Rapoport: Wilson's agent likely to end contract talks soon

[seahawks08]

QB is not the only or the most important position in Pete's system. Pete believes he can still win games with a serviceable QB. Look at his college history where any QB he brought in never did well in the national level with the exception of Carlson Palmer. We just got lucky that we have a great QB who is hard working, has a great work ethic and has the skills. That is very rare talent to come by. So from Russel's point of view, he is the most important piece of the Seahawks puzzle. Pete accepts that, but he wants to build the team around the defense and not a team around a QB. History tells us if we build a team around a high powered QB, it is just putting all eggs in a basket and just hope the QB is not injured. Win loss percentage for any team build around QBs is always depended on the QB playing week in and week out. The moment the QB goes down, the teams season is over. Pete believes strongly the team should win and compete regardless of a single individual. This philosophy that Pete believes strongly will be the sticking point in how much of dollars get paid to a QB. When you have a coach who believes strongly in his philosophy, you cannot have the team paying Aaron Rodgers kind of money for Wilson. That's my personal opinion listening to Pete many times in the early years of when he started coaching the Seahawks. I can see why Pete thinks that way, but I also feel the Bills are a QB away from becoming a great team. So is there a middle ground for both parties?

 

[StoneCold]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

 

[rideaducati]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

I would be elated. He'd be considered underpaid by the third year.

 

[hawknation2015]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

Assuming we are talking about new money and a reasonable amount of guarantees, elated . . . and the FO most likely would be too.

The only way a deal is not done by training camp is if Russell's agent is asking for something unreasonable that would hurt the team.

 

[StoneCold]

How high can the number go without hurting the team? I realize this is speculation, but I'm ok with it as long as we don't impugn anyone.

SC

 

[HawkFan72]

I'm just looking forward to all the backpedaling after he signs. Gonna' be entertaining.

Agreed!

I'm thinking that Wilson has already agreed to a deal but, the Seahawks are tring to ink Wagner before they release the deal with Russ. Or maybe Wagner and (God forbid Irvin). Me personally, Irvin
would look good in a Atlanta uniform. Kick that chick to the shore! cheers!

People have been saying "Russ has already agreed to a deal" since before Free Agency started.

The Seahawks will announce it as soon as it is really done. I'm pretty sure he hasn't agreed to anything.

 

[hawknation2015]

How high can the number go without hurting the team? I realize this is speculation, but I'm ok with it as long as we don't impugn anyone.

SC

IMO, anything he is asking for, above being the highest paid player in the game, is hurting the team. If we can keep his cap hits to 13% or under, we will be in great shape.

 

[Tical21]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

If he was going to sign for 22 APY he would have been signed already.

 

[StoneCold]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

If he was going to sign for 22 APY he would have been signed already.

It was your comment that he's not worth AR money that prompted my question. 22.5 would make him higher paid than AR. Would you be happy with that?

HN2015, what number per year would a 13% cap hit represent?

SC

 

[hawknation2015]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

If he was going to sign for 22 APY he would have been signed already.

It was your comment that he's not worth AR money that prompted my question. 22.5 would make him higher paid than AR. Would you be happy with that?

HN2015, what number per year would a 13% cap hit represent?

SC

It's not possible to answer that question with any certainty, due to the unknown variables, i.e. the various ways it could be structured and exactly how much the total cap will be. But $22.5 million APY in new money would probably equate to around 12-13% of the cap in 2016.

$30 million signing bonus, $22.5 million APY in new money over four years:
2015 cap hit:
$6,544,868
2016 cap hit: ~$20 million
$6 million prorated signing bonus + ~$14 million in base salary =
~$20 million / ~$160 million, or ~12.5% of the total cap.

 

[rideaducati]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

If he was going to sign for 22 APY he would have been signed already.

It was your comment that he's not worth AR money that prompted my question. 22.5 would make him higher paid than AR. Would you be happy with that?

HN2015, what number per year would a 13% cap hit represent?

SC

The cap is 143.28 million x 13% = 18,626,400
Next year estimated cap of 150 million x 13% = 19.5 million

 

[StoneCold]

Rodgers is getting 22mil per year on average. If Russell signed for 22.5 mil a year would you be disappointed or elated?

SC

If he was going to sign for 22 APY he would have been signed already.

It was your comment that he's not worth AR money that prompted my question. 22.5 would make him higher paid than AR. Would you be happy with that?

HN2015, what number per year would a 13% cap hit represent?

SC

It's not possible to answer that question with any certainty, due to the unknown variables, i.e. the various ways it could be structured and exactly how much the total cap will be. But $22.5 million APY in new money would probably equate to around 12-13% of the cap in 2016.

$30 million signing bonus, $22.5 million APY in new money over four years:
2015 cap hit:
$6,544,868
2016 cap hit: ~$20 million
$6 million prorated signing bonus + ~$14 million in base salary =
~$20 million / ~$160 million, or ~12.5% of the total cap.

That's close enough. I wanted to understand where, in people's minds, RW starts getting into Dirt Bag territory. Looks like anything more than 22.5 starts to ruffle feathers.

Thanks,
SC

 

[rideaducati]

It's not possible to answer that question with any certainty, due to the unknown variables, i.e. the various ways it could be structured and exactly how much the total cap will be. But $22.5 million APY in new money would probably equate to around 12-13% of the cap in 2016.

$30 million signing bonus, $22.5 million APY in new money over four years:
2015 cap hit:
$6,544,868
2016 cap hit: ~$20 million
$6 million prorated signing bonus + ~$14 million in base salary =
~$20 million / ~$160 million, or ~12.5% of the total cap.

That's close enough. I wanted to understand where, in people's minds, RW starts getting into Dirt Bag territory. Looks like anything more than 22.5 starts to ruffle feathers.

Thanks,
SC

Dirt bag territory starts when the team plane starts it's descent into St. Louis.

 

[hawknation2015]

It's not possible to answer that question with any certainty, due to the unknown variables, i.e. the various ways it could be structured and exactly how much the total cap will be. But $22.5 million APY in new money would probably equate to around 12-13% of the cap in 2016.

$30 million signing bonus, $22.5 million APY in new money over four years:
2015 cap hit:
$6,544,868
2016 cap hit: ~$20 million
$6 million prorated signing bonus + ~$14 million in base salary =
~$20 million / ~$160 million, or ~12.5% of the total cap.

That's close enough. I wanted to understand where, in people's minds, RW starts getting into Dirt Bag territory. Looks like anything more than 22.5 starts to ruffle feathers.

Thanks,
SC

I would never call him a "dirt bag" . . . just a 26-year-old kid, with perhaps an overinflated sense of what he can accomplish after he hamstrings his own team, who is being guided by a lawyer admittedly singleminded in his goal to set records while extracting as much money as he possibly can. It's probably going to be up to Wilson to say the interests of his team are his interests too, and that consistent winning will eventually make him the most endorsed player in the league.

 

[DavidSeven]

Davis Hsu said yesterday that he heard that Russell also wants $75M fully guaranteed (not injury guaranteed). For comparison, that's $21M more than the $54M that was fully guaranteed for Aaron Rodgers within 12 months of signing. This huge guarantee could devastate Seattle's cap for years if Russell gets hurt or his performance diminishes. It would also require Paul Allen to set aside a ton of money in reserve.

This is also just Twitter speculation, but I think APY may only be one element involved here.

 

[rideaducati]

Davis Hsu said yesterday that he heard that Russell also wants $75M fully guaranteed (not injury guaranteed). For comparison, that's $21M more than the $54M that was fully guaranteed for Aaron Rodgers within 12 months of signing. This huge guarantee could devastate Seattle's cap for years if Russell gets hurt or his performance diminishes. It would also require Paul Allen to set aside a ton of money in reserve.

This is also just Twitter speculation, but I think APY may only be one element involved here.

I think that speculation is good news. We heard earlier speculation that they were going for a FULLY guaranteed contract. It seems as though Russell's side is starting to cave only wanting $75Million guaranteed.

The nerve of this baseball agent trying to change the way the ENTIRE NFL does things. Good luck dude.

 

[DavidSeven]

Well, he was never going to get a fully guaranteed deal at $20M+ per year. That would be insanity in the NFL. $75M still seems plenty outrageous to me.

 

[Hawkpower]

It's not possible to answer that question with any certainty, due to the unknown variables, i.e. the various ways it could be structured and exactly how much the total cap will be. But $22.5 million APY in new money would probably equate to around 12-13% of the cap in 2016.

$30 million signing bonus, $22.5 million APY in new money over four years:
2015 cap hit:
$6,544,868
2016 cap hit: ~$20 million
$6 million prorated signing bonus + ~$14 million in base salary =
~$20 million / ~$160 million, or ~12.5% of the total cap.

That's close enough. I wanted to understand where, in people's minds, RW starts getting into Dirt Bag territory. Looks like anything more than 22.5 starts to ruffle feathers.

Thanks,
SC

I would never call him a "dirt bag" . . . just a 26-year-old kid, with perhaps an overinflated sense of what he can accomplish after he hamstrings his own team, who is being guided by a lawyer admittedly singleminded in his goal to set records while extracting as much money as he possibly can. It's probably going to be up to Wilson to say the interests of his team are his interests too, and that consistent winning will eventually make him the most endorsed player in the league.

The absolute crux of the issue imo.

Well said.

 

[ctrcat]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

Unless of course JS doesn't value RW in the way we think he should or might.

Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the FO has a line in the sand that they aren't willing to cross...now or ever.

Debating the intelligence of such a stance is worthy, but the FO beats to their own drum, they value defense and running games, they have A LOT of superstars on the roster....and RW has some question marks, valid ones.

Maybe RW has leverage in most cases....but here? I don't know.

To borrow a basketball analogy since RW himself mentioned wanting to win 6 rings like MJ (who didn't win it all until year 7)-many people think RW is more akin to Isiah Thomas, amazing player on some great teams, a HOFer even, but not Michael Jordan like RW and many others believe. Time will tell.

Hard to know for sure. Seattle's roster is SO good, and RW is rarely asked to play a MJ type role as a result, so we don't really know for sure.

I will say that most of the NFL and a few Seahawk fans probably would agree with you though. Not that there is anything wrong with being Isiah Thomas, not a slight at all!

People often forget (myself included) just how awful our QB (and the offense in general) play was in the NFC championship game. I remember having some real RW doubts for most of that game, and then of course we got some breaks, our defense kept us alive, RW woke up and the rest is history.

I often wonder if this offseason would have felt differently in regards to the outlook and negotiations if Green Bay would have run us out of the CLINK that day like they should have. Are we sitting around today wondering if RW is the guy to be the highest paid player in the NFL? Is that overreacting to one game considering his wonderful history otherwise?

Things I think about [/quote]

You are absolutely correct it is not a slight at all. And RW has had a great start to his career to say the least.

 

[AgentDib]

and on the flip side Wilson's agent realizes that Seattle has basically zero leverage and is exploiting that to the max effect

Many are overreacting to Wilson's insurance policy but that sort of coverage is extremely expensive. The report from Shefter is that it is worth "millions" and it makes a lot of sense for Wilson to put away a hefty premium to ensure that he is set for life in the case of an injury. That's still a tiny fraction of the $50m+ in guaranteed money he may be looking at with a new deal and there is a huge amount of leverage there if everybody is considering time value of money and risk rationally.