Jerry Brewer blames Carroll

[Scottemojo]

Brewer is correct, but it isn't the competition mantra that is to blame, it is the player who seeks an illegal edge. The competition mantra gave us Russell Wilson when all thought Matt Flynn.

Don't blame the game, blame the player.

 

[Uncle Si]

Brewer just reminded me why I don't listen to him or read his "articles" ugh...

But on KJR he just said that Carroll's competition mantra causes players to cheat because they don't feel comfortable in his system because jobs are never safe. He basically said Carroll brought this upon himself because players are always competing which leads them to cheat.

Carrolls competition mantra did not lead to cheating. Thats excusing grown men from their own behavior, which is ridiculous. If anything it is the opposite (accountability must be a big catch word in the locker room).

But you cant ignore the obvious... there is something lacking in the Seahawks locker room right now.

edit.... scottemojo beat me to it a bit.

 

[BirdsCommaAngry]

Let's try to be intellectually honest, here. Why do you think that Brewer's argument has merit?

It's the nature of competition. If we're in fact ratcheting up the competitiveness of our approach, we're ratcheting up the various degrees of success and failure experienced by our players. Those who are getting outperformed, or fear they may later be outperformed, would be more likely to take shortcuts like PEDs. If Brewer makes the case that our process puts our players in this position, he's absolutely right and PC would be responsible in a variety of ways. However, if that's the only case he's making, he's overlooking the overwhelming positives from our process. We could in fact be indirectly encouraging the use of PEDs but it's just one negative aspect of the mostly positive process we've used to become one of the most talented and youthful teams in the league.

Our homers throwing Brewer under the bus are only looking at positives and denying the negatives. Brewer is looking at the negative and overlooking the positives. This whole concept is an exercise in perspective and while Brewer might be struggling to see the bigger picture, so are many of us!

 

[Smelly McUgly]

BirdsCommaAngry, that was a fine argument.

My issue with Brewer's take is that it targets PC's approach to competition as if:

a.) the NFL in general doesn't take that same approach, and

b.) PC was the one hawking the ster--um, Adderall to these guys in a coded "Take these or you might lose your jobs," Vince McMahon-style pressuring. In fact, these guys decided on their own to take this stuff.

If no other player in any sport, ever had taken illicit substances before PC got here and started up his "Always ComPETE" mantra, Brewer may have a point. However, this is not true. Everything in sports has always been about competition, especially once free agency came about and big money became more and more involved. Those are the places to point first - the underpinings of professional sports not only in America, but around the world.

 

[Hawknballs]

If you're going to blame Pete, all you can do is blame the way the team is run in general. And if your'e going to do that, then whatever the same factors are that lead to PED use are the same factors that lead to the team finding talent in unlikely/late round draft picks and giving them an opportunity.

Or it's just dumb luck.

I'd like to know how many guys per team are tested. Are the hawks tested more because they are a young team that just happened to have a lot of turnover and new faces?

 

[Missing_Clink]

I only blame Irvin. Everything I have seen of him tells me that essentially, he is just not very smart

 

[BirdsCommaAngry]

BirdsCommaAngry, that was a fine argument.

My issue with Brewer's take is that it targets PC's approach to competition as if:

a.) the NFL in general doesn't take that same approach, and

b.) PC was the one hawking the ster--um, Adderall to these guys in a coded "Take these or you might lose your jobs," Vince McMahon-style pressuring. In fact, these guys decided on their own to take this stuff.

If no other player in any sport, ever had taken illicit substances before PC got here and started up his "Always ComPETE" mantra, Brewer may have a point. However, this is not true. Everything in sports has always been about competition, especially once free agency came about and big money became more and more involved. Those are the places to point first - the underpinings of professional sports not only in America, but around the world.

Actually, the NFL in general might not take the same approach. Everyone might talk about competition but PC's coaching style is likely a superior style for actually bringing that competitiveness out. This has a lot to do with the biology of how people learn. To put it more simply, PC's version of encouraging competitiveness focuses on obtaining friendlier understandings of his players and bringing out little improvements in their play when and where they can. This incremental growth pays larger dividends over time by being better tailored to the way people learn. PC might be talking about something every coach is talking about but the way he actually approaches it is very different and much more thought out than his contemporaries.

I completely agree that PC isn't masterminding the use of PEDs but I suspect those tying PC to what is essentially a conspiracy theory aren't concerned with accuracy. Blaming a head coach makes for a simpler and more sensational story than a young player tempting fate with PEDs on his own accord. If it got us reading his work, then it seems to have worked (even if we're reading it for the wrong reasons). I can't fault Brewer for providing shallow entertainment when so many people are entertained by it.

 

[Smelly McUgly]

Now I think that we are parsing the idea of "competition." Broadly, the NFL is a market in which the player must compete with other players for jobs. That is the underlying competition that leads players across the league, not just in Seattle, to trying anything for a competitive advantage. James Harrison just came out and said that he spends, what was it, 600K a year just treating his body and looking for every little edge (although legally, as far as I know)?

Of course, Coach Carroll's mantra is superior because it focuses less on monetary gain and more on personal improvement, something that I do find inspirational. However, I would argue that any pressure that it may add to the lives of these players is probably nominal.

 

[cvcahawk]

The thing that almost everyone seems to ignore is that the team isn't informed until after the suspension is applied by the league and that the current CBA doesn't allow any penalty to be handed down by the team. All that they have to work with is talking to and educating the players. They have to take college kids who have been willing to do almost anything to get here and make them understand that there are now limits to what they can do.

The ones that can do something about this is the players in leadership roles in the team itself. With such a young team, it is still in the establishment phase for influencing off of the field. Wilson, Bryant, Robinson may have tremendous sway on the field, but off the field takes much more time to establish.

 

[BirdsCommaAngry]

Of course, Coach Carroll's mantra is superior because it focuses less on monetary gain and more on personal improvement, something that I do find inspirational. However, I would argue that any pressure that it may add to the lives of these players is probably nominal.

Indeed but even a nominal change can have a big effect on a player. This is no excuse for Irvin but it's important for us as fans to understand what it is that may be going on with our players and team that leads to these instances. Even if we're powerless to do anything with that knowledge in relation to football, the concepts at work extend well beyond the sport.

 

[RussellMania]

I know PC like to talk about how they have an environment where anyone can earn the starting job, but let's be real, that's like every NFL team. Seahawks need to deal with the PED problem but saying the coach is encouraging it is kind of naive when you look at the landscape of the league.

 

[Jville]

Brewer just reminded me why I don't listen to him or read his "articles" ugh...

But on KJR he just said that Carroll's competition mantra causes players to cheat because they don't feel comfortable in his system because jobs are never safe. He basically said Carroll brought this upon himself because players are always competing which leads them to cheat.

That perspective reminds me of those that have argued that Americans are to blame for 9-11.

That no fault mentality bestowed on offenders. That automatic reflex to aid their escape from responsibility. Made possible by this nation state's preoccupation with deflecting accountablity ...... "The blame game"

Fortunately, Bruce Irvin is bigger than that. He has expressed the courage to rejected mental crutches and man up and excepted responsibility.

I too reject Jerry Brewer's crutch. I'm all in with Irvin's choice to accept resposibility. To accept accoutability and get back on track. I welcome Bruce Irvin's journey in becoming the leader we would all like to see.

 

[BirdsCommaAngry]

That perspective reminds me of those that have argued that Americans are to blame for 9-11.

That no fault mentality bestowed on offenders. That automatic reflex to aid their escape from responsibility. Made possible by this nation state's preoccupation with deflecting accountablity ...... "The blame game"

I'm not sure I understand the logic of your example here. Wouldn't arguing that Americans, at least partly, are to blame for 9/11 be a form of accepting responsibility?

 

[gargantual]

That perspective reminds me of those that have argued that Americans are to blame for 9-11.

That no fault mentality bestowed on offenders. That automatic reflex to aid their escape from responsibility. Made possible by this nation state's preoccupation with deflecting accountablity ...... "The blame game"

Don't remember people blaming America for 9-11 rather than other people accusing them of blaming America when merely pointing out that it's not a simple, black & white world we live in, and our long history of propping up horrifying dictators when it's suited us (Saddam Hussein, Mubarak, etc) and funding and training terrorists OURSELVES (like Al Queda during the Eighties).....all things that simply point out that things in this life are complex, and can't be diluted down to simplistic catch-phrases. Kind of like when fans or players dismiss criticism as "ahh, they're just haters."

And to veer back onto topic, Bruce Irvin DID accept responsibility, so isn't that really the whole point?

 

[ivotuk]

I blame Jerry Brewer, for all my ills, spills and consumption of pills!

 

[gargantual]

Jerry Brewer is a hater.

 

[HawkWow]

Brewer just reminded me why I don't listen to him or read his "articles" ugh...

But on KJR he just said that Carroll's competition mantra causes players to cheat because they don't feel comfortable in his system because jobs are never safe. He basically said Carroll brought this upon himself because players are always competing which leads them to cheat.

Carroll sux. I find it rediculous that a coach would bring in competition that essentially forces a player, set to make millions, to train and perform at a level he may be uncomfortable with. Good bye soft drinks. Good bye alcohol and adios to those Dorito couch days. Where's the love (for Pete's sake)??

 

[gargantual]

Jerry Brewer is ridiculous.

 

[ClumsyLurk]

Jerry Brewery equals crap, I'm cool with that, but not the same day bleacher report is widely accepted as an accredited publisher. come on guys!

 

[The Radish]

I'm laughing at everyone arguing this from every direction. Pretty much with no real information.

Is this the off season?

:les: