Wilson's QBR vs Passer rating

Erebus

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Quite a difference here when you factor in the sacks. Wilson's passer rating last night was 117.6, but his QBR was 20.5. I'm shocked he was able to manage such a good passer rating despite all the constant pressure. To not throw a pick or fumble the ball was really impressive.
 

LawHawk

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I love Total QBR and I think it's right on the money most of the time. I think it's just a little better than passer rating for grading QBs. But the last two weeks, Wilson has been surrounded by defensive ends 0.05 seconds after the snap... which means he's getting sacked and his Total QBR is dropping. Sometimes it is the QB's fault, but not this time. Against the Rams and Cardinals on the road, you look at that pressure and give Wilson credit for making the plays he made considering the pressure on him.
 

SomersetHawk

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I think QBR sucks, not that Passer rating doesn't either. Stats offer no context, that's where PFF's a little better.
 

AF_Hawk

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QBR is horseshit, Wilson played as good as the line let him.
 

dontbelikethat

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I hate QBR, saw this on another forum...both have to be used with context and not just as a single stat alone though. Passer Rating if more efficient imo. QBR says Pryor and Kaep did a lot better than Brees...and Pryor's QBR is just laughably stupid especially considering he had one run that went 93 yards for a TD.

Drew Brees

26/36 332 5 tds 0 ints 146 passer Rating, but ESPN has a 70 QBR
http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=331027018

Terrelle Pryor
10/19 88 yards 0 tds 2 ints 9 carries 105 yards 1 td
25 Passer Rating, but 96.2 QBR

:lol:
http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=331027013
Colin Kaepernick 10/16 164 yards 1 td 7 carries 54 yards 2 TDs
Passer rating of 117, but a QBR of 99.8
http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=331027030

This is pretty off base. QBR is a ESPN made up stat by Trent Dilfer and some other people and it's quite subjective. No one knows the formula they use so I mean, some times it feels like they just put a random high number when they see a QB do good and a low one when a QB does bad.
 

SoHo9erFan

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I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan
 

McGruff

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SoHo9erFan":s0tx005z said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked way better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

And that has everything to do with joe staley, Mike Iupati, Alex Boone and Anthony Davis. That Niners line is the best line in the league IMO.
 

Mtjhoyas

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QBR and QB Rating have their good and bad.

QBR is like a baseball stat that places more emphasis on "not striking out" as opposed to how many hits you get. Sure, the "not striking out" might give a good indication of your plate discipline, but does it really say how good of a hitter you are?

The more I see the numbers, the more I am actually starting to lean towards QB rating as a better indicator (most of the time). I feel like there are too many subjective metrics in QBR, disguised as "objective". For instance, 3rd down success; do we punish a QB for throwing a ball away in the face of pressure and no open WRs? How about in a tight game, hanging in the pocket to try to make a play only to get sacked?

I feel like QBR rewards QBs for taking the uber-conservative route over actually making plays. I am not trying to say that QBR is worthless, but I saw Kaepernick do little to nothing except "not screw up" and get a 99 QBR, while having a 90 QB rating. Should a QB really be given a perfect score when going 10-16 for 150 yards in a blowout win? Yes, that is efficient, but that's also like saying you won the spelling bee by spelling the word "dog" correctly.

Here's a pretty simple rule in judging QBs in my opinion, trust what your eyes see and brain tells you. Fantasy sports have ruined how we judge players nowadays because we rely on the box score and numbers, over watching a game and judging a performance based on the actual circumstances. A box score doesn't care if you are on the raod or are missing O-lineman.
 

dontbelikethat

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SoHo9erFan":2ixe1w40 said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

The offense was alright last week, against the Titans,Colts and Jags. Not saying they were amazing and lighting the world on fire, but they weren't inept by any means and continued to move the ball. The struggles on the offensive line yesterday were immense, to the point where you couldn't even execute a pass play with out Wilson ending up on his back. I don't think Kaep has been particularly bad this season, but he does tend to lay an egg when he plays @Seattle/Seattle and didn't do to well against IND either. The rankings with Kaep,Wilson,Lynch,Gore, etc. is all subjective and if I were you, I wouldn't expect to win any debates at another team's forum, although I'm not saying you're wrong or right or whatever, just you know, temper your expectations. Every game this season except for maybe the Rams game, we've won because of Wilson (but obviously not only just cause of him), whether it was his legs or his arms, he always got us the clutch play to win.

There is definitely a lot of concern with this offense and it starts with the oline then the play calling.
 

SoHo9erFan

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McGruff":u6kjmmfi said:
SoHo9erFan":u6kjmmfi said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked way better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

And that has everything to do with joe staley, Mike Iupati, Alex Boone and Anthony Davis. That Niners line is the best line in the league IMO.
True but they are also doing it without their top 2 WRs. Admittedly, the 49ers offense has struggled twice this season (against Hawks and Colts) but the 49ers seems way more comfortable at this point of the season
 

Mtjhoyas

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Kaepernick...Mr. 1 read and run.

McGruff":3b345grj said:
SoHo9erFan":3b345grj said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked way better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

And that has everything to do with joe staley, Mike Iupati, Alex Boone and Anthony Davis. That Niners line is the best line in the league IMO.
 

McGruff

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Mtjhoyas":1zp1pu32 said:
QBR and QB Rating have their good and bad.

QBR is like a baseball stat that places more emphasis on "not striking out" as opposed to how many hits you get. Sure, the "not striking out" might give a good indication of your plate discipline, but does it really say how good of a hitter you are?

The more I see the numbers, the more I am actually starting to lean towards QB rating as a better indicator (most of the time). I feel like there are too many subjective metrics in QBR, disguised as "objective". For instance, 3rd down success; do we punish a QB for throwing a ball away in the face of pressure and no open WRs? How about in a tight game, hanging in the pocket to try to make a play only to get sacked?

I feel like QBR rewards QBs for taking the uber-conservative route over actually making plays. I am not trying to say that QBR is worthless, but I saw Kaepernick do little to nothing except "not screw up" and get a 99 QBR, while having a 90 QB rating. Should a QB really be given a perfect score when going 10-16 for 150 yards in a blowout win? Yes, that is efficient, but that's also like saying you won the spelling bee by spelling the word "dog" correctly.

Here's a pretty simple rule in judging QBs in my opinion, trust what your eyes see and brain tells you. Fantasy sports have ruined how we judge players nowadays because we rely on the box score and numbers, over watching a game and judging a performance based on the actual circumstances. A box score doesn't care if you are on the raod or are missing O-lineman.

Brilliant post ..did
 

McGruff

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SoHo9erFan":3bsn1y2l said:
McGruff":3bsn1y2l said:
SoHo9erFan":3bsn1y2l said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked way better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

And that has everything to do with joe staley, Mike Iupati, Alex Boone and Anthony Davis. That Niners line is the best line in the league IMO.
True but they are also doing it without their top 2 WRs. Admittedly, the 49ers offense has struggled twice this season (against Hawks and Colts) but the 49ers seems way more comfortable at this point of the season

Sure, but let's not pretend that those two receivers are world beaters.

And at the end of the day, both the Niners and Hawks offenses are designed to do two things really well . . . Run the ball and pass off the play action. Both those require blocking more than receiving. Right now the Niners are blocking and the Seahawks aren't and that is the difference.
 

drrew

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SoHo9erFan":2bwc6u3y said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

You really think 57% passing 1584 YDS 9TD 5INT 294 yards rushing looks better than 61% passing, 1628YDS 13TD 4INT 339 yards rushing?

At RB, Gore has a whopping 17 more yards and 1 more TD rushing, while Lynch has 85 yards more receiving and a receiving TD.

In what universe does the 49ers duo look better than what Wilson and Lynch have put up this season?

That doesn't even take into account the unbalanced schedule where Seattle has 5 homes games in the 2nd half of the season. I understand liking your team, but your claim is just silly.
 

CANHawk

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And true to form, hawks struggle a little and 9'er clowns swoop in to talk shit. What's our record again? enjoy the view from 2nd place. You're going to be spending a lot of time there this year....
 

SalishHawkFan

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I'll take FO's QB ratings anyday over either of those other two stats. Wilson is 9th in DYAR and 10th in DVOA. Baldwin is 2nd in DVOA. Passes my eyeball test.
 

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Brock was on with Cowherd a while ago. He said the staff told him that Wilson executed the game plan they drew up. Wildon was told to eat the ball and let the defense take this one becasue we knew we could not block those ends.
 

Mtjhoyas

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Which to any rational fan, seems very logical. Good to hear that. I thought RW looked different and he usually does everything with a purpose.

brimsalabim":83m21rxi said:
Brock was on with Cowherd a while ago. He said the staff told him that Wilson executed the game plan they drew up. Wildon was told to eat the ball and let the defense take this one becasue we knew we could not block those ends.
 

jlwaters1

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SoHo9erFan":1ps4jtye said:
I agree Wilson's performance probably fell between his QBR and his passer rating. But I don't understand how people on here think Wilson is still performing at a high level. Notwithstanding the injuries to two bookend tackles, Wilson and the Hawks offense is still struggling. People on here need to reconsider this whole Wilson+Lynch=best combo in the league. Kap and Gore have looked better this season.
I would be concerned if I was a Seahawks fan

Please, Kaep and Gore- Assinine. I'm pretty sure Wilson and Lynch hasn't been totally stifled to only 3 and 7 points in back to back games like Kaep and Gore has in weeks 2-3.

Kaepernick is showing through this first half of the season that he was completely overrated last year. He's more of a running QB than a passer. He's averaging 198 yards a game with 8.0 a completion. If you subtract out the outlier that was the GB game. He's averaging a paltry - 167 yards passing, and a less impressive 7.3 yards per attempt.
 
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