REPORT: Baker Deal Nearly Done

[Lagartixa]

I'm in

Yep I was just
thinking about that from the Chris Warren thread, Mirer was a can't miss pick and McGuire was the prototypical big QB. It's a crapshoot and talk of tanking could get us further down the rabbit hole if we miss.

I remember being in Chicago when McGwire was drafted, and reading that the Seahawks had gotten him specifically to take advantage of some changes in the "in-the-grasp" rules.

The basic point is good, and @SoulfishHawk made it above too. Since I spent most of my reply to @SoulfishHawk's post explaining why I wouldn't want the Seahawks to get Mayfield, I'll focus more here on where I agree with @SoulfishHawk and @m0ng0. The draft, even the first round, is a crapshoot. The Seahawks have drafted QBs early and seen them suck. By far the best QB in Seahawks history was a third-round pick that draft "experts" thought was a bad pick even in the third round. The second-best QB in Seahawks history was an undrafted player from a college that doesn't exist anymore. The third-best QB in Seahawks history was selected in the sixth round of the draft by the Packers. My first childhood sports hero was the Seahawks' first starting QB, and he was first signed as an undrafted free agent by the Cowboys. He's probably the Seahawks' fourth-best ever.

EDITED to add: I'm OK if anyone wants to switch the positions of the Seahawks' second-best and third-best QBs in my list. What's important is that Wilson was very clearly the Seahawks' best QB ever, and the team's all-time top four consists of a third-round pick (considered a reach even there at the time!), a sixth-round pick, and two guys who didn't even get drafted.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

I can totally see both sides of it. I'm hoping he comes here, but I'm not all gung ho about it. Nothing is etched in stone. I'll pull for whatever QB they go with. Even if my expectations are very low with Geno or Lock. I'd love to be very wrong about both of them. IF the team sucks, hopefully they hit on their QB in the draft next year.

 

[JayhawkMike]

My feelings exactly. He may be 'better' than Lock or Geno HAVE been, but Baker's cookie is 'baked', whereas Lock is still in the process of figuring out how good he can be, and Geno hasn't had enough of an opportunity to prove he's no better than the guy he's always been.

If the situation were flipped and it was Lock having been on a team with the supporting cast Baker has had, I'd be saying the same thing. But that's not the case. We can see Baker's ceiling. Lock's might be higher... might not be. We won't know until he gets a shot ON OUR TEAM, with our coordinator and our offense. If it works, great. If it doesn't, that's what the draft and FA are for.

I guess 18 months make a HUGE difference. Since Mayfield is only 18 months older than Lock. Mayfields cookie is baked. He can’t improve - team or system be damned. But Lock? New team new teammates new system. He’s just wet clay to be formed in the hands of the master coach. 18 months Between infinite potential and dyed in the wool failure.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Again, that's your opinion. We all have our opinions, which should be ok on a message board. And that's cool, makes for good discussion.

 

[Lagartixa]

I'll pull for whatever QB they go with. Even if my expectations are very low with Geno or Lock. I'd love to be very wrong about both of them. IF the team sucks, hopefully they hit on their QB in the draft next year.

Given our disagreements in that other thread, plus our different positions (tho' there is some overlap) in this one, I'm replying here just to say that I agree with all of what I quoted here (plus the stuff about highly drafted QBs not necessarily turning into good NFL QBs).

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Yeah, a lot of people don't like me on here, and that's fine. It's just a message board. And I'm aware that I can be an a**. I just don't take a message board too seriously or personal. Most of us don't actually know each other. I think we all love this team, that's what's a hell of a lot more important than silly arguments.

 

[JayhawkMike]

I think we will all root for the Seahawks on the field to succeed no matter how much we don’t think they will succeed. I root for Penny to succeed on the field though I thought his pick over Chubb was is and will always be a big fat failure.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I guess 18 months make a HUGE difference. Since Mayfield is only 18 months older than Lock. Mayfields cookie is baked. He can’t improve - team or system be damned. But Lock? New team new teammates new system. He’s just wet clay to be formed in the hands of the master coach. 18 months Between infinite potential and dyed in the wool failure.

Lock is a backup, so getting Mayfield doesn't mean you're getting rid of Lock as your backup to continue to learn and compete for the starting job.

Dude can't even beat out Geno Smith for 1st team snaps in mini-camp, not sure why you guys are so high on Lock.

He's got some good measurables, but has abysmal decision making skills......and if he improves? Great, then there's your QB. But in the meantime I'd like to not go 4-13. Getting Mayfield means you're automatically a better team. How much better? Who knows, but you're better.

 

[jammerhawk]

If they eat his salary, does it mean that they pay it and it applies to their cap, or do they pay and it applies to our cap? I don’t care which billionaire pays him. I care who it counts against.

Mesquite
The Browns cap would be responsible for the money Cleveland eats. If the Hawks agreed to trade for Mayfield and the Browns agreed to absorb (eat) 3/4 of Mayfield’s $18.858 mil guaranteed money the Hawks cap would only be responsible for 1/4 of that amount.

In Mayfield’s case the Browns exercised his 5th year option thus guaranteeing his contract, they are thus on the hook for all that money unless they can trade it away or part of it away with the player. Either way Mayfield will get his money.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Well said Largent. And basically what I've been trying to say.
But if I say it, I get blasted. And that's ok, I've accepted it, and probably brought a lot of it on myself

 

[GemCity]

Mods

Yeah, a lot of people don't like me on here, and that's fine. It's just a message board. And I'm aware that I can be an a**. I just don't take a message board too seriously or personal. Most of us don't actually know each other. I think we all love this team, that's what's a hell of a lot more important than silly arguments.

We’ll said! If there’s a place to debate, it’s here.

We can disagree all day! It’s text…and maybe comes off wrong but as you said, we’re all Hawks fans.

I’d hope most were resilient enough to not getting offended by forum content.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

It's easy to get worked up, but you gotta' just step back and go with the flow. We might not all like each other, and that's fine. I suspect that if some of us met, we'd actually get along, raise a pint and laugh at how much we can be a holes on here.

 

[Cyrus12]

Nothing I say matters anyway, I just think he would make the team better. Not sure why that gets some people so worked up.

Really though by how many wins? He's gonna want a long term deal. I dont view him at as even a moderate length term solution.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Fair enough. If he comes here, great, if not, oh well.

 

[Lagartixa]

I think we will all root for the Seahawks on the field to succeed no matter how much we don’t think they will succeed. I root for Penny to succeed on the field though I thought his pick over Chubb was is and will always be a big fat failure.

I'm getting off-topic here, but I consider picking Penny over Chubb to have been a correct choice given what was known at the time. Penny had been extremely durable, while Chubb had had a major knee injury. He had come back from it to perform well, but players that suffer major injuries tend to continue have injury problems. The process involved in choosing Penny over Chubb was good, but with the benefit of hindsight, we can say the result was bad for us.

I thought picking a RB in the first round was a bad idea, though. I didn't like that aspect at all. But since the moment he was selected, I've hoped for Penny to do well. Pretty much the same goes for Collier.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

In Mayfield’s case the Browns exercised his 5th year option thus guaranteeing his contract, they are thus on the hook for all that money unless they can trade it away or part of it away with the player. Either way Mayfield will get his money.

Not if the Browns hold onto him and he refuses to show up to camp.

So that might be what's going on, the Browns know that Watson's going to get spanked with a long suspension and they're hoping Mayfield shows up to get paid?

So maybe that's the game of chicken they're willing to play with him and why he hasn't been released or traded. But if your Baker's agent, you should have made it VERY clear that your client has absolutely no intention of playing one more down for a team that refused to give him an extension and replaced him already.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Saw something that said they were going to pay 64M, or something like that in 2022......for two QB's who won't even be playing for them this year. What an absolute dumpster fire of a franchise.

 

[BASF]

Not if the Browns hold onto him and he refuses to show up to camp.

So that might be what's going on, the Browns know that Watson's going to get spanked with a long suspension and they're hoping Mayfield shows up to get paid?

So maybe that's the game of chicken they're willing to play with him and why he hasn't been released or traded. But if your Baker's agent, you should have made it VERY clear that your client has absolutely no intention of playing one more down for a team that refused to give him an extension and replaced him already.

If the agent doesn't talk Mayfield into playing for the Browns as an f you to them by playing excellent football and earning a big pay day, then the agent isn't doing his job. The only way Mayfield maximizes his earnings with the next contract is to play very well in his lame duck season. It puts to bed all of the immaturity talk and shows that he is worth franchise QB money.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

That chip on the shoulder, and a lot to play for etc. makes it very intriguing.

 

[Cyrus12]

Saw something that said they were going to pay 64M, or something like that in 2022......for two QB's who won't even be playing for them this year. What an absolute dumpster fire of a franchise.

So 230 mill...3 first rd picks...for Jacoby Brisket.....