The Tuesday ESPN Seattle we need to run more narrative...

[Tokadub]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

 

[keasley45]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

I don't think it's BS at all. Given the things our passing game can't do, the logical strategic move to keep defenses guessing is to run more.

It's obvious that our success even prior to this year came on longer throws downfield. We have never been a surgical strike type of team where we dissect a defense with long, ball controlling drives full of short to medium timing passes and only occasional runs. That's just not Russ's game and I think it's fair to say after 10 years that that probably has something to do with his height, not being able to see short routes just beyond the line and thus needing to drop deeper in the pocket to get a better view of the field and wait for slightly longer routes to develop - but then also exposing himself to sacks because by design, he's holding the ball longer right off the bat.

If you can't keep defenses honest in defending your medium to long game with a consistent short, quick passing game (all year, defenses basically vacated the short / medium routes daring us to throw them and we never could),then you have to do it with a strong run game. This is as much, if not more Pete acknowledging what 9 years of working with RW has laid bare, than some stubborn desire to just run for running's sake. It's logical. Russel has immense skill, but also weaknesses. The shift to a competent run game is a move to address those weaknesses.

And honestly, assuming the above is true, I think it's extraordinarily loyal on Pete 's part to never just come out and say that all of this because of his QBs one true shortcoming ( no pun intended). Doing so would ding the image of RW, the short QB who never let his height slow him down. ---The sports hero who btw inspires legions with his lesson of never letting yiur limitations stop you.

When in reality, that limitation caused a bit of a conundrum for his offenses. Rather, in true Pete fashion, he makes it about just being more smashmouth, thereby rallying around his guy, and doing what he can to make his qb and team successful.

 

[Seahawk]

Run or pass, it comes down to the offensive line.
While I do think we did well to shore up the o-line for this season, it needs to be improved upon for next season.
If we are to continue to coddle Wilson by scheming for him to hold the ball longer due to his being too short to see those short routes, we need better offensive linemen than what we currently have.

 

[Maelstrom787]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

Wanna be the Packers? Everyone seems to wanna be the Packers.

They run it almost 6% more than Seattle did in 2020. Wanna know why? It makes Rodgers job easier, and it makes his offensive lines job easier.

 

[TraderGary]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

I don't think it's BS at all. Given the things our passing game can't do, the logical strategic move to keep defenses guessing is to run more.

It's obvious that our success even prior to this year came on longer throws downfield. We have never been a surgical strike type of team where we dissect a defense with long, ball controlling drives full of short to medium timing passes and only occasional runs. That's just not Russ's game and I think it's fair to say after 10 years that that probably has something to do with his height, not being able to see short routes just beyond the line and thus needing to drop deeper in the pocket to get a better view of the field and wait for slightly longer routes to develop - but then also exposing himself to sacks because by design, he's holding the ball longer right off the bat.

If you can't keep defenses honest in defending your medium to long game with a consistent short, quick passing game (all year, defenses basically vacated the short / medium routes daring us to throw them and we never could),then you have to do it with a strong run game. This is as much, if not more Pete acknowledging what 9 years of working with RW has laid bare, than some stubborn desire to just run for running's sake. It's logical. Russel has immense skill, but also weaknesses. The shift to a competent run game is a move to address those weaknesses.

And honestly, assuming the above is true, I think it's extraordinarily loyal on Pete 's part to never just come out and say that all of this because of his QBs one true shortcoming ( no pun intended). Doing so would ding the image of RW, the short QB who never let his height slow him down. ---The sports hero who btw inspires legions with his lesson of never letting yiur limitations stop you.

When in reality, that limitation caused a bit of a conundrum for his offenses. Rather, in true Pete fashion, he makes it about just being more smashmouth, thereby rallying around his guy, and doing what he can to make his qb and team successful.

With all due respect, I just don't buy this. Russ is basically the same height as Drew Brees, and Brees has excelled in the short passing game pretty much his entire career.

I don't know why Russ ignored wide-open receivers in the short and intermediate routes this past season, but I don't believe it's because of his height limitations. There were times when he was outside the pocket, no defensive linemen in his path, and had wide-open receivers directly in front of him, and still elected not to throw the ball to them for whatever reason. I believe there's something else at work here, but only Russ or the inner circle of the Seahawks would truly know what that is.

 

[OrangeGravy]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

Wanna be the Packers? Everyone seems to wanna be the Packers.

They run it almost 6% more than Seattle did in 2020. Wanna know why? It makes Rodgers job easier, and it makes his offensive lines job easier.

The went into last offseason with that specific goal in mind also. Run a bit more and be better at it. They being the Packers that is. I don't see why everyone is so worried about it.

 

[hawk45]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

I don't think it's BS at all. Given the things our passing game can't do, the logical strategic move to keep defenses guessing is to run more.

It's obvious that our success even prior to this year came on longer throws downfield. We have never been a surgical strike type of team where we dissect a defense with long, ball controlling drives full of short to medium timing passes and only occasional runs. That's just not Russ's game and I think it's fair to say after 10 years that that probably has something to do with his height, not being able to see short routes just beyond the line and thus needing to drop deeper in the pocket to get a better view of the field and wait for slightly longer routes to develop - but then also exposing himself to sacks because by design, he's holding the ball longer right off the bat.

If you can't keep defenses honest in defending your medium to long game with a consistent short, quick passing game (all year, defenses basically vacated the short / medium routes daring us to throw them and we never could),then you have to do it with a strong run game. This is as much, if not more Pete acknowledging what 9 years of working with RW has laid bare, than some stubborn desire to just run for running's sake. It's logical. Russel has immense skill, but also weaknesses. The shift to a competent run game is a move to address those weaknesses.

And honestly, assuming the above is true, I think it's extraordinarily loyal on Pete 's part to never just come out and say that all of this because of his QBs one true shortcoming ( no pun intended). Doing so would ding the image of RW, the short QB who never let his height slow him down. ---The sports hero who btw inspires legions with his lesson of never letting yiur limitations stop you.

When in reality, that limitation caused a bit of a conundrum for his offenses. Rather, in true Pete fashion, he makes it about just being more smashmouth, thereby rallying around his guy, and doing what he can to make his qb and team successful.

Great post.

 

[AROS]

I don't know why Russ ignored wide-open receivers in the short and intermediate routes this past season, but I don't believe it's because of his height limitations. There were times when he was outside the pocket, no defensive linemen in his path, and had wide-open receivers directly in front of him, and still elected not to throw the ball to them for whatever reason. I believe there's something else at work here, but only Russ or the inner circle of the Seahawks would truly know what that is.

I think there was a very human component to the head-scratching play decisions we saw Russ make in the second half of the season. I personally believe Russ - like many of us - became enamored with the Let Russell Cook mantra that permeated much of the offseason and the start of the season. The early success created all the buzz and hype nationally about Russ looking like the sure fire MVP for 2020. I'm quite sure Russ became enamored with that talk too.

Suddenly, I believe Russ felt compelled to keep going for the deep ball, the home run, to further cement his MVP campaign, even though signs were showing during the middle of the season that defenses were making the proper adjustments to kill the deep passing game we thrived off of in the early portion of the season.

This, to me, explains the otherwise baffling reason Russell was seemingly ignoring the easy check downs and mid route stuff. I don't think he suddenly became a bad QB, I just think he became very human this season, perhaps allowing himself to get caught up with all the Cook/MVP talk and hype. Something tells me he learned a valuable lesson this season and I would be extremely surprised if we see him do anything like we saw the latter portion of the season for the rest of his career, at least to any large degree.

For all of his talent, drive, character qualities, skill and dedication, he still is very much just human.

 

[scutterhawk]

I'm sorry but I just don't buy this at all even if that's what Pete said (I didn't even listen to or read anything the past about 48 hours I'm so triggered how bad this season ended)... I am still all for Pete as our coach but this is just down right ridiculous...

Carson is in his prime, AND we got Hyde...

What is the excuse we didn't run enough?

Carson is only going to be more unhealthy next season that's how bodies work...

Hyde never looked that great to begin with but he was underused in general...

Alex Collins could of maybe came in fresh and won the game but he was totally ignored in the playoffs just like Greg Olsen.

I feel like this whole we needed to run more excuse is total B&** $*&&.

We had the personell to run more this season, our run game will be weaker next season as it stands... am I missing something???!

Wanna be the Packers? Everyone seems to wanna be the Packers.

They run it almost 6% more than Seattle did in 2020. Wanna know why? It makes Rodgers job easier, and it makes his offensive lines job easier.

THIS^^.

 

[Tokadub]

Good responses, I was just trying to make the point that we should of ran more this season.

We had the personell to run THIS season so I'm concerned what makes us think we can do better next season if we might have worst personell for the run game?

Just wanted to clarify I don't think it's BS that we should of ran more or that we need too, I'm wondering why we didn't run more THIS year? That's why I think it's a lame excuse by Pete on this one.

 

[John63]

OKay reality check time. The avg olineman is 6foot 6. So if they are pass blocking that means that the only QB who could look over them would have to be at least 6 foot 6 and even then they could not see a Wr unless they were at least 10 yards away. All QBs need throwing lanes all of them. does not matter if your 5 foot 10 or 6 foot 4. Now lets remember who the QBs were before Wilson under PC, Matt Hasselbeck and Tavaris Jackson both over 6 foot. However, you will find they did not throw short over the middle much either. Now Why simple PC has said he does not like throwing over the middle. It is too risky to him, you have tips, drops, bobbles etc.

 

[Maelstrom787]

Good responses, I was just trying to make the point that we should of ran more this season.

We had the personell to run THIS season so I'm concerned what makes us think we can do better next season if we might have worst personell for the run game?

Just wanted to clarify I don't think it's BS that we should of ran more or that we need too, I'm wondering why we didn't run more THIS year? That's why I think it's a lame excuse by Pete on this one.

The fact they didn't run more this year is likely part of the reason Brian Schottenheimer is currently unemployed.

 

[hawk45]

Maelstrom is correct.

Defenses took away the deep shots. Counter that with either more rushing attempts to coax a light box or passing short middle.

Schotty schemed short middle routes which were open. Russ couldn't hit them, demonstrably so in the playoff game.

I understand Schotty, neither he nor Russ wanted to admit that Russ's limitations meant that we couldn't pass our way out of it but needed to rush more.

Perhaps a passing savant OC *might* present a solution, but that clashes with Pete's philosophy, so Pete correctly assessed that Schotty needed to go. We will get a run first OC, and it can succeed provided we get an OC who can be more creative in the rushing attack.

A Brady or Brees could dink and dunk defenses to bring the SS down in the box, but that's not within Russ's skillset.

Our team will run the ball effectively, or fail to be effective. Period.

 

[John63]

Maelstrom is correct.

Defenses took away the deep shots. Counter that with either more rushing attempts to coax a light box or passing short middle.

Schotty schemed short middle routes which were open. Russ couldn't hit them, demonstrably so in the playoff game.

I understand Schotty, neither he nor Russ wanted to admit that Russ's limitations meant that we couldn't pass our way out of it but needed to rush more.

Perhaps a passing savant OC *might* present a solution, but that clashes with Pete's philosophy, so Pete correctly assessed that Schotty needed to go. We will get a run first OC, and it can succeed provided we get an OC who can be more creative in the rushing attack.

A Brady or Brees could dink and dunk defenses to bring the SS down in the box, but that's not within Russ's skillset.

Our team will run the ball effectively, or fail to be effective. Period.

Please prove it's not in his skill set?

 

[BirdsCommaAngry]

This narrative about everything being a narrative just makes me sick.

 

[hawk45]

Maelstrom is correct.

Defenses took away the deep shots. Counter that with either more rushing attempts to coax a light box or passing short middle.

Schotty schemed short middle routes which were open. Russ couldn't hit them, demonstrably so in the playoff game.

I understand Schotty, neither he nor Russ wanted to admit that Russ's limitations meant that we couldn't pass our way out of it but needed to rush more.

Perhaps a passing savant OC *might* present a solution, but that clashes with Pete's philosophy, so Pete correctly assessed that Schotty needed to go. We will get a run first OC, and it can succeed provided we get an OC who can be more creative in the rushing attack.

A Brady or Brees could dink and dunk defenses to bring the SS down in the box, but that's not within Russ's skillset.

Our team will run the ball effectively, or fail to be effective. Period.

Please prove it's not in his skill set?

If you ever posted anything on the subject I’d Wilson in good faith I’d point you to a heat map and start the discussion there, and then talk about how reviewing game footage this year, especially for games where complaints arose about no short routes, and staring at the short middle after the snap, one can find hitches, crosses, and outlets all over the place that Russ either ignored completely or stares down and then turtles for a sack.

Anyone watching brees fit passes in to his tight ends over the middle in the wild card round immediately recognizes Russ would never test those windows, and honestly we wouldn’t want him to because he lacks brees’s anticipation to overcome a height challenge.

Russ is a championship caliber QB but his strengths are unique to him and so are his limitations.

 

[John63]

Maelstrom is correct.

Defenses took away the deep shots. Counter that with either more rushing attempts to coax a light box or passing short middle.

Schotty schemed short middle routes which were open. Russ couldn't hit them, demonstrably so in the playoff game.

I understand Schotty, neither he nor Russ wanted to admit that Russ's limitations meant that we couldn't pass our way out of it but needed to rush more.

Perhaps a passing savant OC *might* present a solution, but that clashes with Pete's philosophy, so Pete correctly assessed that Schotty needed to go. We will get a run first OC, and it can succeed provided we get an OC who can be more creative in the rushing attack.

A Brady or Brees could dink and dunk defenses to bring the SS down in the box, but that's not within Russ's skillset.

Our team will run the ball effectively, or fail to be effective. Period.

Please prove it's not in his skill set?

If you ever posted anything on the subject I’d Wilson in good faith I’d point you to a heat map and start the discussion there, and then talk about how reviewing game footage this year, especially for games where complaints arose about no short routes, and staring at the short middle after the snap, one can find hitches, crosses, and outlets all over the place that Russ either ignored completely or stares down and then turtles for a sack.

Anyone watching brees fit passes in to his tight ends over the middle in the wild card round immediately recognizes Russ would never test those windows, and honestly we wouldn’t want him to because he lacks brees’s anticipation to overcome a height challenge.

Russ is a championship caliber QB but his strengths are unique to him and so are his limitations.

I have seen heat maps and he is well abive 60% completion percentage. Now u want to say he does not do it often fine. Under PC the 2 QBs before Wilson did not throw over the middle much either. PC does not like it.

 

[chris98251]

Maelstrom is correct.

Defenses took away the deep shots. Counter that with either more rushing attempts to coax a light box or passing short middle.

Schotty schemed short middle routes which were open. Russ couldn't hit them, demonstrably so in the playoff game.

I understand Schotty, neither he nor Russ wanted to admit that Russ's limitations meant that we couldn't pass our way out of it but needed to rush more.

Perhaps a passing savant OC *might* present a solution, but that clashes with Pete's philosophy, so Pete correctly assessed that Schotty needed to go. We will get a run first OC, and it can succeed provided we get an OC who can be more creative in the rushing attack.

A Brady or Brees could dink and dunk defenses to bring the SS down in the box, but that's not within Russ's skillset.

Our team will run the ball effectively, or fail to be effective. Period.

Please prove it's not in his skill set?

If you ever posted anything on the subject I’d Wilson in good faith I’d point you to a heat map and start the discussion there, and then talk about how reviewing game footage this year, especially for games where complaints arose about no short routes, and staring at the short middle after the snap, one can find hitches, crosses, and outlets all over the place that Russ either ignored completely or stares down and then turtles for a sack.

Anyone watching brees fit passes in to his tight ends over the middle in the wild card round immediately recognizes Russ would never test those windows, and honestly we wouldn’t want him to because he lacks brees’s anticipation to overcome a height challenge.

Russ is a championship caliber QB but his strengths are unique to him and so are his limitations.

I have seen heat maps and he is well abive 60% completion percentage. Now u want to say he does not do it often fine. Under PC the 2 QBs before Wilson did not throw over the middle much either. PC does not like it.

This is truth, watch where he does throw the ball it's almost always high and away or over head, rarely in contested areas. When he does it is usually during 4th quarter come backs when he is calling the plays himself mostly.

 

[OrangeGravy]

I don't know why Russ ignored wide-open receivers in the short and intermediate routes this past season, but I don't believe it's because of his height limitations. There were times when he was outside the pocket, no defensive linemen in his path, and had wide-open receivers directly in front of him, and still elected not to throw the ball to them for whatever reason. I believe there's something else at work here, but only Russ or the inner circle of the Seahawks would truly know what that is.

I think there was a very human component to the head-scratching play decisions we saw Russ make in the second half of the season. I personally believe Russ - like many of us - became enamored with the Let Russell Cook mantra that permeated much of the offseason and the start of the season. The early success created all the buzz and hype nationally about Russ looking like the sure fire MVP for 2020. I'm quite sure Russ became enamored with that talk too.

Suddenly, I believe Russ felt compelled to keep going for the deep ball, the home run, to further cement his MVP campaign, even though signs were showing during the middle of the season that defenses were making the proper adjustments to kill the deep passing game we thrived off of in the early portion of the season.

This, to me, explains the otherwise baffling reason Russell was seemingly ignoring the easy check downs and mid route stuff. I don't think he suddenly became a bad QB, I just think he became very human this season, perhaps allowing himself to get caught up with all the Cook/MVP talk and hype. Something tells me he learned a valuable lesson this season and I would be extremely surprised if we see him do anything like we saw the latter portion of the season for the rest of his career, at least to any large degree.

For all of his talent, drive, character qualities, skill and dedication, he still is very much just human.

I think his head is still there. Nothing he's said so far since the Schotty firing leads me to believe otherwise. The telling phrase for me was when he referenced how important this point in time is to his career. It feels like winning is now the means to his career/legacy end goals, when winning should be the end goal. And you are right, it's only human to think that way when you're where he's at in his career. He doesn't want to win any less. He just wants to win for different reasons now. He's gonna have to do a better job of managing that tug o war going forward though cause the stats/legacy side is winning that battle.

 

[OrangeGravy]

Maelstrom is correct.

Defenses took away the deep shots. Counter that with either more rushing attempts to coax a light box or passing short middle.

Schotty schemed short middle routes which were open. Russ couldn't hit them, demonstrably so in the playoff game.

I understand Schotty, neither he nor Russ wanted to admit that Russ's limitations meant that we couldn't pass our way out of it but needed to rush more.

Perhaps a passing savant OC *might* present a solution, but that clashes with Pete's philosophy, so Pete correctly assessed that Schotty needed to go. We will get a run first OC, and it can succeed provided we get an OC who can be more creative in the rushing attack.

A Brady or Brees could dink and dunk defenses to bring the SS down in the box, but that's not within Russ's skillset.

Our team will run the ball effectively, or fail to be effective. Period.

I'm with you on this. Nobody wants to hear it, but it's the truth. Russell can at times execute that passing game, but he hasn't shown any consistency doing it in 10 years. Maybe if the right guy comes in with the scheme and communication skills to unlock that in Russ it can be done, but I don't think Pete is gonna push his chips in on that move. Nor should he. I have no problem with a coach going with what he knows. He'll either be successful enough to keep his job or he won't. The wrong move is trying to be something you're not and getting caught in the doldrums like we did this year.