Re: Graham - How come we don't do this?

[King Dog]

I was reading the USA Today article and was just wondering why we don't do this? Seems like we prefer to drop back and have Russell (or Russell prefers) to just start running around. Is it just because Russell can't see or is there another reason?
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... /75744378/

Graham:
"All my football's been played one way," Graham, the Pro Bowl tight end, told USA TODAY Sports on Friday. "I've never really had another system or anything like that. For us (in New Orleans), it was fifth step and the ball is out. You turn your head and the ball would be there.

"Here, for me, it's something that you have to constantly work on – just reminding yourself that, after you break out of your route, sometimes that's the beginning of the play and there's going to be another 5 seconds of running."

 

[mrt144]

I was reading the USA Today article and was just wondering why we don't do this? Seems like we prefer to drop back and have Russell (or Russell prefers) to just start running around. Is it just because Russell can't see or is there another reason?
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... /75744378/

Graham:
"All my football's been played one way," Graham, the Pro Bowl tight end, told USA TODAY Sports on Friday. "I've never really had another system or anything like that. For us (in New Orleans), it was fifth step and the ball is out. You turn your head and the ball would be there.

"Here, for me, it's something that you have to constantly work on – just reminding yourself that, after you break out of your route, sometimes that's the beginning of the play and there's going to be another 5 seconds of running."

It's literally everything. RW not pulling the trigger instinctually every play, OL going to hell forcing a scramble, the receivers themselves not looking at that 5th step, and the routes themselves limit awareness and don't leverage lateral movement and awareness across the field.

 

[Bigpumpkin]

It has baffled all of us here at .net.....why isn't the ball out by Russell's 3rd or 4th step?

 

[northseahawk]

Because Wilson can't see anything and won't blindly throw a pass. This is the reason high is a huge issue.

 

[chris98251]

I think it's on the play design and or direction given to him, I am sure this wasn't the case in college for him, if it was he would never have been drafted at all.

 

[Anthony!]

Okay first it is not a site issue at all, in college his oline man were huge he had no issue. If you read any article about this were they question Bevell or PC they both say Wilsons scrambling is part of the offense to them. They also over preach not taking risks, and there for your QB does not take many chances and will sometimes hesitate. Timing patterns or throwing before the receiver looks or is open is great but it also has a higher chance for problems. Add tot hat the pathetic pass protection and there you go. The reality is this passing offense is very very simple, with very simplistic route trees, Every expert has been saying this for year now. It works because people worry so much about Lynch and Wilson they always make a mistake or Wilson just does his scramble drill. Problem is our oline is to bad for this to work a lot, and Lynch has not been good. Our Wr cannot get open due to these simple route trees, unless Wilson scrambles. Our OC does not seem to have any reason to adapt or change anything or is not capable or is being told not to, or all 3.

The system in NO is different than ours. That systems has been molded around Bress and with a run game second, Our system is molded around run first. ITs all about the system being used and who it is built around. Hence why are oline has always been much better at run blocking then pass blocking. Want the passing game to get better it start by getting better pass protection, and then getting NFL caliber plays and route trees.

 

[bigskydoc]

Wait, the offensive line being better would allow Russ to pass faster? That just doesn't make sense.

BECAUSE Russ doesn't make the throws before the break, the line HAS to hold up longer than, say, New Orleans' line and therefore looks worse than it really is.

Defensive coordinators can scheme their rush and blitz around the knowledge that our pass plays take longer than average to develop. It's one of the reasons they get so much success with stunts and delayed blitzes, plenty of time to get to the QB before the ball comes out.

Standard disclaimer. I'm not saying the OL is top ten sans Russ, just saying they are better than they are ranked. I think they will be league average by the end of the season.

-bsd

 

[bigskydoc]

Graham's statement explains so much about why the season has started out the way it has and why he has been so underutilized in early games. Getting better though.

-bsd

 

[Anthony!]

Wait, the offensive line being better would allow Russ to pass faster? That just doesn't make sense.

BECAUSE Russ doesn't make the throws before the break, the line HAS to hold up longer than, say, New Orleans' line and therefore looks worse than it really is.

Defensive coordinators can scheme their rush and blitz around the knowledge that our pass plays take longer than average to develop. It's one of the reasons they get so much success with stunts and delayed blitzes, plenty of time to get to the QB before the ball comes out.

Standard disclaimer. I'm not saying the OL is top ten sans Russ, just saying they are better than they are ranked. I think they will be league average by the end of the season.

-bsd

First off you are assuming there are quick throws to be made, you really do not know we do to that every expert has said our route trees are not NFL caliber, they have said there is very rarely any hot reads, and very rarely any short routes. So you need a oline to be able to give your QB more than 2 seconds. IN addition all QBs no matter how big need throwing lanes, our line does not do a good job of giving those throwing lanes Now if you really think our oline is better than they are ranked you are fooling your self big time. Wilson is the most hit, hurried, chased, and sacked QB in the league and it is not close. You ant to put some of the blame on play calling or design fine, but that doe snt9o change the FACT this line is dead last in every oline ranking there is when it come sot pass blocking. That means the biggest issue is pass blocking

 

[Siouxhawk]

Wait, the offensive line being better would allow Russ to pass faster? That just doesn't make sense.

BECAUSE Russ doesn't make the throws before the break, the line HAS to hold up longer than, say, New Orleans' line and therefore looks worse than it really is.

Defensive coordinators can scheme their rush and blitz around the knowledge that our pass plays take longer than average to develop. It's one of the reasons they get so much success with stunts and delayed blitzes, plenty of time to get to the QB before the ball comes out.

Standard disclaimer. I'm not saying the OL is top ten sans Russ, just saying they are better than they are ranked. I think they will be league average by the end of the season.

-bsd

First off you are assuming there are quick throws to be made, you really do not know we do to that every expert has said our route trees are not NFL caliber, they have said there is very rarely any hot reads, and very rarely any short routes. So you need a oline to be able to give your QB more than 2 seconds. IN addition all QBs no matter how big need throwing lanes, our line does not do a good job of giving those throwing lanes Now if you really think our oline is better than they are ranked you are fooling your self big time. Wilson is the most hit, hurried, chased, and sacked QB in the league and it is not close. You ant to put some of the blame on play calling or design fine, but that doe snt9o change the FACT this line is dead last in every oline ranking there is when it come sot pass blocking. That means the biggest issue is pass blocking

Every expert has not said that. Only the ones you selectively remember in an attempt to prove your point.
There's not a thing wrong with our route trees. They just need to be executed better.

 

[GeekHawk]

BECAUSE Russ doesn't make the throws before the break, the line HAS to hold up longer than, say, New Orleans' line and therefore looks worse than it really is.

It's not physically possible for our O-line to look worse than it really is. Intermittently it looks slightly better than it really is.

 

[hawkfan68]

Found Bevell's route tree designs -


link to detailed explanation - http://footballtimes.org/Article.asp?ID=125

 

[Anthony!]

Found Bevell's route tree designs -


link to detailed explanation - http://footballtimes.org/Article.asp?ID=125

LOL looks like my sons pee wee football route trees

 

[scutterhawk]

Found Bevell's route tree designs -


link to detailed explanation - http://footballtimes.org/Article.asp?ID=125

Hmm.... Bevell's "route tree" looks a lot like a row of Telephone poles. :lol:

 

[Siouxhawk]

It always astounds me that a supposed Seahawk fan would rip a Seahawk coach on a Seahawk forum site. Nobody's must be riding the short yellow bus today.

 

[hawkfan68]

I'm astonished that certain folks think Seahawks coaches are above any criticism.

 

[Hawks46]

Graham's statement explains so much about why the season has started out the way it has and why he has been so underutilized in early games. Getting better though.

-bsd

Totally agree. Graham has never had a QB like Russell. Ever. So there's an adjustment period.

We've seen it start to get better, and I think it will continue.

 

[AROS]

It always astounds me that a supposed Seahawk fan would rip a Seahawk coach on a Seahawk forum site. Nobody's must be riding the short yellow bus today.

Good God you must be new.

 

[RiverDog]

I was reading the USA Today article and was just wondering why we don't do this? Seems like we prefer to drop back and have Russell (or Russell prefers) to just start running around. Is it just because Russell can't see or is there another reason?
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... /75744378/

Graham:
"All my football's been played one way," Graham, the Pro Bowl tight end, told USA TODAY Sports on Friday. "I've never really had another system or anything like that. For us (in New Orleans), it was fifth step and the ball is out. You turn your head and the ball would be there.

"Here, for me, it's something that you have to constantly work on – just reminding yourself that, after you break out of your route, sometimes that's the beginning of the play and there's going to be another 5 seconds of running."

Drew Brees isn't that much taller than Russell, so although I'm sure there are some instances where he can't see, I don't think that the primary reason is his lack of height. But there's been lots of times when Russell has been reluctant to let the ball go. Some have speculated that he'll pass up a 10-15 yard play because he's always looking for the big, 35-40 yarder.

As far as Graham is concerned, he's comparing Russell to Drew Brees, who is a lot different quarterback, and it's going to take some getting used to. Russell can extend plays a lot better than Brees can, so he's going to have to get used to the fact that the ball isn't always going to come out as quickly as it did when he played for the Saints and that there are a lot of times he's going to have to abort his route, sense the direction Russell is going to start scrambling, and start working to get open. Zach Miller had that sense, thus he was referred to as Russell's security blanket.

What's not working between the two of hem is the red zone plays. Graham was brought in here to help in that particular department and so far, we haven't been taking advantage of his 3"-9" height advantage, and I blame that on both Russell as well as Bevell. Russell needs to put more air under balls he throws to Graham, put it in a place where only he can get to it, and put him in a jump ball/basketball position where he can screen out his defender and elevate. Too many times Russell tries to drop it over his shoulder and hit him in stride like he would Kearse or Baldwin.

 

[RiverDog]

I was reading the USA Today article and was just wondering why we don't do this? Seems like we prefer to drop back and have Russell (or Russell prefers) to just start running around. Is it just because Russell can't see or is there another reason?
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf ... /75744378/

Graham:
"All my football's been played one way," Graham, the Pro Bowl tight end, told USA TODAY Sports on Friday. "I've never really had another system or anything like that. For us (in New Orleans), it was fifth step and the ball is out. You turn your head and the ball would be there.

"Here, for me, it's something that you have to constantly work on – just reminding yourself that, after you break out of your route, sometimes that's the beginning of the play and there's going to be another 5 seconds of running."

Drew Brees isn't that much taller than Russell, so although I'm sure there are some instances where he can't see, I don't think that the primary reason is his lack of height. But there's been lots of times when Russell has been reluctant to let the ball go. Some have speculated that he'll pass up a 10-15 yard play because he's always looking for the big, 35-40 yarder. It's clear to me that there's a lot of times where he's not taking what defenses are giving him.

As far as Graham is concerned, he's comparing Russell to Drew Brees, who is a lot different quarterback, and it's going to take some getting used to. Russell can extend plays a lot better than Brees can, so he's going to have to get used to the fact that the ball isn't always going to come out as quickly as it did when he played for the Saints and that there are a lot of times he's going to have to abort his route, sense the direction Russell is going to start scrambling, and start working to get open. Zach Miller had that sense, thus he was referred to as Russell's security blanket. Recently Graham has started doing some of that, so there is hope.

What's not working between the two of them is the red zone plays. Graham was brought in here to help in that particular department and so far, we haven't been taking advantage of his 3"-9" height advantage, and I blame that on both Russell as well as Bevell. Russell needs to put more air under balls he throws to Graham, put it in a place where only he can get to it, and put him in a jump ball/basketball position where he can screen out his defender and elevate. Too many times Russell tries to drop it over his shoulder and hit him in stride like he would Kearse or Baldwin.