Seahawks sign Dion Jordan

[vin.couve12]

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[vin.couve12]

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[vin.couve12]

Only 2 tapes into this and I'm reminded why Oregon was never, ever going to win the big one. They're far too finesse and even believe in such. It just doesn't win championships. Sickens me how so many Hawk fans want to turn the Hawks into this passive finesse offense. ukeface:

Even though I'm not an Oregonian (and I used to like both Oregon teams), I could have actually gotten behind the Ducks if they weren't such a patty cake college football team. Everyone loves the fancy sexy flashy. You see the same thing in Basketball though with both players and teams. It's all about the bling bling vs doing it right.

 

[semiahmoo]

Only 2 tapes into this and I'm reminded why Oregon was never, ever going to win the big one. They're far too finesse and even believe in such. It just doesn't win championships. Sickens me how so many Hawk fans want to turn the Hawks into this passive finesse offense. ukeface:

Even though I'm not an Oregonian (and I used to like both Oregon teams), I could have actually gotten behind the Ducks if they weren't such a patty cake college football team. Everyone loves the fancy sexy flashy. You see the same thing in Basketball though with both players and teams. It's all about the bling bling vs doing it right.

Totally agree!

I caught an NBA game for the first time in a long time recently. It was horrible. Just run and gun. Almost no defense. No boxing out. No low post. Refs calling little wimp fouls. Run n gun nonsense.

You put any team today up against the 86 Celtics and they would have their asses handed to them big time.(That's with refs not calling ticky-tack nothing fouls but allowing a bit of thump n bump.) First, players today would be stunned to have someone playing defense. Second, they'd get hammered in the low post. Third, it would be an avalanche of fundamental skills of which these players today have so little.

I know it sounds like grumpy old man talk, but I'm not that old, and these players today are great athletes for sure, but they can't play real basketball. It's all playground BS. D them up so they don't just stop and pop from behind the arc. Then knock em down when they try to dribble down the lane or go for lob pass #3000.

They could learn to play real basketball but it would take them a couple seasons to adjust. Right now, the game is total garbage. Amazed they can market it like they do.

 

[Uncle Si]

What?

 

[vin.couve12]

Yeah, I should probably try and throw an "I'm sorry" out there and I actually am. I wanted Oregon to win one early on, but the football philosophy was a little off and too centered around the pass game. Not unlike a lot of NFL teams, but true is true. Too much finesse, and if the Hawks go that way, they'll be in the same boat eventually. On topic, however, I'm reminded why I thought he was an OLB with weight and muscle vs an actual DE. Even playing SLB trying to collapse an edge, he needs work. He avoids going head up a lot and even runs himself wide on run downs. This is not a DE and 275 won't make him one. Now, 260 and we can talk about SLB.

 

[JSeahawks]

Yeah, I should probably try and throw an "I'm sorry" out there and I actually am. I wanted Oregon to win one early on, but the football philosophy was a little off and too centered around the pass game. Not unlike a lot of NFL teams, but true is true.

They lead the conference in rushing for like a decade straight before this year.

 

[vin.couve12]

Yeah, I should probably try and throw an "I'm sorry" out there and I actually am. I wanted Oregon to win one early on, but the football philosophy was a little off and too centered around the pass game. Not unlike a lot of NFL teams, but true is true.

They lead the conference in rushing for like a decade straight before this year.

Yep, I know. Largely by confusing young minds with misdirection. College and Pro is different and the team that emulates the pro game better wins. Granted, a lot of the college game has made its way to the NFL, but there's a baseline there that can't be crossed if you want to win it all.

Patriots/Brady are an anomaly, if you want to go that route.

 

[mikeak]

]

Woah, I cant imagine it is anything other than a one year, vet minimum deal. The guy has not played a snap in two years and been suspended multiple times. Besides the fact of being horrible when he did play.

This is not the NBA. If it was I would agree with you

Again if you have reasonable money for a good player in year 2 and 3 non-guaranteed and he turns into the star he was supposed to be you are golden.

If he turns into a bum you cut him at zero cost

Alternative is a one year deal, he turns into the star you hoped for and......you can't afford him next year

 

[DJrmb]

]

Woah, I cant imagine it is anything other than a one year, vet minimum deal. The guy has not played a snap in two years and been suspended multiple times. Besides the fact of being horrible when he did play.

This is not the NBA. If it was I would agree with you

Again if you have reasonable money for a good player in year 2 and 3 non-guaranteed and he turns into the star he was supposed to be you are golden.

If he turns into a bum you cut him at zero cost

Alternative is a one year deal, he turns into the star you hoped for and......you can't afford him next year

You must have a really low opinion on the intelligence of NFL players.

This isn't Madden football on your Xbox. Even if the players are as stupid as you seem to believe they are, most of them have agents that do the business side for them. Players that take prove it deals sign one year deals because that's the smartest thing for them to do. You can't force players to take the multi year crap deals you want them to sign just because you want to hold onto them for cheap if they happen to work out. The only way that you could force a player to take the deals you are wanting is if Seattle is the only team willing to give them a deal. Dion Jordan is not that. Probably 10+ teams would have thrown him a 1 year deal to kick the tires on him. Same with most of the other 1 year deals Seattle has done this offseason. The players do not want to sign multi year deals locking them into crappy money. NFL players didn't get to the NFL without being confident in themselves. They all believe that they just need 1 good year and they can prove they are worth a big deal.

Can you even name a deal like you're suggesting? What player that was looking for a prove it deal 1-signed a multi year team friendly deal and 2-stuck with it and didn't ask for more money because they outperformed their contract?

 

[mikeak]

If you read my original post I said $6-7 million for year 2 and 3

That is not a crap deal. It is a solid number that if the player sucks he won't come close but he wouldn't in FA after a one year deal anyways. If he is a superstar sure he could have gotten more, but being put in a top notch organization that has a viable plan for him is worth more to him

Maybe it is less than $6-7M but to just hand out one year contracts is bad for he organization. There is very limited long term upside. What are we a farm team?

You can be fair to both sides and have a deal that works both ways. People here seem stuck on 1 year deals being the only way to go

 

[Popeyejones]

If you read my original post I said $6-7 million for year 2 and 3

That is not a crap deal. It is a solid number that if the player sucks he won't come close but he wouldn't in FA after a one year deal anyways. If he is a superstar sure he could have gotten more, but being put in a top notch organization that has a viable plan for him is worth more to him

Maybe it is less than $6-7M but to just hand out one year contracts is bad for he organization. There is very limited long term upside. What are we a farm team?

You can be fair to both sides and have a deal that works both ways. People here seem stuck on 1 year deals being the only way to go

If that 6-7 million are team options for years 2 and 3 then you've got to give more money and more guaranteed money in year 1 to offset the uneven deal (you take on no risk, the player takes on risk) in years 2 and 3.

It's why multi-year deals always have guaranteed money after the first year so that both sides have to take on risk (unless you're an idiot like Okung and think you don't need an agent :lol: )

For the player taking on this risk you seem to be inserting in the privilege of being locked into a "top notch" organization that is taking on no risk for your services. Indenturing yourself to an organization that has made zero commitment to you isn't a privilege at all.

TL;DR If you're asking a player to give up future years of teams competing for his services on the open market with literally no guarantees from you, you've got to give him more than you would for a 1 year prove it deal.

As for these being one year deals, I don't think the Seahawks are being dumb, I think they're showing what is already an obvious hand: they've got some unexpected left over cap room this year, so they're using it on one year flyers on draft busts who as of right now they don't think of as being part of their long-term plans. Nothing wrong with that at all, IMO, and it makes a lot of sense. TBH I don't think it will amount to much (which doesn't mean I won't be wrong, we all are all the time), but I really do like the strategy of it.

 

[Jimjones0384]

Yeah, with enough of these 'low risk, high reward' types, surely we will hit on one of them right? Right?

Your negativity is so predictable.

 

[nash72]

With a line as bad as ours, its almost a crime that we have left over cap money.

 

[nash72]

Yeah, with enough of these 'low risk, high reward' types, surely we will hit on one of them right? Right?

Your negativity is so predictable.

Wishing for something positive is something negative now? Reach much?

 

[Popeyejones]

With a line as bad as ours, its almost a crime that we have left over cap money.

Ehh, not really.

I think the Hawks are hoping that their more recent draft picks end up panning out and they want to have cap room in future years to resign them starting next off-season.

With the perceived paucity of quality O-lineman in the draft the market for O-lineman was insanely overheated and marginal players were getting big long-term money.

With more money tied up in the top six or so players on their roster than any other team in the NFL and hoping that some of the more recent draft picks are worthy of second deals (and maybe some 3rd deals for the stars who are starting to come up next year) the Hawks really couldn't play in that overheated market. If they thought they were down to the last year or two of their window they could have mortgaged the future, but I think they (rightly) think of their window as being a bit longer than that.

Put more succinctly, having extra cap money this year doesn't mean that having extra cap money in future tears (for a big FA signing this year) is part of their three year plan.

Also worth saying -- and I know some people here won't like this -- is that although obviously bad, I don't think the Hawks' O-line is as a bad as some people make it out to be. Wilson is simply the hardest QB to pass protect for in the NFL, and it makes his line look worse in pass-pro than it is. It's part of what makes him great, but it's a simple fact that's hard to avoid (knowing where your QB is and will be behind you and knowing he'll get the ball out quickly = easy pass protection, whereas not knowing where your QB is and will be behind you and not knowing he'll get the ball out quickly = hard pass protection). The Hawks RBs also, from my watch, left a lot of yards on the field last year. It doesn't mean the Hawks O-line isn't bad, but I do think Wilson's style of play and poor RB play last year made them look worse than they really are.

 

[ACES 13]

http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/seah ... on-jordan/

"The Seahawks are undoubtedly signing Jordan to a low-risk deal, likely for one year, in an attempt to revive his career."

 

[nash72]

With a line as bad as ours, its almost a crime that we have left over cap money.

Ehh, not really.

I think the Hawks are hoping that their more recent draft picks end up panning out and they want to have cap room in future years to resign them starting next off-season.

With the perceived paucity of quality O-lineman in the draft the market for O-lineman was insanely overheated and marginal players were getting big long-term money.

With more money tied up in the top six or so players on their roster than any other team in the NFL and hoping that some of the more recent draft picks are worthy of second deals (and maybe some 3rd deals for the stars who are starting to come up next year) the Hawks really couldn't play in that overheated market. If they thought they were down to the last year or two of their window they could have mortgaged the future, but I think they (rightly) think of their window as being a bit longer than that.

Put more succinctly, having extra cap money this year doesn't mean that having extra cap money in future tears (for a big FA signing this year) is part of their three year plan.

Good post and I fully understand where your coming from, but our biggest glaring issue is at left tackle. We did nothing to fix it. We signed a couple of bottom feeders that are better guards than tackles. I just wish we had been more aggressive in fixing the issue.

Also worth saying -- and I know some people here won't like this -- is that although obviously bad, I don't think the Hawks' O-line is as a bad as some people make it out to be. Wilson is simply the hardest QB to pass protect for in the NFL, and it makes his line look worse in pass-pro than it is. It's part of what makes him great, but it's a simple fact that's hard to avoid (knowing where your QB is and will be behind you and knowing he'll get the ball out quickly = easy pass protection, whereas not knowing where your QB is and will be behind you and not knowing he'll get the ball out quickly = hard pass protection). The Hawks RBs also, from my watch, left a lot of yards on the field last year. It doesn't mean the Hawks O-line isn't bad, but I do think Wilson's style of play and poor RB play last year made them look worse than they really are.

Yeah, I disagree with you here. I feel the line wasnt only bad, it was the worst Oline I have ever seen in the NFL period. There was so many times that the line just whiffed on people, it was scary (a lot of times, more than one lineman). I'll never forget the time against Arizona when Wilson got sacked by 5 people. I've never seen anything like that before. Make no mistake about it, Seattle will again have the worst line in the NFL this up coming season.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

...deleted. I don't want to get the thread off topic.

 

[mikeak]

Did you guys see this thread linked below? it is a really cool thread discussing the O-line........... having a hard time to see how Dion Jordan is related to Russell Wilson's sack total.......

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