When does Pete's seat start getting hot?

[Spin Doctor]

I'm curious. Jody Allen seems to have taken a really passive ownership role in the team. What would it take for Carroll to get fired?

Pete Carroll has bought a lot of goodwill with the ownership and the city of Seattle with his early success. That being said, since those Super Bowl runs all has not been right in paradise. Realistically he should have only two wins in the playoffs since 2015. Those wins were against a Matt Stafford playing on a sprained ankle, with a messed up throwing hand and a 40 year old McCown that was playing injured at the end of the game. Even still he was giving the Seahawks a run for their money. We have no quality wins since that time period.

Within the same time period Shanahan, McCarthy, Pederson, Arians, Belichick, McVay, LaFleur, Payton, Reid, Tomlin, Kubiak, Quinn, Ron Rivera, Vrabel, and Marrone all have better win percentages in the playoffs and just as many wins as Pete Carroll since 2020. Carroll is building a reputation as a guy that cannot get it done in the playoffs any longer. The fact that we really only have three wins (really should be two) within the span of 6 years with one of the better QB's in the league is alarming. Especially considering that many of these guys are jokes. 15 coaches, or close to half the league has fared better in the playoffs within the last 6 years. Within this time the Seahawks held teams were ranked number one by PFF's DVOA standards. We're under performing out talent levels in the post season.

In 2017 Carroll lost control of the team. He had to offload a lot of our star players, or just let them go. He purged the coaching staff and rebooted. In just 3 years we're back at the same place we were then. Players such as DK Metcalf, and Wilson questioning the offense, Wilson potentially trying to get out of Seattle if changes aren't made. According to Cowherd he knows of one more player that is questioning Seattle's offense, and Carroll's direction there.

Question being, what is the breaking point for Jody Allen and Seahawks management? Does it have to be a 4 win season, or does Wilson forcing his way out of Seattle, or another loss in the playoffs right away seal his fate? What is the threshold here.

 

[TOPHawk]

To me, Carroll has become our Mike McCarthy during his last few season in GB. Good enough to get to the playoffs, just not good enough to go all the way. That being said, even McCarthy was able to coach his team to the NFCCG.

What I would like to see:

- Give Carroll a choice. Drop head coach duties and remain as President of Football Operations or you are fired from both
- Hire Bieniemy (if he'd take the job). He's a good offensive mind for Russ and the Seahawks could use those extra 3rd-round picks
- Approach Russ to restructure his contract. Not extend, just restructure to open up cap room
- Extend and restructure Reed to lower 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Dunlop with a friendly 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Adams on a 3-year deal with ~$7M cap hit in 2021
- Approach Griffin to gauge how much he wants per season. If it's $10M+, let him walk
- Approach Sherman to gauge interest
- Bring back Irvin on a $3M-$4M deal
- Appeal to Wright to come back on a similar two-year deal w/ a team option for 2022
- Bring in one stud OL (Erving, Linsley, etc. Not Scherff or Thuney...they will be too expensive)
- Bring in several other reasonably priced OL and make them compete for positions
- RB. I'd love to kick the wheels on Fournette, but he's probably priced himself out of the budget w/ his playoff run. Looking at OTC.com, there are several good RBs that are FAs

The DL looked much better once Dunlop arrived. I'm not convinced it's a glaring weakness right now. If they could go out and grab an situational impact player at a reasonable price, great. Same with the secondary. The defense started to gel down the stretch and there are many young good players already on the roster

Other needs:
TE
DB (If Griffin walks)

Draft Strategy: Draft the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE AT EVERY PICK. Period.

 

[Welshers]

It doesn't. Pete will be here as long as he would like. He basically runs the organization at this point; Allen doesn't care. Pete is winning games and was loyal to Paul. That's all that matters to her.

 

[TheLegendOfBoom]

It doesn't. Pete will be here as long as he would like. He basically runs the organization at this point; Allen doesn't care. Pete is winning games and was loyal to Paul. That's all that matters to her.

I’m afraid this is exactly it.

Jody Allen doesn’t care.

As long as Carroll is here, I believe that’s “good enough” her.

I believe she by nature operates with, “But that’s, Pete Carroll.” And Carroll can do no wrong by her.

If anything, the only thing that can change her thinking with keeping Carroll, is Wilson publicly stating he will no longer play for the Seahawks if Carroll remains head coach.

Which will probably not happen..

Jody Allen is a very hands off person, and let the situation play out with Carroll running the organization.

Why else would she extend him? She don’t care about winning football games.

 

[knownone]

To me, Carroll has become our Mike McCarthy during his last few season in GB. Good enough to get to the playoffs, just not good enough to go all the way. That being said, even McCarthy was able to coach his team to the NFCCG.

What I would like to see:

- Give Carroll a choice. Drop head coach duties and remain as President of Football Operations or you are fired from both
- Hire Bieniemy (if he'd take the job). He's a good offensive mind for Russ and the Seahawks could use those extra 3rd-round picks
- Approach Russ to restructure his contract. Not extend, just restructure to open up cap room
- Extend and restructure Reed to lower 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Dunlop with a friendly 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Adams on a 3-year deal with ~$7M cap hit in 2021
- Approach Griffin to gauge how much he wants per season. If it's $10M+, let him walk
- Approach Sherman to gauge interest
- Bring back Irvin on a $3M-$4M deal
- Appeal to Wright to come back on a similar two-year deal w/ a team option for 2022
- Bring in one stud OL (Erving, Linsley, etc. Not Scherff or Thuney...they will be too expensive)
- Bring in several other reasonably priced OL and make them compete for positions
- RB. I'd love to kick the wheels on Fournette, but he's probably priced himself out of the budget w/ his playoff run. Looking at OTC.com, there are several good RBs that are FAs

The DL looked much better once Dunlop arrived. I'm not convinced it's a glaring weakness right now. If they could go out and grab an situational impact player at a reasonable price, great. Same with the secondary. The defense started to gel down the stretch and there are many young good players already on the roster

Other needs:
TE
DB (If Griffin walks)

Draft Strategy: Draft the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE AT EVERY PICK. Period.

The Mike McCarthy comparison doesn't apply to Pete, in my opinion. McCarthy was an offensive coach who struggled to take the pressure off Rodgers on offense and defense. For example, the Packers had 3 top 12 rushing seasons and 4 top 12 defenses' in 13 years with Rodgers.

In contrast, Pete's had 7 top 12 rushing offenses and 6 top 12 defense (5 of which are top 5) in 9 years with Russell. For an even more striking number, Russell has only played 1 season without a top 15 scoring defense. Rodgers had 8 seasons without one with McCarthy.

With that in mind, it's easy to see why you'd hesitate to move on from Pete in a similar manner as McCarthy. Pete has proven he's capable of putting together a winning team that is not reliant on one player to be successful. The same can't be said about McCarthy.

 

[John63]

To me, Carroll has become our Mike McCarthy during his last few season in GB. Good enough to get to the playoffs, just not good enough to go all the way. That being said, even McCarthy was able to coach his team to the NFCCG.

What I would like to see:

- Give Carroll a choice. Drop head coach duties and remain as President of Football Operations or you are fired from both
- Hire Bieniemy (if he'd take the job). He's a good offensive mind for Russ and the Seahawks could use those extra 3rd-round picks
- Approach Russ to restructure his contract. Not extend, just restructure to open up cap room
- Extend and restructure Reed to lower 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Dunlop with a friendly 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Adams on a 3-year deal with ~$7M cap hit in 2021
- Approach Griffin to gauge how much he wants per season. If it's $10M+, let him walk
- Approach Sherman to gauge interest
- Bring back Irvin on a $3M-$4M deal
- Appeal to Wright to come back on a similar two-year deal w/ a team option for 2022
- Bring in one stud OL (Erving, Linsley, etc. Not Scherff or Thuney...they will be too expensive)
- Bring in several other reasonably priced OL and make them compete for positions
- RB. I'd love to kick the wheels on Fournette, but he's probably priced himself out of the budget w/ his playoff run. Looking at OTC.com, there are several good RBs that are FAs

The DL looked much better once Dunlop arrived. I'm not convinced it's a glaring weakness right now. If they could go out and grab an situational impact player at a reasonable price, great. Same with the secondary. The defense started to gel down the stretch and there are many young good players already on the roster

Other needs:
TE
DB (If Griffin walks)

Draft Strategy: Draft the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE AT EVERY PICK. Period.

The Mike McCarthy comparison doesn't apply to Pete, in my opinion. McCarthy was an offensive coach who struggled to take the pressure off Rodgers on offense and defense. For example, the Packers had 3 top 12 rushing seasons and 4 top 12 defenses' in 13 years with Rodgers.

In contrast, Pete's had 7 top 12 rushing offenses and 6 top 12 defense (5 of which are top 5) in 9 years with Russell. For an even more striking number, Russell has only played 1 season without a top 15 scoring defense. Rodgers had 8 seasons without one with McCarthy.

With that in mind, it's easy to see why you'd hesitate to move on from Pete in a similar manner as McCarthy. Pete has proven he's capable of putting together a winning team that is not reliant on one player to be successful. The same can't be said about McCarthy.

really hmm lets see

prior to Seattle never a winning record

He got here in 2010 we were, we got Lynch in 2010
2010 7-9
2011 7-9
2012 when we got Wilson 11-5

Sound to me like his ability to win is wrapped around 1 player. HE does not have a winning record without Wilson. He does without Lynch, he does without the LOB just not without Wilson. So actually he has not proven he can win without Wilson. Not to say he can't just he has not proven it yet.

 

[Spin Doctor]

To me, Carroll has become our Mike McCarthy during his last few season in GB. Good enough to get to the playoffs, just not good enough to go all the way. That being said, even McCarthy was able to coach his team to the NFCCG.

What I would like to see:

- Give Carroll a choice. Drop head coach duties and remain as President of Football Operations or you are fired from both
- Hire Bieniemy (if he'd take the job). He's a good offensive mind for Russ and the Seahawks could use those extra 3rd-round picks
- Approach Russ to restructure his contract. Not extend, just restructure to open up cap room
- Extend and restructure Reed to lower 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Dunlop with a friendly 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Adams on a 3-year deal with ~$7M cap hit in 2021
- Approach Griffin to gauge how much he wants per season. If it's $10M+, let him walk
- Approach Sherman to gauge interest
- Bring back Irvin on a $3M-$4M deal
- Appeal to Wright to come back on a similar two-year deal w/ a team option for 2022
- Bring in one stud OL (Erving, Linsley, etc. Not Scherff or Thuney...they will be too expensive)
- Bring in several other reasonably priced OL and make them compete for positions
- RB. I'd love to kick the wheels on Fournette, but he's probably priced himself out of the budget w/ his playoff run. Looking at OTC.com, there are several good RBs that are FAs

The DL looked much better once Dunlop arrived. I'm not convinced it's a glaring weakness right now. If they could go out and grab an situational impact player at a reasonable price, great. Same with the secondary. The defense started to gel down the stretch and there are many young good players already on the roster

Other needs:
TE
DB (If Griffin walks)

Draft Strategy: Draft the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE AT EVERY PICK. Period.

The Mike McCarthy comparison doesn't apply to Pete, in my opinion. McCarthy was an offensive coach who struggled to take the pressure off Rodgers on offense and defense. For example, the Packers had 3 top 12 rushing seasons and 4 top 12 defenses' in 13 years with Rodgers.

In contrast, Pete's had 7 top 12 rushing offenses and 6 top 12 defense (5 of which are top 5) in 9 years with Russell. For an even more striking number, Russell has only played 1 season without a top 15 scoring defense. Rodgers had 8 seasons without one with McCarthy.

With that in mind, it's easy to see why you'd hesitate to move on from Pete in a similar manner as McCarthy. Pete has proven he's capable of putting together a winning team that is not reliant on one player to be successful. The same can't be said about McCarthy.

really hmm lets see

prior to Seattle never a winning record

He got here in 2010 we were, we got Lynch in 2010
2010 7-9
2011 7-9
2012 when we got Wilson 11-5

Sound to me like his ability to win is wrapped around 1 player. HE does not have a winning record without Wilson. He does without Lynch, he does without the LOB just not without Wilson. So actually he has not proven he can win without Wilson. Not to say he can't just he has not proven it yet.

He did go to the playoffs initially in New England, give him credit there, though it did end in flames. Also in 2010 and 2011 the Seahawks were in an utter state of disrepair. Carroll deserves credit for building those teams back up. Tim Ruskell left the franchise in a very sorry position. What Carroll did in 2010-2012 was quite possibly some of the best drafting I've ever seen. He leveraged his college inside information, and familiarity with the players to create one of the best teams that the NFL has ever seen. He created a culture of us vs. them, we all we got we all we need. What he was doing then resonated with many players and fans alike. He brought energy and he brought players that were pissed off and had chips on their shoulders. We were the team of misfits and unwanted toys that had something to prove.

The main problem here is that drafting was unsustainable. We had one of the youngest teams in the NFL, all on rookie contracts which allowed us to pursue guys like Zach Miller, Avril, Tony McDaniel and Michael Bennett -- all of which played a key role in propelling the Seahawks to a championship. Once our guys got paid we could no longer do this anymore.

The problem now is Carroll is fundamentally playing a different game. He doesn't have that same inside information, he has a whole roster full of guys that need to get paid, his drafting has regressed to the mean. As a result I think some flaws in his coaching strategy have been revealed, especially when he had to finally pay his QB big bucks.

 

[xray]

5-6 years ago ,when I figured that Carroll didn't give 2 chits for Wilson.

 

[nwHawk]

John, to be fair, the team he got from Mora and Tim Ruskell has a crap show loaded with below average players.

I doubt too many coaches would have a winning record during their first or even second year of a rebuild so devoid of top talent. Let's not kid ourselves, Pete's influence lead directly to a championship roster, the LOB and the ONLY Super Bowl title in Hawks history. Russ nearly blew the chance to get to the second Sooper Bowl by throwing 4 interceptions in the NFC Championship game. Tell me how many QBs in playoff history have thrown for 4 ints and still won. Not many, if any. That speaks volumes about a defense leaving it on the field for the sake of the team. Russ may have thrown the game winning TD pass to Kearse to ultimately advance to the title game, but his game alone is not the reason it happened.

No question Wilson is a very good player, and I appreciate watching him work his magic, but this team as it's built right now is better suited to win without him than it was before he got here. I think we all can agree with that statement.

 

[knownone]

To me, Carroll has become our Mike McCarthy during his last few season in GB. Good enough to get to the playoffs, just not good enough to go all the way. That being said, even McCarthy was able to coach his team to the NFCCG.

What I would like to see:

- Give Carroll a choice. Drop head coach duties and remain as President of Football Operations or you are fired from both
- Hire Bieniemy (if he'd take the job). He's a good offensive mind for Russ and the Seahawks could use those extra 3rd-round picks
- Approach Russ to restructure his contract. Not extend, just restructure to open up cap room
- Extend and restructure Reed to lower 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Dunlop with a friendly 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Adams on a 3-year deal with ~$7M cap hit in 2021
- Approach Griffin to gauge how much he wants per season. If it's $10M+, let him walk
- Approach Sherman to gauge interest
- Bring back Irvin on a $3M-$4M deal
- Appeal to Wright to come back on a similar two-year deal w/ a team option for 2022
- Bring in one stud OL (Erving, Linsley, etc. Not Scherff or Thuney...they will be too expensive)
- Bring in several other reasonably priced OL and make them compete for positions
- RB. I'd love to kick the wheels on Fournette, but he's probably priced himself out of the budget w/ his playoff run. Looking at OTC.com, there are several good RBs that are FAs

The DL looked much better once Dunlop arrived. I'm not convinced it's a glaring weakness right now. If they could go out and grab an situational impact player at a reasonable price, great. Same with the secondary. The defense started to gel down the stretch and there are many young good players already on the roster

Other needs:
TE
DB (If Griffin walks)

Draft Strategy: Draft the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE AT EVERY PICK. Period.

The Mike McCarthy comparison doesn't apply to Pete, in my opinion. McCarthy was an offensive coach who struggled to take the pressure off Rodgers on offense and defense. For example, the Packers had 3 top 12 rushing seasons and 4 top 12 defenses' in 13 years with Rodgers.

In contrast, Pete's had 7 top 12 rushing offenses and 6 top 12 defense (5 of which are top 5) in 9 years with Russell. For an even more striking number, Russell has only played 1 season without a top 15 scoring defense. Rodgers had 8 seasons without one with McCarthy.

With that in mind, it's easy to see why you'd hesitate to move on from Pete in a similar manner as McCarthy. Pete has proven he's capable of putting together a winning team that is not reliant on one player to be successful. The same can't be said about McCarthy.

really hmm lets see

prior to Seattle never a winning record

He got here in 2010 we were, we got Lynch in 2010
2010 7-9
2011 7-9
2012 when we got Wilson 11-5

Sound to me like his ability to win is wrapped around 1 player. HE does not have a winning record without Wilson. He does without Lynch, he does without the LOB just not without Wilson. So actually he has not proven he can win without Wilson. Not to say he can't just he has not proven it yet.

Interesting logic. You might consider analyzing those seasons individually, as it may change your perception of those years.

For example, 2011 was one year into one of the most complete rebuilds in NFL history. We had the 28th ranked passing offense, our starting QB played half the season with a torn pectoral muscle, and missed two games. We were still just 16 points, in one-possesions-games, from being 12-4 that year. Keep in mind, this was Earl's second season as a starter, Kam's first season as a starter, both KJ and Sherman rookies seasons, and Richard didn't start until week 6. Oh, and that's Browner's first year on the team as well. We also got Wagner, Irvin, and Sweezy in 2012. Serious question, do you honestly think that team does not improve over time?

Also, Pete is 2-3 in the playoffs, as a head coach, without Wilson. Wilson is 1-3 without the LoB and an elite defense. I love Russ, but the idea that one of the great defenses of all time would struggle to make the playoffs is ridiculous levels of revisionist history.

 

[jammerhawk]

Wow it's always the same I hate Pete posters posting their negative agenda. Every thread is the same ol' same ol'.

Pete's seat isn't even close to getting hot. He enjoys the confidence of the ownership and management council created by Paul and enhanced by Jody. Pete does give a crap and wants to stay competitive. He's staying, & so is Wilson, the team will look different on O next year and be better.

All the I Hate Pete posts here won't change a damn thing except convincing a few gullible souls that Pete is the Devil when he isn't. BTW neither is Schneider's seat hot either his new contract is for year longer than Pete's. Bothe have time to blow up the team, if needed, and rebuild it. This management group has done it better here than ever before and is one of the best groups in the NFL.

Thing is blowing things up are clearly NOT needed, and around the league Seattle is seen as a good place to play with a progressive coach. That said there are things clearly in need of fixing to take the next step again. I love RW but agree with nwHawk.

 

[John63]

To me, Carroll has become our Mike McCarthy during his last few season in GB. Good enough to get to the playoffs, just not good enough to go all the way. That being said, even McCarthy was able to coach his team to the NFCCG.

What I would like to see:

- Give Carroll a choice. Drop head coach duties and remain as President of Football Operations or you are fired from both
- Hire Bieniemy (if he'd take the job). He's a good offensive mind for Russ and the Seahawks could use those extra 3rd-round picks
- Approach Russ to restructure his contract. Not extend, just restructure to open up cap room
- Extend and restructure Reed to lower 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Dunlop with a friendly 2021 cap hit
- Extend and restructure Adams on a 3-year deal with ~$7M cap hit in 2021
- Approach Griffin to gauge how much he wants per season. If it's $10M+, let him walk
- Approach Sherman to gauge interest
- Bring back Irvin on a $3M-$4M deal
- Appeal to Wright to come back on a similar two-year deal w/ a team option for 2022
- Bring in one stud OL (Erving, Linsley, etc. Not Scherff or Thuney...they will be too expensive)
- Bring in several other reasonably priced OL and make them compete for positions
- RB. I'd love to kick the wheels on Fournette, but he's probably priced himself out of the budget w/ his playoff run. Looking at OTC.com, there are several good RBs that are FAs

The DL looked much better once Dunlop arrived. I'm not convinced it's a glaring weakness right now. If they could go out and grab an situational impact player at a reasonable price, great. Same with the secondary. The defense started to gel down the stretch and there are many young good players already on the roster

Other needs:
TE
DB (If Griffin walks)

Draft Strategy: Draft the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE AT EVERY PICK. Period.

The Mike McCarthy comparison doesn't apply to Pete, in my opinion. McCarthy was an offensive coach who struggled to take the pressure off Rodgers on offense and defense. For example, the Packers had 3 top 12 rushing seasons and 4 top 12 defenses' in 13 years with Rodgers.

In contrast, Pete's had 7 top 12 rushing offenses and 6 top 12 defense (5 of which are top 5) in 9 years with Russell. For an even more striking number, Russell has only played 1 season without a top 15 scoring defense. Rodgers had 8 seasons without one with McCarthy.

With that in mind, it's easy to see why you'd hesitate to move on from Pete in a similar manner as McCarthy. Pete has proven he's capable of putting together a winning team that is not reliant on one player to be successful. The same can't be said about McCarthy.

really hmm lets see

prior to Seattle never a winning record

He got here in 2010 we were, we got Lynch in 2010
2010 7-9
2011 7-9
2012 when we got Wilson 11-5

Sound to me like his ability to win is wrapped around 1 player. HE does not have a winning record without Wilson. He does without Lynch, he does without the LOB just not without Wilson. So actually he has not proven he can win without Wilson. Not to say he can't just he has not proven it yet.

Interesting logic. You might consider analyzing those seasons individually, as it may change your perception of those years.

For example, 2011 was one year into one of the most complete rebuilds in NFL history. We had the 28th ranked passing offense, our starting QB played half the season with a torn pectoral muscle, and missed two games. We were still just 16 points, in one-possesions-games, from being 12-4 that year. Keep in mind, this was Earl's second season as a starter, Kam's first season as a starter, both KJ and Sherman rookies seasons, and Richard didn't start until week 6. Oh, and that's Browner's first year on the team as well. We also got Wagner, Irvin, and Sweezy in 2012. Serious question, do you honestly think that team does not improve over time?

Also, Pete is 2-3 in the playoffs, as a head coach, without Wilson. Wilson is 1-3 without the LoB and an elite defense. I love Russ, but the idea that one of the great defenses of all time would struggle to make the playoffs is ridiculous levels of revisionist history.

What is pc without Wilson enough said.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Wow it's always the same I hate Pete posters posting their negative agenda. Every thread is the same ol' same ol'.

Pete's seat isn't even close to getting hot. He enjoys the confidence of the ownership and management council created by Paul and enhanced by Jody. Pete does give a crap and wants to stay competitive. He's staying, & so is Wilson, the team will look different on O next year and be better.

All the I Hate Pete posts here won't change a damn thing except convincing a few gullible souls that Pete is the Devil when he isn't. BTW neither is Schneider's seat hot either his new contract is for year longer than Pete's. Bothe have time to blow up the team, if needed, and rebuild it. This management group has done it better here than ever before and is one of the best groups in the NFL.

Thing is blowing things up are clearly NOT needed, and around the league Seattle is seen as a good place to play with a progressive coach. That said there are things clearly in need of fixing to take the next step again. I love RW but agree with nwHawk.

**the previous administration was on of the best groups in the NFL**. The owner of the Seahawks Paul Allen is no longer around. We can't say definitively how good or bad Jody Allen is as owner of the Seahawks. Ultimately she's the one that has the final say in every and all decisions. We haven't seen any of her hires for coaches, or any definitive action on her part. We cannot say with any certainty how good or bad her management is.

As far as Carroll goes, there are some legitimate problems with him as a head coach. I've outlined them, and to be quite frank with you, I want him gone. He's done all he is going to do as a Seahawk. I guarantee you he will never even touch so much as another NFC Championship game as head coach.

I appreciate the man for what he's done, but the game has passed him by. I will look back on most of his career here fondly. That being said, I don't think he is capable of anymore here, he has peaked.

 

[mistaowen]

I think his seat gets hot when this Russell stuff hits a tipping point. How many successful teams move on from their franchise QB hitting their prime because he wants to be more involved and the HC wants a vanilla low-score style? You simply don't move on from a guy who spent his entire career on this team who has MVP qualities, you build around him.

Pete isn't joking when he said a 16-13 win is what he'd prefer to see. Defense, ball control, risk adverse, run game that wears down the team by the 4th and you go win at the end. We've seen this style can compete with really anyone but also loses some stinkers. And then when you go against some really well coached teams who know what you're doing, they get blown out without a historic defense. I'm sure Russell realizes this.

Pete is a tremendous culture builder with a blueprint for great defense. Dunlap filling in the crucial LEO role was such a season changer. It's also not surprising at this point to see many former players share the same sentiment about the program.

Now the offense needs to be run by the new OC with Russell having a ton of say in it. I fear if that doesn't happen, Russ is looking to go play for another team. And there's probably 29 other teams who would love to get him.

 

[hawksfansince90]

Pete should have been fired over SB Int. How can anyone take anything he says seriously after that beyond me. Hawks have been so mediocre at best since that very moment which team has never recovered from. 12's and Seattle media types like Aaron Levine kiss his ass. Mommy, i'm sure will remove this post as well the truth hurts about Smiling Pete and what he's done to Hawks.

 

[knownone]

The Mike McCarthy comparison doesn't apply to Pete, in my opinion. McCarthy was an offensive coach who struggled to take the pressure off Rodgers on offense and defense. For example, the Packers had 3 top 12 rushing seasons and 4 top 12 defenses' in 13 years with Rodgers.

In contrast, Pete's had 7 top 12 rushing offenses and 6 top 12 defense (5 of which are top 5) in 9 years with Russell. For an even more striking number, Russell has only played 1 season without a top 15 scoring defense. Rodgers had 8 seasons without one with McCarthy.

With that in mind, it's easy to see why you'd hesitate to move on from Pete in a similar manner as McCarthy. Pete has proven he's capable of putting together a winning team that is not reliant on one player to be successful. The same can't be said about McCarthy.

really hmm lets see

prior to Seattle never a winning record

He got here in 2010 we were, we got Lynch in 2010
2010 7-9
2011 7-9
2012 when we got Wilson 11-5

Sound to me like his ability to win is wrapped around 1 player. HE does not have a winning record without Wilson. He does without Lynch, he does without the LOB just not without Wilson. So actually he has not proven he can win without Wilson. Not to say he can't just he has not proven it yet.

Interesting logic. You might consider analyzing those seasons individually, as it may change your perception of those years.

For example, 2011 was one year into one of the most complete rebuilds in NFL history. We had the 28th ranked passing offense, our starting QB played half the season with a torn pectoral muscle, and missed two games. We were still just 16 points, in one-possesions-games, from being 12-4 that year. Keep in mind, this was Earl's second season as a starter, Kam's first season as a starter, both KJ and Sherman rookies seasons, and Richard didn't start until week 6. Oh, and that's Browner's first year on the team as well. We also got Wagner, Irvin, and Sweezy in 2012. Serious question, do you honestly think that team does not improve over time?

Also, Pete is 2-3 in the playoffs, as a head coach, without Wilson. Wilson is 1-3 without the LoB and an elite defense. I love Russ, but the idea that one of the great defenses of all time would struggle to make the playoffs is ridiculous levels of revisionist history.

What is pc without Wilson enough said.

A hall of fame coach? I'm glad we agree.

 

[OrangeGravy]

I think the question everyone wants to know is, what is John63 gonna do when Russell forces his way out either this year or next? Will he stay or go with him?

 

[chris98251]

Paul was hands off also, he paid attention behind the scenes and in his later years after the Super Bowl win was much more visible. He always was involved and sat at the table when it came to big contracts.

Jody has representatives that report to her as well and I am sure she is involved, just not publicly. First and Goal and Vulcan all are part of the top end Management, always have been.

 

[Forthewin]

Dude ain't going no where! Who is a proven Super Bowl winner that is available? Is he going to give up or change the way his does his duties...NO! Let it go!

 

[Seahawk_Dan]

Dude ain't going no where! Who is a proven Super Bowl winner that is available? Is he going to give up or change the way his does his duties...NO! Let it go!

Eight years ago. That was eight years ago. Since then Pete hasn't gotten the team past the Divisional Round of the playoffs. How long can Pete, or others, cash in on the success of yesterday until the excuse becomes hollow and meaningless?