CB Champ Bailey to Saints

[Throwdown]

Offseason Champion has gotta be a whiners fan, no one other than a 9er fan can pull that many conspiracies outta their rear posterior like that.

 

[JGfromtheNW]

Offseason Champion has gotta be a whiners fan, no one other than a 9er fan can pull that many conspiracies outta their rear posterior like that.

"Sir, in the dictionary under redundant it says 'see redundant.'"

 

[AsylumGuido]

The league dropped any pretense that the Saints ever had anything more than your run-of-the-mill pay for performance pool if you were aware of the facts.

That's crazy talk. Unless I missed something, I have never seen anything from the NFL saying that it was normal and that the whole bounty-gate was a mistake - because that's what you're implying. I have no dog in this fight, really. Just wanted to point out that you think Vilma, Payton, Williams and Vitt were suspended/banned for things that are common place, or "run-of-the-mill," in the NFL. I'm not saying it hasn't or doesn't happen elsewhere, but it was obviously a serious enough issue to have an example made out of the franchise.

Can you please share some "facts" that can help us understand that a pay-to-injure program is/was common place or that the league acknowledged it might not have been as bad as they expected?

As far as the signing goes, reminds me a lot of the Winfield signing last year with us. However, he's too old to really make an impact now. He's going to get shredded by quick guys in the slot, so I guess he'll just play zone/safety in the nickel? He can mentor some young guys, but I hope the Saints got him on the cheap.

Yes, you did miss something. After the initial proclamations and suspensions levied by Goodell based on some sort of elaborate "bounty" system, it turned out most of what had been counted upon as proof fell by the wayside. The league, other than Goodell himself, started referring to it as exactly what it was, a performance pool. Former commissioner Paul Tagliabue lambasted Goodell's handling of the affair and overturned all of the player suspensions. Unfortunately, Payton, Vitt and Williams, being without the support of a union, had no means for the same sort of independent arbitration and were forced to serve the bogus suspensions and keep their mouths shut.

The Saints were in the wrong place at the wrong time. Former players from all over the league admitted they had the exact same pools in their locker rooms. Goodell wanted to produce a show with the fast approaching concussion suit about to hit the fan.

Saints players have openly admitted they had a pool going on, but vehemently deny that there was ever any tie to injuries. The vast majority of the awards were for things like turnovers, sacks or tackles for losses. Hard hits were awarded, as there were in every team's pools. In fact, they all stressed that the only time a player could qualify for an award would be if 1) the Saints won the game, 2) there was no penalty on the play, 3) the play was not deemed illegal after the fact by the league, and 4) the play did not result in an injury.

You see, it turned out that the entirety of the "evidence" that prompted Goodell's initial decision was handed to him by one individual. Mike Cerullo. Cerullo was a defensive quality control coach during the 2009 season that was fired following the season for lying to management on multiple occasions to get leave from work. His "evidence" included a couple of handwritten "vouchers" with listed awards that could not be associated with any game played during that time. He later admitted that wasn't sure what they even meant and supposedly they were in his own handwriting!

Of course the league doesn't flaunt this. They quickly swept the whole ordeal under the rug. If you get a chance, you can read the lawsuit filed by Vilma which spells much of this out. But, that too has ended up for the most part "under the same rug."

 

[JGfromtheNW]

The league dropped any pretense that the Saints ever had anything more than your run-of-the-mill pay for performance pool if you were aware of the facts.

That's crazy talk. Unless I missed something, I have never seen anything from the NFL saying that it was normal and that the whole bounty-gate was a mistake - because that's what you're implying. I have no dog in this fight, really. Just wanted to point out that you think Vilma, Payton, Williams and Vitt were suspended/banned for things that are common place, or "run-of-the-mill," in the NFL. I'm not saying it hasn't or doesn't happen elsewhere, but it was obviously a serious enough issue to have an example made out of the franchise.

Can you please share some "facts" that can help us understand that a pay-to-injure program is/was common place or that the league acknowledged it might not have been as bad as they expected?

As far as the signing goes, reminds me a lot of the Winfield signing last year with us. However, he's too old to really make an impact now. He's going to get shredded by quick guys in the slot, so I guess he'll just play zone/safety in the nickel? He can mentor some young guys, but I hope the Saints got him on the cheap.

Yes, you did miss something. After the initial proclamations and suspensions levied by Goodell based on some sort of elaborate "bounty" system, it turned out most of what had been counted upon as proof fell by the wayside. The league, other than Goodell himself, started referring to it as exactly what it was, a performance pool. Former commissioner Paul Tagliabue lambasted Goodell's handling of the affair and overturned all of the player suspensions. Unfortunately, Payton, Vitt and Williams being without the support of a union had no means for the same sort of independent arbitration and were forced to serve the bogus suspensions and keep their mouths shut.

The Saints were in the wrong place at the wrong time. Former players from all over the league admitted they had the exact same pools in their locker rooms. Goodell wanted to produce a show with the with the fast approaching concussion suit about to hit the fan.

Saints players have openly admitted they had a pool going on, but vehemently deny that there was ever any tie to injuries. The vast majority of the awards were for things like turnovers, sacks or tackles for losses. Hard hits were awarded, as there were in every team's pools. In fact, they all stressed that the only time a player could qualify for an award would be if 1) the Saints won the game, 2) there was no penalty on the play, 3) the play was not deemed illegal after the fact by the league, and 4) the play did not result in an injury.

You see, it turned out that the entirety of the "evidence" that prompted Goodell's initial decision was handed to him by one individual. Mike Cerullo. Cerullo was a defensive quality control coach during the 2009 season that was fired following the season for lying to management on multiple occasions to get leave from work. His "evidence" included a couple of handwritten "vouchers" with listed awards that could not be associated with any game played during that time. He later admitted that wasn't sure what they even meant and supposedly they were in his own handwriting!

Of course the league doesn't flaunt this. They quickly swept the whole ordeal under the rug. If you get a chance, you can read the lawsuit filed by Vilma which spells much of this out. But, that too has ended up for the most part "under the same rug."

Awesome info, thanks for sharing. I wasn't aware of a good portion of that.

 

[AsylumGuido]

Awesome info, thanks for sharing. I wasn't aware of a good portion of that.

Few people are. Most only know what they hear on the radio or through forums such as this. For obvious reasons, I followed this whole ordeal very closely. Mainstream media is quick to run with the sensational, but tend not to share when they have been duped.

 

[pmedic920]

We all saw what Ed Reed did for the Texans.
This signing will be déjà moo.

Heard this BS before.

 

[AsylumGuido]

We all saw what Ed Reed did for the Texans.
This signing will be déjà moo.

Heard this BS before.

Bailey will be, at most, a #2 CB. At that alone, he should easily be an upgrade. But, he has already said he wants to work with the current CB's, of whom all are young, and teach them what he can. I expect him to have far more of an impact than you seem to think. My advice is to wait and see.

Hear it in his own words:

“I have a little more to my game, I believe, especially mentally,” Bailey said. “I can see things a lot easier, a lot of things come up that I’ve had experience with. That only helps your game. I’m using that to my advantage as much as possible because I know how much you’ve got to be mentally ready for this well, as well as physically ready.

“When you have a lot of young, energetic guys that want to prove that they belong in this game and prove that they’re one of the best – you’ve got a young Kenny Vaccaro, how much is Jairus Byrd going to help him? How much can I help them? How much can they help me? I just like the situation I’m going into because I know these guys are going to be hungry and we can all be biting each other’s style as far as what it’s going to take to be great. And I’m excited to be a part of it.”

“I’m looking forward to it because Keenan Lewis is still a relatively young corner, especially compared to me. Just the things I can help him with, the things that we can help each other with, and all the young guys that are behind him. I want to go in and help those guys as much as possible but also take as much from them as I can. I don’t think I know everything, but I’m going out there to compete for a starting job and help this team be the best it can be.”

 

[pmedic920]

I follow the Texans a little bit.
I was happy about Reed coming in last year.
I could very well be wrong on this, lord knows I been wrong plenty.
Champ's signing with the Saints sounds very similar to me
Reed even said similar things.
I've got respect for Champs skills. Just don't think he,ll be what saint fans are hoping for.

Edit: no dis intended to you.

 

[Veilside]

Do you believe in the flat earth theory, as well?



Not sure what "bogus" calls you are talking about as being blown.


:roll:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRd5jkJ1dEo

Reggie Bush "1st Down"
Phantom Defensive PI
Incomplete pass called complete

all on the same drive...

That is so funny! You still have such a burr up your arse that you refer back to that?

What's the matter, did you lose money on the game or were you a Vikings' fan back then.

The Saints played the game and won.

Get real.

I'm not a fan of either the Vikings or the Saints nor did I bet, the NFL/Media/refs wanted to the Saints to win for the Hurricane Katrina storyline and selling variations of Brees jerseys.

What makes this any different than the 49er fans claiming the NFL wanted the Seahawks to win this year because of the "fixed" NFCCG?

Embarrassing.

Guido has been nothing but respectful to this fan base and he's just excited in the potential of his team. I could see these defensive changes being huge for the Saints as much as I hate to admit it. IMO the team that got Byrd was going to make the biggest leap towards copying the Seattle defense and that just so happens to be the Saints who already had an explosive offense.

 

[AsylumGuido]

I follow the Texans a little bit.
I was happy about Reed coming in last year.
I could very well be wrong on this, lord knows I been wrong plenty.
Champ's signing with the Saints sounds very similar to me
Reed even said similar things.
I've got respect for Champs skills. Just don't think he,ll be what saint fans are hoping for.

Edit: no dis intended to you.

I understand your concerns, but Sean Payton and Mickey Loomis seldom make poor personnel moves. Many people had the same concerns when they brought in Darren Sharper in 2009. They called him washed up and a shell of himself. He had nine picks that year and helped lead the Saints to the championship.

All Saints fans are expecting is a great clubhouse presence and leadership; a player that can improve the secondary. Don't forget that Bailey had a great 2012 season, but fought through 2013 with a severe foot strain. The Broncos' defense was also hampered by huge loses on the defensive front that put undue pressure on their secondary. Bailey is 100% healthy and will be playing behind a great line and will be flanked by three of the best young DB's in the league.

 

[pmedic920]

Only time will tell.
For the Saints fans, I hope y'all get what you're looking for, in Champ. He's a respectable guy.

 

[themunn]

Wow. Already owned the aints twice and then completely took Champs soul in the Super Bowl.

Y'all owned the Saints once and the close win in the playoff was without Kenny Vacarro roaming the backfield. Now you will be looking at Vacarro and Jarius Byrd, along with Bailey as the nickel or 3rd safety that Rob Ryan likes to employ.

Seriously, I am loving all of the Saints moves thus far this off-season.

Saints never came close to winning the playoff game. Didn't score until the 4th quarter remember. And never came within 7 points after the Hawks went up.

 

[OrFan]

A current video featuring Chump Bailey as "The boss."

[youtube]d_DldUf1fNQ[/youtube]

 

[loafoftatupu]

Just when it looks like the Saints are trying to get better, they make a backwards move like this. I'm sorry, but if this guy ends up playing they are going to get abused until they replace him.

If the Saints somehow get matched with the Hawks again, the payback for Percy will be devastating. That will be addition to abusing guys like Vacarro and Byrd.

 

[Smelly McUgly]

Having watched it again without being tense, that second Saints game wasn't really that close. Had Tate covered up the onside, we'd be talking about it being a fairly comfortable win despite the score.

 

[Tech Worlds]

We started playing prevent defense and I Saints got a garbage time touchdown.

Otherwise it was the same ass kicking as before.

 

[drdiags]

Well this became a pissing contest pretty quickly. I would imagine those counting on the Saints remaining the team that lost twice last year are the same that thought the 9ers would get blown out in the playoffs here, since they had problems the last few times they played here.

I don't know if Bailey hurts or helps but the Saints figure he has value. Maybe they move him to safety, where former players like Rod Woodson, Prime, McGinest and others think he can extend his career a few years? Fan forums are for boasting and bagging on the other 31 teams. I get that, just not the only way to comment on actions around the league.

 

[Smelly McUgly]

Re: The Bailey signing, I have no opinion. I don't see how it can hurt. We signed a 35-year-old corner last year for competition, so I'm not seeing how the Saints kicking the tires on Bailey is a bad thing.

 

[Seahawkfan80]

The Bailey signing will be a great thing. He can produce by his wisdom and knowledge of the game to the younger less experienced kids. Beyond that, is the fact you never know what may happen. He may provide the spark they need in the beginning of the game that runs them all over the other teams (not ours of course). Just my thoughts.....or is it thought?

 

[AsylumGuido]

The Bailey signing will be a great thing. He can produce by his wisdom and knowledge of the game to the younger less experienced kids. Beyond that, is the fact you never know what may happen. He may provide the spark they need in the beginning of the game that runs them all over the other teams (not ours of course). Just my thoughts.....or is it thought?

I think it would be "thoughts" since you mentioned more than one thing.

:lol: