Seahawks offseason improvement ranking, per PFF

[TwistedHusky]

Acer,

Do you have any actual proof that Carroll wants to win more than anything else?

Enough to say you can call it a fact? That might be a reach.

It sure does not look like that statement is correct at all.

 

[nwHawk]

Are you offering an alternative that Pete may be leaning on?

 

[Maelstrom787]

Acer,

Do you have any actual proof that Carroll wants to win more than anything else?

Enough to say you can call it a fact? That might be a reach.

It sure does not look like that statement is correct at all.

What are you implying here? Deliberate sabotage? Just for fun?

 

[seabowl]

Same as every QB did you bother to see what Mahomes did last year 5 straight games under 80 passers I think the problem is you and others hold Wilson to a standard that can never be met.

Seems to be the only thing you want to talk about are his bad games not his good ones, and try to find anything to complain about.

let me help you Wilsoj sucked in the last second of OT. there you go that is about as good as anything you have said.

Nice try though.

I have his jersey and have watched every single game of his since he came into the league. Loved him as our qb but as I and many others have said, he regressed tremendously since mid 2020. He had become a shell of his former self both physically and mentally. Time will tell who is right.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Deliberate sabotage?
Are we at all or nothing? He doesn't need to sabotage the team to not win playoff games. But a lack of commitment to winning the damned things can prevent that outcome if that isn't your goal in the first place.

Systems tend to produce the results they were designed to deliver. At least systems that have been in place for some time. Now that may not be the thing you THINK they are intended to produce and it does not prevent them from delivering the result you hope from it - but often those are nice to haves...not requisites.

Carroll wants to win, his way. But what is more important to Carroll, winning or control? If you look at the Seahawks the past 5 years, control seems to be the driving factor - not success.


The goal of many sports teams often isn't even to win a Championship. It is to drive revenue and fan investment AND most important, to increase the value of the investment made in the team (ie estimated/sale value vs purchase price). And there is an incremental cost of producing better than .500. At some point the higher costs to compete creates diminishing returns. Right now, our system gets us a better than .500 record and the ability to look competitive as a playoff team. Is that on purpose? Sure seems like it.

 

[WarHawks]

That seems unlikely WarHawks.

The trend appears downward.

But maybe I am missing something.

So far, can you share the roster moves that make any argument this team will be better than last year or the year before that? (Understanding the #s are skewed for last year because we had an injured/half-effective QB for half the year).

The new DC is promising because you honestly cannot get much worse than 'near the worst in the history of the NFL'

But what leads to these more positive expectations you feel are possible?

The trend always appears downward when you're at or near the bottom of the pendulum swing. But it will swing back up, and now is the time. I didn't say it's going to happen tomorrow. It's likely going to take a few years. However, there's no need to re-invent the wheel now. Just reload and replicate what we did before, which we can afford to do now that Russ' huge contract isn't weighing us down. Simply put, they did it before, and they can do it again. Will they? That's where the faith part comes in.

 

[John63]

I have his jersey and have watched every single game of his since he came into the league. Loved him as our qb but as I and many others have said, he regressed tremendously since mid 2020. He had become a shell of his former self both physically and mentally. Time will tell who is right.

And in there lies were we disagree. And you are right time will tell

 

[GemCity]

Statistically, I believe Russ will have one of his best years. But, the AFC West appears to be the strongest division heading into this year.

I find it hard to believe that people find it hard to believe why Russ wanted to leave. PC and JS had success before. Maybe they will again. But, Russ had to feel as if he was capable of so much more. When you average in the lower 3rd (that’s being modest) in passing attempts as a future HOF’er, it’s not hard to see why there was frustration.

I believe PCs model can work. I just don’t think it will happen again under his tenure. Drafting by need instead of the best player available (there’s an argument for both approaches), when selecting by need…not taking the best player available, not playing to his rosters strengths, etc.

Frankly, the inability to adapt to the obvious is the biggest flaw imo. 2018 playoff game against Dallas. You don’t run into a stacked box 13 times against what was arguably the leagues best run defense. You don’t play soft zone with a less than two score game on the line with an entire quarter left.

The magical wins….sorry, most of those were a direct result of Russell’s ability to create. Maybe he’s lost some of that? I don’t know.

What I do know is that the “Russ Haters”, as they’re referred to on this board, will look real stupid this year. The excuses will come flying. “So what. Denver placed third in their division”. “Better line”. “Weaker schedule” maybe. Whatever.

We’ll see!

 

[themunn]

When you average in the lower 3rd (that’s being modest) in passing attempts as a future HOF’er, it’s not hard to see why there was frustration.

How much of that is down to Russell and his inability to convert third down however and keep drives going? What he was able to do with his legs for the first many years of his career has slowly been leaving him and we have been one of the worst teams at converting 3rd down (and giving him opportunities to pass more).

Historically Wilson has been at his best when the run game is flowing - it took Penny breaking out last year for his stats to look great again, and even in 2020 the only game we lost once Carroll reigned in his cooking was the game where we tried to pass more than run (Giants).

I wish Wilson all the best but I'm excited to see a team that keeps on schedule and converts more than a few third downs each game

 

[acer1240]

Acer,

Do you have any actual proof that Carroll wants to win more than anything else?

Enough to say you can call it a fact? That might be a reach.

It sure does not look like that statement is correct at all.

Oh c'mon Twisted. I get that you may not like him as a coach but that man has been about winning his whole life. It was one of the greatest days in Seattle history when he got hired.

You're a good dude but I can't believe that you would even imply that Pete doesn't live and breathe Seahawks football. The point I was making is that Russell began to put himself above the team and city. He is on record saying he wanted to be a Hawk for life while beating his trade me drums behind the scenes. I hope this works out just like Griffeys bitch move did.

 

[BASF]

Some of you are seriously stuck on years ago and I don't know, checked out last season? Go back and watch the press conferences from last year. Carroll, Waldron and Wilson all said that he was able to change whatever play he wanted. When asked about Carroll saying that he would have liked Wilson to take the check downs to move the chains, Wilson straight up said that he knew what he was doing and was not going to change his mind set while throwing into double coverage downfield and eschewing the open underneath players. His mind set cost us at least three games last year. In a season that we had a losing record, those three games would have made a difference. He was the one that wanted to run the same offense as he has run for the past few years instead of the plays Waldron was calling in the first game. Those plays took the focus off of his hero ball play.

Russell Wilson put himself above the team at the start of 2020. When he started talking about his legacy, he was no longer a team leader. He was thinking of his own success. I am not even going to start on his deficiencies as a QB, because several of us have covered them ad nauseum and we get labelled haters simply because we don't try to gloss over his play or his me first attitude.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Acer,

If the Seahawks have no chance at a SB, Pete knows this and puts a system into place to make us competitive in the regular season - and maybe even tease the possibility of making the playoffs...is that a massive negative?

Pete runs an org. He is in a position of power. Many people that run orgs then focus more on consolidating their power, ensconcing themselves, than the goals of the org. That is more human nature than anything.

Pete delivered a SB to this team. And for the first 5 years, because of that, I was of the opinion he could just sit in a deck chair on the sideline drinking a beer all game and I would have been fine. He earned a lot of leeway giving us 1 SB win and 2 trips.

But it has been almost 10 years. And he just ran off the one chance we had to compete in the playoffs (it would have had to be under a different coach).

I think Carroll wants to win. But his priority appears to be preserving his power and control more than improving the prospects of the team. Norton is the prime example. How does one of the most incompetent DCs in the history of football keep his job for almost 5 years? It looks like Pete prized loyalty to him and his ability to control his DC, over the ability and acumen of his coordinator.

So how many people in the org have been promoted because of their loyalty to Carroll vs exceptional ability? And how many exceptional people have we lost because of that?

Based on the actual outcomes, it is completely in-bounds to question whether winning is a priority for Carroll. Because his decisions seem more rooted in his ability to stay in his comfort zone and to stay in control, than to actually maximize win % and playoff success. Almost as if that isn't a priority.