Echoes of Seahawks past: Broncos fans ponder their glamorous and enigmatic quarterback

[Tamerlane]

Any of this look familiar?



Do you ever painfully recall your own recent fandom past? Straining to comprehend your expensive and enigmatic quarterback's limitations and decline, especially in the face of emerging defensive trends? Did you cope by blaming coaches, scheme, personnel?

Mostly I wish for peace and good will among all Seahawks. We've just moved beyond the polarizing 'late Russ' years and into the rebuilding phase -- saddled with $50m dead cap and an unsettled quarterback future, but also stocked with young player potential as well as plenty more draft and salary cap resources on the horizon. Nevertheless, I do want to take a moment to call out those who endlessly whined and complained over the years about 'Peteball' and the coaching staff. Blaming them for being the cause of Russ's sack-filled tenure, for supposedly 'clamping down' on middle field passes, and for seeking offensive balance allegedly not because Russ would benefit from it (thinking he doesn't thrive in a pass heavy two-deep safety world) but because of obsolete thinking.






I have no idea what lies ahead for the Seahawks or for Russ. Geno has so far outplayed his role of a 'bridge quarterback', as the front office again proves the doubters wrong, but will it last? Russ will surely have better days, especially if he eventually adopts a more realistic view of his own strengths and weaknesses, which he refused to do in Seattle.

No matter what happens next, though, it's now safe to say 'the results are in': the constipated offense we witnessed over recent years in Seattle, across different coordinators, seems to have moved straight to Denver in the trade. At just the same time, the constipation of the offense in Seattle has suddenly and correspondingly lifted. The middle field is open for business again; the chains are moving more easily; and as a consequence passing rates are way up, ironically opening up the conditions for explosive running, as in today's game.

I hope everyone else is enjoying the weird ride that is this season, and that some of you are as relieved as I am not to be rehashing the same old debates (this post excepted!) and caught in the eternal Loop of Russ.

 

[toffee]

You know who said it the best? Uncle Will, Dissly said after today's game: stop talking about THAT GUY, when he was asked about Russ.

Locker room has fully moved on.

 

[Recon_Hawk]

You know who said it the best? Uncle Will, Dissly said after today's game: stop talking about THAT GUY, when he was asked about Russ.

Locker room has fully moved on.

We've spent at least 5+ years debating Russell versus the coaching and offensive line play. We can actually follow up on our theories regarding the coaching philosophy, playcalling, offensive line, and QB play and you want to shut down that conversation?

Personally, I think those who stood behind the coaches and pointed out the challenges Russell brought to the team should have the chance to confirm what they've been saying all along was right. It wasn't Russell "in spite of Carroll" and for years it's been impossible to prove. Now we are seeing the truth and pointing it out to those who have been talking out of their ass for all these years.

 

[Cyrus12]

I saw Geno going down the sideline fist pumping his ol...seems the last guy here just threw them under the bus to lay blame for his own serious unfixable uncoachable limitations..Anyway its so nice to see this team playing like a team. The d is an outright disaster but the offence are looking like a cohesive group.

 

[DarkVictory23]

While this week isn't officially over yet (so the caveat that these stats don't include Niner/Rams from tonight), we had an interesting thread regarding stats after three weeks where I noted the following:

"On Offense, the Seahawks are:

4th in number of plays per drive, 8th for number of yards per drive, 5th for play time per drive, and 3rd for third down conversions.

This is a positive development when you consider where we were in these categories last year:

Last in plays per drive, 23rd for yards per drive, Last (by a lot) in play time per drive, and 23rd in third down conversions."


So, with the already added disclaimer that this week isn't over, a preview of where we stand now is:

4th (still) plays per drive
1st (!) in yards per drive
2nd (!) for time per drive
and 2nd (!) for third down conversions (even though Geno chokes whenever he has to make plays that matter /s)


And here is the thing regarding our scoring woes: We are still second from last in total number of drives (only the Rams have less, but they have one less game and therefore will surpass us tonight) and we are sixth from the bottom in terms of average starting field position.

In other words, if our defense could get a few more stops quicker and force a few more punts from the other end of the field, our offense could possibly become one of the best in the NFL at the rate we are at right now.

The turnaround (though we still need to note we are only 1/4 of the way into the season and there is a lot of football left) is amazing.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

It's like going back in a time machine.

 

[BamKam]

I have been checking out Broncos forums and it’s an echo chamber of everything the people who couldn’t criticize Russ are saying.

“The offensive line can’t block”

“The Wide Receivers aren’t getting open”

“Offense wasn’t the problem today it was the defense!”

“The offensive coordinator is terrible at his play calling!”

Maybe just MAYBE it might be the guy who is having the exact same issues on a completely different team that was even touted as Super Bowl Contenders? Nah, that would make way too much sense!

Can’t wait for the white knights to come in and say “get over it”

 

[MORGULON]

We've spent at least 5+ years debating Russell versus the coaching and offensive line play. We can actually follow up on our theories regarding the coaching philosophy, playcalling, offensive line, and QB play and you want to shut down that conversation?

Personally, I think those who stood behind the coaches and pointed out the challenges Russell brought to the team should have the chance to confirm what they've been saying all along was right. It wasn't Russell "in spite of Carroll" and for years it's been impossible to prove. Now we are seeing the truth and pointing it out to those who have been talking out of their ass for all these years.

I agree. I've never been a fan of #3. He always seemed to ignore intermediate routes that pick up first downs, and always held the ball too long putting the line in horrible positions (then the blame ) .

I've ALWAYS thought #3 came off as a bvllshite artist and came off fake. I would observe his teammates rolling their eyes or outright ignoring him. My wife couldn't believe that I could diss
the glorious, magical #3.

The final nail was when he came back way too soon from his broke finger , not because of "team"
but in spite of team. He didn't care . He probably wanted the t.v. experts to gush about how tough he
is and what a competitor !! Hero ball.

My guess is he didn't want Geno Smith to have ANY chance to upstage his grip on the starting job.
Seeing these unhappy bronco fans , who 2 months ago were laughing their asses off at stupid Seattle
fans is like a big shot of schadenfreude heroin.

 

[BlueTalon]

We've spent at least 5+ years debating Russell versus the coaching and offensive line play. We can actually follow up on our theories regarding the coaching philosophy, playcalling, offensive line, and QB play and you want to shut down that conversation?

Personally, I think those who stood behind the coaches and pointed out the challenges Russell brought to the team should have the chance to confirm what they've been saying all along was right. It wasn't Russell "in spite of Carroll" and for years it's been impossible to prove. Now we are seeing the truth and pointing it out to those who have been talking out of their ass for all these years.

The locker room has moved on. We are still free to enjoy some Schadenfreude heroin for as long as it gets us off.

 

[Recon_Hawk]

The locker room has moved on. We are still free to enjoy some Schadenfreude heroin for as long as it gets us off.

You can't really blame the fans tho. The player have known for years what the deal is with Russ and the offense. Us fans are just figuring it out.

 

[toffee]

I agree. I've never been a fan of #3. He always seemed to ignore intermediate routes that pick up first downs, and always held the ball too long putting the line in horrible positions (then the blame ) .

I've ALWAYS thought #3 came off as a bvllshite artist and came off fake. I would observe his teammates rolling their eyes or outright ignoring him. My wife couldn't believe that I could diss
the glorious, magical #3.

The final nail was when he came back way too soon from his broke finger , not because of "team"
but in spite of team. He didn't care . He probably wanted the t.v. experts to gush about how tough he
is and what a competitor !! Hero ball.

My guess is he didn't want Geno Smith to have ANY chance to upstage his grip on the starting job.
Seeing these unhappy bronco fans , who 2 months ago were laughing their asses off at stupid Seattle
fans is like a big shot of schadenfreude heroin.

Russ the HOFer is currently ranked at #20 on PFF. the little Geno fella that Russ rushed back to deny? Geno "write back" Smith is #1. Don't believe in PFF?

OK let's try ESPN, by their QBR, Russ is #21, Geno is #6, ouch, by pure passing? Russ is #15 on RTG, Geno is #3.

It's almost like a movie,

 

[HawkRiderFan]

You can't really blame the fans tho. The player have known for years what the deal is with Russ and the offense. Us fans are just figuring it out.

Re. the players part, it ticked me off at the time, but now I am seeing Sherm's comments after he got cut of "the team losing their way" in a new light.

 

[MORGULON]

Re. the players part, it ticked me off at the time, but now I am seeing Sherm's comments after he got cut of "the team losing their way" in a new light.

i was upset too but I kind of see things differently now

 

[Throwdown]

I see no lies

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

it’s crazy to me, and I don’t know if it’s just hopeful thinking for the price the Broncos paid , is the contingent of Broncos fans on Twitter that are making excuses for Russ by placing the blame on everyone else. Sort of like we did here. A lot of us tried to tell ‘em prior to the season, yet they believed otherwise that the Seahawks were at fault for Russ’s failures, Pete’s system held him back, he had no weapons, no offensive line, and now some of those fans are backtracking on the team around Russ despite him pretty much being the same QB, if not worse than the one we were frustrated with despite the heroic tendencies to save the day and keep games close. Even though more often than not it was his own contributions that put him in the hole, with his 3 and out, all or nothing style of offense, he had to dig the team out of.

Those fans aren’t necessarily wrong though too as I can see Russ going on a run of success in the next 6 weeks now that he lost Javonte. Whether or not that will translate to wins is hard to say but he’ll probably put up some gaudy numbers now that the crux of the running game will be on Melvin Ingram for the time being.

However, I can also see the negatives of him putting up those numbers, Broncos at some point aren’t going to catch fire and burn bright into the post-season. In my opinion they will hit it a wall and it hard sometime in the ladder half of the season. Their WRs and Oline are going to get banged up and more and more tired after all the secondary effort and energy they have to put out with the demands of hero ball. That defense will slowly crumble away and exhaust themselves with more opportunities to be exposed to injuries the more they have to be on the field especially when they are tired. Broncos D is great but I don’t think they necessarily have the depth or experience to withstand full on Heroball especially when it goes wrong and Russ starts to turn the ball over along with Ingram.

Furthermore, Russ is an elite gamer, no doubt, for good and for bad, the more he has to rely on his legs and his arm, the more he takes the hits and the more he utilizes his energy to try to spin magic, he’s going to feel it, he’s gonna hit the wall, too. He’s 33 going on 34, there’s a reason he stated he doesn’t want to have to carry his team, because the physicality and preparation to be omnipotent, physically and mentally, with all of his social obligations and Hollywood ambitions has finally caught up to him.

And perhaps the biggest handicap no one talks about, Russ historically hasn’t been a good QB in cold weather/bad weather games. When the season starts to turn and gets colder and colder it’s going to be worse in Denver than it was in Seattle. And that is only going to amplify the natural regression that he and his team will face over the demands of the season and when their schedule gets more difficult, and when winning games start to feel and get more and more pressurized .

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

I see no lies

We might have to take that with a grain of salt because that’s Tical’s avatar photo (perhaps confirmed with a Zeb post)…even with the very best of Russ, Tic took a lot of flack pointing out Wilson’s non-elite flaws and how that and his contracts would eventually hold the team back. Even though he was pretty accurate.

 

[Throwdown]

We might have to take that with a grain of salt because that’s Tical’s avatar photo (perhaps confirmed with a Zeb post)…even with the very best of Russ, Tic took a lot of flack pointing out Wilson’s non-elite flaws and how that and his contracts would eventually hold the team back. Even though he was pretty accurate.

It is @Tical21

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

It is @Tical21

Man, looking back even early on Tical was pretty woke on Wilson.

Tical, if you are still lurking I am sorry for all my ambivalent, over-optimistic shitposting especially directed at you way back in the day.