauses, reads the rush, makes a guy miss, and then tries to make a play. I just can't believe we can continue to have consistent success like this. Pre-snap, he pauses. He seems to identify that they're sending a lot of people, and identifies the coverage. So, this should signify to the offense that we've got to run something hot. Everybody should be on the same page. You should see Russell catch the snap and get rid of it quickly. But we almost never see that.

Do we have longer developing routes called when we shouldn't? Do we have quick routes and guys aren't winning their slants/hitches? Are they winning, but Russell doesn't read it correctly and/or pull the trigger? Or does Russell just prefer to hang onto the ball and dance? Something is wrong. All good teams I have seen attack this the same way, and we're not capable of doing it. I dunno.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

[Russell's worst numbers last year were vs blitz, and I am guessing that is unchanged this year. I am assuming some of that is what you meant by quick game.

And contrapositively, some of our biggest plays this year have come on blitz-beaters, largely to Lynch leaking out after chipping.

 

[Scottemojo]

Great post! Just a couple quick things. We don't run read-option. We either run a dive or a keep. We have taken the read away from Russell. I know it is very nitpicky of me, but it has lately become a pet peeve of mine, much like an English teacher hates to read imperfect grammar. Right now I despise seeing the words "Read-option" when talking about the Seahawks. We haven't run a read-option all year. We're hoping to run the give until they stop it consistently, or crash it so hard consistently that we'll get a free first down later when Russell keeps it. They use the give to setup the keep, but it is all determined in the huddle. If I am wrong, Russell is the worst read-option QB in the history of read-option QB's, making bad read after bad read, all season long.

The "spy" isn't usually a spy at all, although they did deploy one some of the time. What you are seeing when Wilson gets chased by an ILB in the read-option game usually isn't a spy. It is just assigning a guy to the QB in read-option plays. The outside LB/DE crashes hard on the back, the ILB scrapes to the outside. Most teams are defending the read-option look in this way and have become very effective. But if you were to see a more traditional pass, that LB usually wouldn't have a "spy" responsibility.

Also, we are atrocious out of empty or 4 WR sets. Wilson appears to have too much on his plate. You give him this many options to get rid of the ball quickly, and we never execute it right. More often than not, Wilson ends up holding onto the ball. I don't know if it is poor design, or if Wilson just doesn't want to pull the trigger in the quick game, but if you've got 4/5 receivers out there, and the defense is sending 5/6, you've got to get rid of it quickly. You just have to. And we are absolutely horrible at it. Wilson can make his magic more often than he should have to, but that is just no way to live.

I know read option look is more accurate, though I think they are mixing gives, keeps, and real options from the same look. I also know scrape the safety or linebacker is a more accurate way to describe how they are assigning a player to take Russell from the read option look, but i thought people would understand spy a little bit better. Spy is a pretty common term for a player assigned to track a mobile QB, right?

Just my two cents on formations: We sting from the I formation, Lynch does not trust anyone we have put there. When the FB flanks the QB, offset to Lynch, we have run well. very well.

4 WR and empty are bad for us because they license defenses to blitz. It has long been my opinion that the best way to beat blitzes is to run routes right behind them, but that just isn't something our offense does much of. Russell's worst numbers last year were vs blitz, and I am guessing that is unchanged this year. I am assuming some of that is what you meant by quick game. Bevell's quick game seems to mostly consist of a few one step drop quick hitters if the DB is playing off coverage.

My bad dude, I didn't mean to come off like that. Rough day at work got all my panties in a bunch. I probably would have described it the same way. The one thing I do like about our I formation is, and forgive me if I'm wrong, I think we usually have pretty good success in the naked game out of it.

As far as the 4-wide set, we should be salivating when they blitz!! It really bothers me that we can't get a quick game going out of this, as it does you. We should be able to hit Tate on something quick, and then if you make one guy miss, you should be able to take it a long ways. You should be able to get single coverage for Rice/Kearse down the field. You should be able to hit quick posts/corners to the TE's. You would think Russell would be great at making people pay for blitzing when he has so many options out there in routes. Right now, he usually pauses, reads the rush, makes a guy miss, and then tries to make a play. I just can't believe we can continue to have consistent success like this. Pre-snap, he pauses. He seems to identify that they're sending a lot of people, and identifies the coverage. So, this should signify to the offense that we've got to run something hot. Everybody should be on the same page. You should see Russell catch the snap and get rid of it quickly. But we almost never see that.

Do we have longer developing routes called when we shouldn't? Do we have quick routes and guys aren't winning their slants/hitches? Are they winning, but Russell doesn't read it correctly and/or pull the trigger? Or does Russell just prefer to hang onto the ball and dance? Something is wrong. All good teams I have seen attack this the same way, and we're not capable of doing it. I dunno.

I have this fear that when we have Harvin, it won't match expectations because our offense consists of so many plays deep and down the sidelines. I feel like Baldwin and Tate are awesome in space, sideline plays take away so much of their ability to make people miss. When I watch the 4 and 5 wr routes in all 22, I am so often stunned at the huge empty space in the middle of the field.

 

[Tical21]

I wonder, and I know I'll get torched for this, if this is at all height related.

 

[Scottemojo]

I wonder, and I know I'll get torched for this, if this is at all height related.

That is a legit wonder. I watch the Saints block so Brees has lanes, I don't see Seattle doing much of the same. Now, I have seen them block lanes for a quick slant, but it's rare. I wonder if the focus on play action makes it pretty much impossible to pass block lanes.

 

[seedhawk]

I wonder, and I know I'll get torched for this, if this is at all height related.

That is a legit wonder. I watch the Saints block so Brees has lanes, I don't see Seattle doing much of the same. Now, I have seen them block lanes for a quick slant, but it's rare. I wonder if the focus on play action makes it pretty much impossible to pass block lanes.

Be very carefull Scotty or you will P off all the Cable lovers. Watching things, and I don't care if NO runs zone or man, on pass plays, they really work hard at giving Brees lanes. With Cable as our coach, we work really hard at just not getting Wilson creamed, and half the time even that does not work.

We all need to just admit, Cables zone scheme is great for run, miserable for pass.

 

[pehawk]

Well, this is where Cable, Pete and John need to sync up a bit. All things being equal, the Saints would rather their stud OL be at Center and Guard over Tackle. They did just that. It even makes more sense here, given Wilson's ability to scramble.

Fart

 

[ivotuk]

Not sure you can narrow the definition of a spy down that narrow. One of the first times I heard the term was when a Spy was assigned to John Elway. Elway did a lot of passing but was a threat to run, as far as I can recall, I don't think he ever ran the read-option or anything similar.

I know different people view terms in different ways and it's probably just best when describing a play to go with mainstream use.

Jerrell Freeman seemed to be assigned as a spy on Russell Wilson and he played his assignment very well. But that's no surprise because #50 has been boost for the Colts defense with 43 tackles, 3 sacks and 2 forced fumbles. Looks like his 3 years in the CFL prepared him well for the jump to the big leagues.