Are we headed towards cap hell?

[Tical21]

I see the current numbers, but they don't have Wilson and Wagner taken into account. I just don't see how what we're doing is possible.

One of, if not the highest paid QB's in NFL
Highest paid RB in NFL
One of highest paid TE's in NFL
Well paid LT
Percy and Baldwin, Kearse isn't exactly cheap
Two highly paid DE's
Mebane isn't cheap
High paid LB (Wright), Wagner also figures to be one of highest paid LB's in NFL, even Irvin's cap number is 3 million
Highest paid corner in NFL
Very highly paid safeties, Earl has to be at about the top

Why is it that other teams can only pay a handful of players, and we are seemingly paying everybody top dollar? Doesn't something have to give at some point?

I keep hearing that we have like 15 million left. Isn't Russell going to be making 20+? Isn't Wagner going to be making like 8 per? 28>15. So, sure, you backload and all that kind of stuff, but that is all going to catch up to you eventually, right?

I want scientifically motivated answers for this one for once, rather than the customary "John Schneider has it all figured out"

 

[dumbrabbit]

Who's job is it to worry about the salary cap? Certainly not mine.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

No.

Look at all the big names Denver has -- and they have plenty of cap room.

Plus Seattle will shed several big contracts over next two years including Lynch, Mebane and others.

 

[Tical21]

No.

Look at all the big names Denver has -- and they have plenty of cap room.

Plus Seattle will shed several big contracts over next two years including Lynch, Mebane and others.

who? Thomas, Manning, Clady, Ware, Sanders. We've got 12-15 positions we are paying top dollar to, not 6. Sorry, too lazy to look it up.

 

[samwize77]

As been posted many times, the cap is probably going to continue to rise. Which will help.

 

[theincrediblesok]

I trust they have something going on and they been talking to both Wilson and Wagner's agents. They got a plan in place and they are on it. Whatever it is, like Schneider said that they will be doing something different with Wilson's contract. Who knows maybe Wilson and Wagner will both play out their rookie contract and then next year get the bigger contract where the salary cap going up will help a bit with that.

 

[McGruff]

I see the current numbers, but they don't have Wilson and Wagner taken into account. I just don't see how what we're doing is possible.

One of, if not the highest paid QB's in NFL
Highest paid RB in NFL
One of highest paid TE's in NFL
Well paid LT
Percy and Baldwin, Kearse isn't exactly cheap
Two highly paid DE's
Mebane isn't cheap
High paid LB (Wright), Wagner also figures to be one of highest paid LB's in NFL, even Irvin's cap number is 3 million
Highest paid corner in NFL
Very highly paid safeties, Earl has to be at about the top

Why is it that other teams can only pay a handful of players, and we are seemingly paying everybody top dollar? Doesn't something have to give at some point?

I keep hearing that we have like 15 million left. Isn't Russell going to be making 20+? Isn't Wagner going to be making like 8 per? 28>15. So, sure, you backload and all that kind of stuff, but that is all going to catch up to you eventually, right?

As contracts "catch up" other contracts come off the books. In 2016 older vets like Russell Okung, Brandon Mebane and Tony McDaniel come off the books.

As long as you can draft cheap, young talent to replace some of those pieces, and not squander cap dollars at the bottom of the roster, you can keep this train moving.

 

[Basis4day]

Cap was 123 Million prior to the 2013 season. Two years later it's grown 20 extra million. It's not guaranteed to rise that much again, but it is better to lock down players now when the contracts will seem like values in 3 years.

The important thing is staggering contracts through signing bonus pro-ration and remembering you can't keep everyone.

 

[XxXdragonXxX]

Every year there will be guys coming off the books. The cap will go up every year. Bigger and bigger contracts will come in every year.

Think about it this way. We signed Sherman last season. By next season there will be average corners making Sherman money.

This is most likely the last year of big deals coming in. But I don't see this team going into cap hell.

 

[Basis4day]

Every year there will be guys coming off the books. The cap will go up every year.

Think about it this way. We signed Sherman las season. By next season there will be average corners making Sherman money.

This is most likely the last year of big deals coming in. But I don't see this team going into cap hell.

Weren't you the one with the inside info on Suh through your friend? Where is your buddy?

 

[theincrediblesok]

Some of our guys will demand big money after their contracts are over like Okung, it's better to get the guys drafted and trained up to eat away that big dollar amount. The rookie CBA really helps out alot of teams plus if we can trained up our guys and they looked good enough, we can get cheap FA for depth. Moneyball style, if the player can't perform to their contract or gets to the point where they will get expensive you start cutitng them, but make sure you have a cheaper ready to go starter in the wings.

 

[Tical21]

Cap was 123 Million prior to the 2013 season. Two years later it's grown 20 extra million. It's not guaranteed to rise that much again, but it is better to lock down players now when the contracts will seem like values in 3 years.

The important thing is staggering contracts through signing bonus pro-ration and remembering you can't keep everyone.

but we kind of have been. I've been thinking for a while "okay, we just aren't going to be able to afford this guy, or add this guy, etc.", but we just keep piling on more big contracts to fill almost every hole. Eventually I thought we would have to sacrifice things like TE, LB, one of the DE's, etc., but instead we just keep paying big money to them. It just seems odd that all the other teams can only afford a few big contracts, while we can pay the majority of our starters big money. It just doesn't quite feel right. Maybe it adds up, I dunno, just feels like we're paying EVERYBODY.

 

[McGruff]

I could be wrong, but the way the Seahawks operate seems like there is a bigger gap between the richer and poor. I suspect a lot of teams have a lot of guys making 2-4 million per year. The Seahawks don't have those kind of contracts in general. They have a ton of 1st contract guys make chump change, and a sizable handful of guys making top coin, and not much in between.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

As long as you can draft cheap, young talent to replace some of those pieces, and not squander cap dollars at the bottom of the roster, you can keep this train moving.

This is the key.

The teams that get into trouble with the cap are the ones that HAVE to fill in 80% of their roster because they' bungled draft after draft.

Teams that continue to draft well are the ones who never get into trouble, because they always have 25-50% of their starters undervalued.

Also you can see Pete and John have a concerted effort to go after cut players, and not the UFA's........which are the one's that break the bank in free agency. There's tremendous value in cut players because of dead cap left behind for someone else to pay. Makes them a far more cap friendly signing than UFA's.

 

[XxXdragonXxX]

Every year there will be guys coming off the books. The cap will go up every year.

Think about it this way. We signed Sherman las season. By next season there will be average corners making Sherman money.

This is most likely the last year of big deals coming in. But I don't see this team going into cap hell.

Weren't you the one with the inside info on Suh through your friend? Where is your buddy?

Haha. No. It was a guy who I had never met who supposedly knew Norm Johnson.

 

[Largent80]

Yes, all players will wear flat bills.

HELL.

 

[McGruff]

Cap was 123 Million prior to the 2013 season. Two years later it's grown 20 extra million. It's not guaranteed to rise that much again, but it is better to lock down players now when the contracts will seem like values in 3 years.

The important thing is staggering contracts through signing bonus pro-ration and remembering you can't keep everyone.

but we kind of have been. I've been thinking for a while "okay, we just aren't going to be able to afford this guy, or add this guy, etc.", but we just keep piling on more big contracts to fill almost every hole. Eventually I thought we would have to sacrifice things like TE, LB, one of the DE's, etc., but instead we just keep paying big money to them. It just seems odd that all the other teams can only afford a few big contracts, while we can pay the majority of our starters big money. It just doesn't quite feel right. Maybe it adds up, I dunno, just feels like we're paying EVERYBODY.

But we have sacrificed guys along the way. We cut Clemons and Red. We let Giacomini, Maxie, III and Browner go.

We play a lot of guys on 1st contract money, and let them walk. We pay a few guys on big 2nd contract money, but when they get old, don't hesitate to let the axe fall. We rarely give out the dreaded 3rd contract. Those are the contracts that tend to kill a cap.

 

[kidhawk]

There are way to many factors involved in the cap to try to wrangle it down to a few simple paragraphs, but here are a few ways to keep the cap reasonable:

Draft well to keep a good stock of talented underpaid players on your squad (especially for depth)

When you do draft talent, recognize the difference between core guys and replaceable guys. Lock up the core guys with extensions so they get paid while finishing out their lower cap value rookie deals and let the others walk

By letting the non-core high value guys walk, you pick up higher compensation picks, allowing you to continue to keep the low salary player pool stocked.

Another reason locking up guys early is each year values go up, so we locked up guys like Kam, Earl, Sherman etc before they could hit the market, meaning we got them at those prices instead of the more inflated free agent prices. We continue to do that with Wilson and Wagner.

As for our current situation, both Wagner and Wilson will get extension, thus their cap hit this year will only be from their rookie deal plus a pro-rated portion of the signing bonus.

As you've seen in past years with guys like Clemons and Bryant, etc. As guys age and their cap hits rise, you need to figure out where to make your business decisions and let people go. This often coincides with where you have the best depth, so you can replace them with relatively low paid talent.

It's a delicate balancing act and yet Schneider has it well in hand.

 

[DavidSeven]

Denver has these guys making ~$10M or more: Manning, Demaryius, Clady, Von Miller. And five guys making about $5-8M: Ware, TJ Ward, Talib, Vasquez, Sanders.

That's nine guys hitting the cap pretty hard.

In 2015, Sherman is our only guy hitting the cap at $10M or more. Wilson and Wagner will probably be back-loaded. Based on things I've read, I think SEA may have at least one or two more cuts to make if they want to extend Wilson, Wagner and Sweezy. Probably Mebane and/or McDaniel. Not sure what's going to happen with Okung next year. Inevitably, though, someone is bound to have a disappointing year and get cut or restructured next season.

The good thing about Seattle right now is that the guys their paying are all really good players and arguably worth even more than what their deals are paying. I think that's what's giving them the talent edge right now.

 

[IndyHawk]

Tical we are fine.You just don't see all that goes into the cap $ wise and what doesn't.I don't either but when you hear dead money and signing bonus ect no/yes enough it makes more sense.Harvin was one big mistake to our cap and I believe he is off this years books thanks to that trade.