Seahawks possibly trding Irvin to ATL draft ramifications

[McGruff]

I wanted to add this to my discussion with Hasselbeck: while the current roster is not full of holes, there are some salaries to replace in 2016. One of my favorite things about JS is that he will be looking to 2016 in the current draft. Last year he tried that shotgun approach with Gilliam and Scott. It didn't work out, but there is no doubt in my mind that potentially replacing Okung's salary was behind it. And that was with 2 years left on Okung's deal.

So when you add contracts you might try to eliminate to the list of roster holes, that number of picks becomes a bit more tenable.

Absolutely agreed. 2016 is a year we could start hemorraging bloated contracts and aging defensive linemen. This js the year to add and groom depth tonstep upnbehind them.

and while our starters are mostly set, our depth at almost every position is below average. Spots 23-53 are definintely vulnerable to quality competition.

and FTR I think Gilliam is still firmly on iur radar as our LT of the future.

 

[Chawker]

We'll have to see who they select at #8 but I'd tend to think a deal would have to be in place before hand.

if we swapped our second round selections and got Bartu for Irvan that could work. Letting Bartu & KPL battle it out for the starting roll.

Which still leave us wondering who we select @ # 42?

 

[Attyla the Hawk]

How many holes does this team really have right now?
- Interior line
- DL depth
- WR
- Secondary depth

.. That's really it to me? Do you really need 12 picks to address all those needs?

I'll speculate by group:

OL: 5 locks (Okung, Bailey, Sweezy, Britt, Gilliam), 4 open positions
WR: 1 lock (Baldwin). 1 possible (Richardson may be IRed). 4 open positions.
TE: 1 lock (Graham). 1 solid (Willson). 1-2 open positions
RB: 1 lock (Lynch). 2 solid (Turbin, Coleman). 2 open positions
QB: 1 lock (Wilson). 1 open position

DL: 3 locks: (Bennett, Avril, Hill). 3 Solid (Mebane, McDaniel, Marsh). 3 open positions
LB: 3 locks: (Wright, Wagner, KPL). 1 solid (Irvin). 2 open positions.
CB: 3 locks: (Simon, Sherman, Williams). 1 possible IR (Lane). 2 open positions
S: 3 locks: (Thomas, Chancellor, Shead). 1 open position

Solid players would be guys I can see us either trading or letting go by this time in 2016 (age or cap casualty). These are players I'd expect we would take the opportunity to plow under if given the chance. But otherwise are expected to return to the team this year.

I may have missed a few, but I'm seeing 13 open positions on the offense. And 8 open positions on the defense. By open, I'm inferring that these are either complete roster voids or positions that have simply not been locked down yet. I'm not considering development guys we've recently drafted. If they are still developing, then the position isn't closed.

I'm also seeing an additional 3 potential upgrade positions on offense, and 4 on defense that we may need to address this year or next.

That's 16 potential additions on offense and 12 on defense. I'm pretty sure we could make use of all 12 picks to add to this mix. Not all of our development guys will pop this year. Some of those guys are nearing the end of their rookie contracts. Seattle does need to reload in several areas.

 

[randomation]

What about Irvin plus either Cmike or Turbin?

 

[jammerhawk]

My feeling was that they are NOT going to be able to sit there and watch 62 players leave. Regardless of how many are on their board. With that many picks, they will be making a deal, and that is why I singled out Irvin early yesterday.

I dunno, perhaps so, on the trading up thing. I frankly could see them trade away the 2nd rd. pick and move back into the early 3rd and in doing so acquiring another 4th rd pick. With only a few odd exceptions there isn't much between the players after the 20th pick and those that can be acquired in the 3rd and 4th round where the meat of this draft can be found. That said, I could see the team packaging Irvin if DGB fell far enough for the Hawks to move up in the 2nd. To me however he's the only guy I see them likely wanting to trade up to grab.

Still suspect this is all speculation. Interesting though.

 

[DJrmb]

It's comical how many people have bought the DGB Smokescreen. Hook, Line, and Sinker...

When has accurate draft info Ever leaked out about who we're targeting in the upper rounds during the John/Pete era???

:17:

 

[titan3131]

It's comical how many people have bought the DGB Smokescreen. Hook, Line, and Sinker...

When has accurate draft info Ever leaked out about who we're targeting in the upper rounds during the John/Pete era???

:17:

CHRISTINE MICHAEL

 

[DJrmb]

It's comical how many people have bought the DGB Smokescreen. Hook, Line, and Sinker...

When has accurate draft info Ever leaked out about who we're targeting in the upper rounds during the John/Pete era???

:17:

CHRISTINE MICHAEL

Paul Richardson?

Really? I don't remember anyone before the draft saying Seattle was draft Richardson? The most I remember is Richard being lumped in with a bunch of receivers that we could target around where we were picking...

 

[DJrmb]

It's comical how many people have bought the DGB Smokescreen. Hook, Line, and Sinker...

When has accurate draft info Ever leaked out about who we're targeting in the upper rounds during the John/Pete era???

:17:

CHRISTINE MICHAEL

I kind of give you Michael although it was still a shock to most everyone because no one thought we were spending a high pick on RB. Also most of the talk came from Michael himself. If he'd kept his mouth shut no one would have thought that at all.

To be fair I'm not talking about someone "Guessing right" just because they threw a pick out there and happened to be right. Anyone can do that. I'm talking about actual information being leaked from the team about a player they are targeting that high in the draft.

All this talk about the Seahawks wanting to trade up for DGB is bogus. Do I think they have interest in him? Sure, he's on their board, but anything more than that I highly doubt...

 

[titan3131]

Thats correct I totally forgot that baldwin called it.

And kearly called it before Cmikes tweets

 

[DJrmb]

It's comical how many people have bought the DGB Smokescreen. Hook, Line, and Sinker...

When has accurate draft info Ever leaked out about who we're targeting in the upper rounds during the John/Pete era???

:17:

CHRISTINE MICHAEL

I kind of give you Michael although it was still a shock to most everyone because no one thought we were spending a high pick on RB. Also most of the talk came from Michael himself. If he'd kept his mouth shut no one would have thought that at all.

To be fair I'm not talking about someone "Guessing right" just because they threw a pick out there and happened to be right. Anyone can do that. I'm talking about actual information being leaked from the team about a player they are targeting that high in the draft.

All this talk about the Seahawks wanting to trade up for DGB is bogus. Do I think they have interest in him? Sure, he's on their board, but anything more than that I highly doubt...

Cp
How do you think real leaks happen? They don't come directly from the team, they come from someone in the know. Baldwin very easily could have been privy to that information.


Anyway, feel free to write off any other examples, apparently you are the sole judge as to what is and isn't a leak.

Ok so all your "leaks" the Seahawks found ways to go get them right?

Come back after the draft and let me know if we have DGB on our team... I'll Gladly eat the Crow if you will...

:snack:

 

[DJrmb]

Ok so all your "leaks" the Seahawks found ways to go get them right?

Come back after the draft and let me know if we have DGB on our team...

:snack:

Please show me where I said we would draft DGB or that any leak saying so was credible? You asked when has any draft leak been accurate. You were shown two examples almost immediately. They were proven to be accurate by the fact that we took the players that were leaked. Pretty simple. Anything else you have to say on the subject is moot, so keep snacking.

Wow panties bunch much?

1 example was legit (Michael) the other is arguable. Just because you believe it was 100% doesn't mean it is. Players don't know the draft board. I wish I could find the interview, but I haven't been able to locate it yet, but JS was being asked about the draft and how they make the board and keep things so secret and he mentioned that his scouts don't even get to know the full board until draft day...

Doug Baldwin made a good educated guess:

http://seahawksdraftblog.com/paul-richardson-the-plan-the-pick-the-tape

Hardly leaked info IMHO...

Anyway, clearly you're the type of person that can't understand someone having a different opinion than you and get all flustered. We're all supposed to be Seahawks fans but you want to call people out as being "moot" because they have a different idea than you. Do you drive a big pickup truck to help you compensate as well?

 

[McGruff]

Cp
How do you think real leaks happen? They don't come directly from the team, they come from someone in the know. Baldwin very easily could have been privy to that information.


Anyway, feel free to write off any other examples, apparently you are the sole judge as to what is and isn't a leak.

I remember Matt Hasselbeck once answering a reporter in the week of the draft if Matt knew who the Seahawks were drafting.

Matt said, "Probably a center."

Many at the time took it as a dig at his good friend Robbie Tobeck, but that was the year they drafted Chris Spencer in the first round.

Players spill the beans all the time.

 

[DJrmb]

BTW I will even consider JS coming out after the draft and stating that we were targeting DGB and trying to move up for him, he doesn't have to make it on our team. However in my opinion this is 100% smokescreen and John will never say that...

 

[Lords of Scythia]

Bruce Irvin has

16.5 sacks
3 forced fumbles
3 interceptions

in 3 years...

And he's 28. :!:

People forget how old he was entering the draft.

There's no way in hell Bruce Irvin can fetch a 1st rounder.. so we can cut that theory out now :lol:

To me.. it feels like a deal on the table where the Seahawks are saying "If ____ is at 42, we'll kick over 63 and Irvin for that pick." You can fill in the blank to your choosing (I believe it's either DGB or an OL they are eyeing that could slip a bit)

One thing is for certain though. If they just flat out trade him for a pick.. the Seahawks WILL move up at some point in this draft.. and it's very likely happening Friday. Because there is no way this team will draft 12 players this weekend. The math just doesn't fit.

There is one thing I don't understand about that.
Every year, when you add UDFA signings to drafted players, there are near 20. So why is 12 an untenable number of draftees? An extra year of team control for 3 or 4 extra draftees, a slightly higher quality talent pool for a handful of the 20 or so 2015 prospects who will come to camp...educate me on why 11 or 12 picks would be so bad.

How many holes does this team really have right now?
- Interior line
- DL depth
- WR
- Secondary depth

.. That's really it to me? Do you really need 12 picks to address all those needs? Why take 2 or 3 guys that may be ok, that you have to either cut present players to fit on the roster or hope you can hide them on the practice squad.. when you can move up for the 1 guy you really covet.

11 or 12 picks would be great if we were the Jaguars. This team is stacked .. and the UDFA adds another element to this, considering they usually find a couple UDFA's that stick around and actually perform better than some draft picks.

They'd probably like to get a good backup/future replacement for Okung as well at some point.

 

[original poster]

^^We will certainly need it!

 

[titan3131]

rob crisp or gilliam is our LT of the future.

 

[kearly]

I would rather keep Irvin. Pass rushers often wait until their late 20s or early 30s to hit their stride. Irvin showed encouraging progress as a pass rusher last season, and at worst is a size + speed linebacker who takes well to coaching. I would refuse anything less than Atlanta's early 2nd rounder.

The only way it makes sense to trade Irvin for less than that is if Seattle has already decided to move on from him in 2016, which I would consider a mistake. But even in that scenario, you'd have one more season of Irvin on the cheap before getting a 4th or 5th round compensatory pick. Add those those two things together and it would take at least a 3rd round pick for the trade to make any sense for Seattle.

 

[kearly]

Between this and the Bennett rumors, I think it's safe to say that Dan Quinn via his GM and JS have had plenty of discussions this offseason regarding pass rushers. I doubt anything actually happens, but the talks themselves make plenty of sense from Atlanta's point of view, and JS will always listen to offers.

 

[kearly]

Calvin Johnson's first year was for 756 yards and 4 TDs. So yeah, immediate impact from even an outlier body type doesn't happen often. Explosive rookie WRs are rare.

I think usage is the key to getting immediate impact. Doug Baldwin had a good season as a rookie because the team knew what kind of player he was and didn't make things too complicated for him. I think that Richardson looked pretty good as a rookie once the Hawks figured out what kind of WR he was.

A guy like Devin Smith, who knows how to get open deep and track the ball as good as anyone, will probably hit the ground running if used the way Mike Wallace was in Pittsburgh. Even a raw WR like Conley or Perriman could do some damage early on if used to their strengths.

Of course, no Hawk WR is going to be a fantasy starter. But in terms of production per target, I am a believer in seeing immediate results for Seattle. That's also why they were able to move on so quickly from guys like Durham and Harper, or for that matter, even Percy Harvin. I don't think it takes very long to know if a WR is cut out for our offense or not.