Missed opportunity against MIN

Laloosh

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Can one of our resident o-linemen speak to this one? Curious why Jackson wouldn't have blocked here rather than running a route.

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Also, looked like the first read was to the right. Guessing Luke was the initial target on the slant but the MLB keying on Jackson is right there. Missed opportunity.
 

kearly

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Looks like Jackson did what he was supposed to.

If the play had gone exactly the same way, but Wilson makes Baldwin his pre-snap read, it's an easy TD.
 

LickMyNuts

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That is a miss by RW. He needs to see that blitz coming.

One of the reasons RW has been using the hard count so much is to make it easier for the offense to read the blitz. RW is getting very good at that. If he had time I'm guessing he would have run a hard count here.

Unfortunately the hard count often gets Okung as well.
 

seahawkfreak

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Never know. Fine line between max protection or trying to take advantage of the blitz. Rams use to do this, the QB would killed it seemed like every play.
 

Hawks46

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Honestly, if he's going to run by that rusher, he needs to flare out to the flat. He runs right back inside into coverage.

If Jackson flares outside, he likely walks in with a TD.
 

Recon_Hawk

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Yeah, that's probably on Russell needed to recognize man coverage with the blitz on, though I imagine seeing that in real time is tough to do. Maybe motion pre-snap might have helped with the read? If he knows the coverage and blitz is coming he probably keeps jackson in to protect to buy a little more time to hit Baldwin there for a TD

This play also makes me wish we still had Jimmy. If you recognize blitz, but you're not sure if they are sending 5 or 6 or that they are in man coverage, motion the TE out and have a fade route called. Protects the QB from a big hit and gives the QB a chance to get the ball out quick.
 

bigskydoc

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I think it's on Russ. He is so focused on Munnerlyn pre-snap that he barely reads the right side of the field. He calls the protection to the left. Turns out, he was right to be worried about the Munnerlyn-Okung matchup as the latter is seriously burned on this play, but he does not make the critical read on the unblocked pressure coming from Greenway on the right, even though Greenway shows his hand on the hard count.

I think Wilson reads the pressure from Munnerlyn and rightly calculates that he will have time to flick it to a wide open Baldwin, but doesn't account for Greenway until he sees the pressure right at the snap. At this point, he stares down Greenway and realizes he doesn't even have time for the quick pass to Baldwin.

He should have seen Greenway show his hand on the hard count and signaled Jackson to stay in and block. At the same time, it does seem that Jackson could have gotten a chip in on the way by.

- bad
 

Tical21

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Fred can't stay in to block because his job is to make the LB vacate for Willson. Russell is clearly looking at Willson, who wins his route enough to have a pretty easy TD if Russell throws the ball, but he just didn't trust Luke and ate it.
 

Dizzlepdx

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We're all clearly working off of incomplete information but I have to disagree with most of the theories about anyone doing anything 'wrong' on this play. I believe the play is run exactly as planned and the Vikes just had the perfect defense (and disguise) for this and played it perfectly. With that preamble out of the way, here's my take after going back and watching the whole play again, especially the pre-snap:



As others have mentioned, RW clearly has Willson as his first read. He's running the slant which first requires moving the middle linebacker-and this Jackson's job(sort of, complicated by my 2nd paragraph). His action has to immediately threaten the flat and force the MLB to come with him. The corner does a great job of getting in front of Willson, much like a very painful play that most of us have nightmares about, and RW holds the ball rather than try to force it in.

As I mentioned earlier, I think the Vikes did a great job of disguising this pre-snap. Others above have said that RW should do a better job of getting the defense to show their hand and see this blitz coming. On the first dummy count, the MLB shows that he's coming, or at least gets Russel to believe that he is. If that actually were to happen, that would mean either both LB's come from this side (unlikely and an easy TD for Jackson) or the OLB has coverage on Jackson. This leaves the middle more open for the throw to Willson and Jackson's route still has the same primary function: keep the LB out of the way for the slant. RW would go to Jackson for his second read, and with the MLB coming from Depth, he'd have a little more time to make the throw than he had in the actual play. This probably would have been enough to hit Jackson across the middle, or possibly, still go to Willson as he starts to cut back outside after the CB commits heavily to the slant. The main thing I look at is the Vikes show a blitz the likely will send more defenders than can be blocked.

Lastly, with the benefit of knowing what the defense is going to do, it's easy to say RW should have changed his read to the three receiver side and DB would have had TD numero 4. But what's to stop the Vikes from dropping the LB from that side into coverage in an alternate universe? Just cause that's how it played out this time, doesn't mean it was the only option.

So that's what I see, but dissenting opinions are welcome.
 

Anthony!

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First off the reality is no one really knows, could be a lot of things, the thing that I find really interesting is how some of you immediately said lets blame Wilson. I mean the guy played one off the best games of the season, against a top pass defense and some here want to find fault. Frankly it is pretty pathetic, that now you have nothing to complain about with Wilson you basically are making something up, since you really do not know. To make it clear I do not blame the OP he never mentioned Wilson. I blame the ones that came after, that just couldn't help but blame something on Wilson when they really have no clue.
 

Scottemojo

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Anthony!":210hdjod said:
First off the reality is no one really knows, could be a lot of things, the thing that I find really interesting is how some of you immediately said lets blame Wilson. I mean the guy played one off the best games of the season, against a top pass defense and some here want to find fault. Frankly it is pretty pathetic, that now you have nothing to complain about with Wilson you basically are making something up, since you really do not know. To make it clear I do not blame the OP he never mentioned Wilson. I blame the ones that came after, that just couldn't help but blame something on Wilson when they really have no clue.
Same ol song and dance.

What do you think happened on the play? Yes he had a great game, what happened on the play?

Waiting...
 

Anthony!

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Scottemojo":3a2b14lj said:
Anthony!":3a2b14lj said:
First off the reality is no one really knows, could be a lot of things, the thing that I find really interesting is how some of you immediately said lets blame Wilson. I mean the guy played one off the best games of the season, against a top pass defense and some here want to find fault. Frankly it is pretty pathetic, that now you have nothing to complain about with Wilson you basically are making something up, since you really do not know. To make it clear I do not blame the OP he never mentioned Wilson. I blame the ones that came after, that just couldn't help but blame something on Wilson when they really have no clue.
Same ol song and dance.

What do you think happened on the play? Yes he had a great game, what happened on the play?

Waiting...


Same old group got to find something to complain about. I am trying to not point fingers at anyone as I do not see a need to, when we played such a great game. You guys seem to have to find something to complain about and you seem to always want that to be Wilson. On this play there could have been a lot of things that went wrong, but nope you guys go right to Wilson. Pathetic
 

Dizzlepdx

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Anthony!":1yr7arkr said:
Scottemojo":1yr7arkr said:
Anthony!":1yr7arkr said:
First off the reality is no one really knows, could be a lot of things, the thing that I find really interesting is how some of you immediately said lets blame Wilson. I mean the guy played one off the best games of the season, against a top pass defense and some here want to find fault. Frankly it is pretty pathetic, that now you have nothing to complain about with Wilson you basically are making something up, since you really do not know. To make it clear I do not blame the OP he never mentioned Wilson. I blame the ones that came after, that just couldn't help but blame something on Wilson when they really have no clue.
Same ol song and dance.

What do you think happened on the play? Yes he had a great game, what happened on the play?

Waiting...


Same old group got to find something to complain about. I am trying to not point fingers at anyone as I do not see a need to, when we played such a great game. You guys seem to have to find something to complain about and you seem to always want that to be Wilson. On this play there could have been a lot of things that went wrong, but nope you guys go right to Wilson. Pathetic


I think you missed the point of this conversation (or at least I think you did, others involved can tell me I'm wrong) which is the fun of going through a play where things didn't go perfect, and figure out 1)what they were trying to do and 2)What should have they been trying to do instead. I wouldn't worry about RW getting his feeling's hurt by some people suggesting he might have screwed up here.
 

Russell4Prez

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Sheesh, obviously some history in play here.....

As big of a fan as I am of Wilson, I don't think he's perfect. How many plays did they run? Is it reasonable to think that with the complexity of NFL defenses, Russell might get fooled every once in awhile? You know what the 'Hawks did on Monday morning? They looked at this very same play and as a team evaluated what went wrong. Who was to "blame" and how what can be done differently. If it was Russell's "fault", I sincerely doubt he broke down in tears, "why you guys always picking on me?!". No, he would have owned up to his mistake and had a serious discussion with his teammates about what he can do differently next time and what his teammates can do to help him. That's what Pro's do whether in football, engineering, or burger flipping. And that, IMO, is one of the big reasons why this team gets better every week -- nobody is above criticism, even Russell.
 

erik2690

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Tical21":2n7kn6mc said:
Fred can't stay in to block because his job is to make the LB vacate for Willson. Russell is clearly looking at Willson, who wins his route enough to have a pretty easy TD if Russell throws the ball, but he just didn't trust Luke and ate it.

Russ might have done something wrong, but I don't see the Luke TD as the missed part. He looks very well covered and his break looks kinda bad honestly. To me it looks like Doug as first read or nothing with that free runner. Am I totally misreading it because I genuinely didn't see Luke really open or making a good target on that play. When you factor in the 28 point lead I am that much more fine with not forcing it to Luke.

I truly would love an explanation of what I'm maybe missing that makes Luke a good or even decent option here. To me it looks like he has a bit of inside position maybe enough to catch it, but seems to make a kinda non-decisive break at the top of his route. I see it as the pressure getting there too quick for it to be much of an option anyway. So to me it's either Doug or you have to be picking up that free rusher.
 

Anthony!

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Dizzlepdx":2481vpn1 said:
Anthony!":2481vpn1 said:
Scottemojo":2481vpn1 said:
Anthony!":2481vpn1 said:
First off the reality is no one really knows, could be a lot of things, the thing that I find really interesting is how some of you immediately said lets blame Wilson. I mean the guy played one off the best games of the season, against a top pass defense and some here want to find fault. Frankly it is pretty pathetic, that now you have nothing to complain about with Wilson you basically are making something up, since you really do not know. To make it clear I do not blame the OP he never mentioned Wilson. I blame the ones that came after, that just couldn't help but blame something on Wilson when they really have no clue.
Same ol song and dance.

What do you think happened on the play? Yes he had a great game, what happened on the play?

Waiting...


Same old group got to find something to complain about. I am trying to not point fingers at anyone as I do not see a need to, when we played such a great game. You guys seem to have to find something to complain about and you seem to always want that to be Wilson. On this play there could have been a lot of things that went wrong, but nope you guys go right to Wilson. Pathetic


I think you missed the point of this conversation (or at least I think you did, others involved can tell me I'm wrong) which is the fun of going through a play where things didn't go perfect, and figure out 1)what they were trying to do and 2)What should have they been trying to do instead. I wouldn't worry about RW getting his feeling's hurt by some people suggesting he might have screwed up here.


I think you are missing the point, there were a lot of things that could have caused this play t go wrong, but notice how many went right to Wilson? Every game no matter how well he plays one of a few people always has to come up with some BS excuse why wilson did something wrong .Las week it was sack was his fault this week this play was his fault a play that mean nothing, a play were anyone of a number of things could have gone wrong but most blame Wilson. It gets really old when some here have to find fault no matter what.
 

olyfan63

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Anthony!":2pjriarq said:
First off the reality is no one really knows, could be a lot of things, the thing that I find really interesting is how some of you immediately said lets blame Wilson. I mean the guy played one off the best games of the season, against a top pass defense and some here want to find fault. Frankly it is pretty pathetic, that now you have nothing to complain about with Wilson you basically are making something up, since you really do not know. To make it clear I do not blame the OP he never mentioned Wilson. I blame the ones that came after, that just couldn't help but blame something on Wilson when they really have no clue.

What's truly pathetic is how often you use the word "pathetic" as a broad brush to attack and insult other posters, essentially anyone who dares even hint at a criticism of Wilson.

Playing NFL QB comes with second guessing as part of the territory. If anything, most of us here are marveling at the number of reads Wilson has to quickly make and seeing his thought process and knowing he has to do it in real time with extremely fast, strong, angry 300 pound men chasing him and trying to hurt him.

There's a thing called "dialogue", along with "breakdown" and "analysis" that are all part of the learning process for appreciating and enjoying this game we all love. This pattern of labeling, name-calling, as "pathetic", anyone who dares critique Wilson, has become a "broken record" with you. Does that record ever get unstuck? Got any other plays in the playbook?
 

mikeak

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Funny I don't recall reading any "that is Wilson's fault he sucks"

I just read people looking at the play seeing where the ball could have been thrown and it wasn't. So logical conclusion for those that saw that is hey that is on Wilson. Nothing more nothing less

Doesn't mean the same people don't think he walks on water - just means analyzing ONE play

There is however one constant. A poster trying to continuously start fights.....
 

Mistashoesta

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olyfan63":27twmr4m said:
What's truly pathetic is how often you use the word "pathetic" as a broad brush to attack and insult other posters, essentially anyone who dares even hint at a criticism of Wilson.

Playing NFL QB comes with second guessing as part of the territory. If anything, most of us here are marveling at the number of reads Wilson has to quickly make and seeing his thought process and knowing he has to do it in real time with extremely fast, strong, angry 300 pound men chasing him and trying to hurt him.

There's a thing called "dialogue", along with "breakdown" and "analysis" that are all part of the learning process for appreciating and enjoying this game we all love. This pattern of labeling, name-calling, as "pathetic", anyone who dares critique Wilson, has become a "broken record" with you. Does that record ever get unstuck? Got any other plays in the playbook?

Thumbsandammo 8

I didn't see anyone pulling out the kerosene or pitchforks. A little constructive banter between members should be what this place is about. You can only read so many 'Wilson is maaaannn' threads a week.
 

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