Here’s why the Seahawks shouldn’t tank for a franchise QB

[Mizak]

Here’s why the Seahawks shouldn’t tank for a franchise QB

There is a segment of the Seahawks fan base willing to write off this season in the belief it would set them up for future success. But it's not that easy.

www.seattletimes.com

 

[sdog1981]

That is some 2010 thinking right there.

Rookie wage scale. Who cares if your rookie QB sucks, just draft another one.

The Cardinals drafted Josh Rosen and Kyler Murry. They went from 3 wins to 8 wins in three seasons, they went from 3 wins to 11 wins in 4 seasons. Suck until you get the right QB and everything else will fall into place.

 

[seabowl]

Tank you

 

[Welshers]

It's too late now. The tank is on which is why geno is the quarterback. Nothing anyone can do to stop it my friends

 

[Rock_the_Hawk]

Carroll isnt going to tank... he is going to develope the young guys! This is a nice group

 

[Rock_the_Hawk]

This is where Carroll shines watch How these young guys develope... how quick these guys start producing. they are going to take some hits but its going to be fun to watch these young guys grow together.they are good players.carroll is going to make them great. And we get to watch it happen.

 

[JayhawkMike]

Maybe we can get the next Akili Smith! That’d be great.

 

[Vesuve]

That is some 2010 thinking right there.

Rookie wage scale. Who cares if your rookie QB sucks, just draft another one.

The Cardinals drafted Josh Rosen and Kyler Murry. They went from 3 wins to 8 wins in three seasons, they went from 3 wins to 11 wins in 4 seasons. Suck until you get the right QB and everything else will fall into place.

It may…or may not…or may…be a long road of 8-9 win seasons for a llloooonngg time….

 

[Ozzy]

This is where Carroll shines watch How these young guys develope... how quick these guys start producing. they are going to take some hits but its going to be fun to watch these young guys grow together.they are good players.carroll is going to make them great. And we get to watch it happen.

Except we have seen almost none of this in the past 7-8 years with our young guys. Very few of them have developed in a way that was higher then expected and many more instances of exactly the opposite. I don't have a ton of faith that Pete is still some miracle worker at exposing talent.

 

[ivotuk]

You shouldn't tank because you don't know where that will get you, and it destroys the motivation of your young players.

I've been looking at Davey O'Brien watchlists, and their top QBs change from year to year. Guys in the top 10 in '21, aren't even in the '22 watchlist.

Besides, we have 2 1sts, and 2 2nds. We can move around if we need to. Denver will be mediocre because of it's roster. We'll play hard, but still be mediocre with our QBs skill set as it is.

BUT...#1 reason NOT to tank? The NFL will take away your highest value 1st and 2nd round picks if they even suspect you're tanking. Which would make the point of tanking moot.

 

[KinesProf]

Suck until you get the right QB and everything else will fall into place.

That doesn't work at all in Football. Except for maybe the recent Bengals. But largely the same teams have been bad and at or near the top of the draft for the past 15-20 years (Browns, Jets, Jags, Lions, Texans) and other organizations are winners more years than not over the past 15-20 seasons largely on the strength and culture of the organization even if they haven't been drafting particularly high (Patriots, Packers, Seahawks, Ravens, Steelers, Saints).

The Texans have had 3 1st overall picks in the past 20 years. The Browns have had 4 1st overall picks since '99.

You cannot suck so long that it begins to alter the foundational winner DNA that is inherent within this Seahawks organization and has been established over the past 15-20. Losing becomes a culture if you allow it to fester.

 

[TwistedHusky]

All of this hinges on JS being able to find the 'next great QB'. Which means his process is the defining factor.
So:
1 - There has to be a 'next great QB' available in the draft.

2 - He has to fall into our draft slot or we have to have the ability to move to the slot he falls to.

Whether we have to tank or not depends on JS, his process, and his perception that other great GMs across the league looking for the same thing - will either overlook this QB or won't be at a high enough draft slot to pick him first.
Do we need to tank? It probably improves our chances of #2. It has the added benefit of giving us an earlier shot at coveted players in other draft rounds.

But do we need to? Nobody but JS and his team know.

And again, that assumes there is a 'next great QB' in the draft to be had in the first place. Since that tends to be more once every 3+ years, not every year.

 

[Timberhawk]

With Pete’s “Always comPETE” philosophy I don’t think there is going to be a deliberate tanking. As noted there are a few teams at the bottom and top pretty consistently. As everyone knows there are a lot of high draft pick busts. I think the FO realized they weren’t going to get their QB of the future last off season and draft. So they went with the best players of need. Pete is excited to develop them, hoping that works out as a lot of recent talent hasn’t panned out which is also pretty common across the league.

You roll with Geno now, having hoped Lock might surprise you. Everyone knows what Geno will bring. So, you give all the young guys a year to grow and gel. Everyone plays their heart out. You win a few but ultimately your likely to lose more than you win and you go get your QB of the future next year. Hopefully, because as noted you never know. If you do the rest of the team will be much better next year and your back in the playoffs without tanking really soon.

I don’t know. Just what I think they were thinking. Go Hawks.

 

[sdog1981]

That doesn't work at all in Football. Except for maybe the recent Bengals. But largely the same teams have been bad and at or near the top of the draft for the past 15-20 years (Browns, Jets, Jags, Lions, Texans) and other organizations are winners more years than not over the past 15-20 seasons largely on the strength and culture of the organization even if they haven't been drafting particularly high (Patriots, Packers, Seahawks, Ravens, Steelers, Saints).

The Texans have had 3 1st overall picks in the past 20 years. The Browns have had 4 1st overall picks since '99.

You cannot suck so long that it begins to alter the foundational winner DNA that is inherent within this Seahawks organization and has been established over the past 15-20. Losing becomes a culture if you allow it to fester.

The NFL is all about using assets to build a winner. Teams need to use draft picks and cap space to acquire talent. The Rams went from 2003 to 2017 without winning more than 7 games in a season. Since 2017 their lowest season win total has been 9 games. They win because they have good players and used draft picks(via trade or picks) to acquire good players. If losing DNA was a thing they would still be bad.

The idea that teams "need to build a winning mentality" is BS. Teams win because they draft well and maximize cap spending. That is what builds winners.

Teams that are indecisive in holding onto picks or players too long cause teams to decay.

 

[Fade]

Conveniently the league has passed Pete by. He won't be tanking, but he won't be winning a lot of games. The system works.

But the bottomline is, regardless of record JS has to find a way to get that QB. Old man will move on eventually, then they can get a coach who specializes in developing QBs.

They don't get that QB, or draft the wrong one, well… settle in, it's going to be a longtime until they're relevant again.

 

[KinesProf]

The NFL is all about using assets to build a winner. Teams need to use draft picks and cap space to acquire talent. The Rams went from 2003 to 2017 without winning more than 7 games in a season. Since 2017 their lowest season win total has been 9 games. They win because they have good players and used draft picks(via trade or picks) to acquire good players. If losing DNA was a thing they would still be bad.

The idea that teams "need to build a winning mentality" is BS. Teams win because they draft well and maximize cap spending. That is what builds winners.

Teams that are indecisive in holding onto picks or players too long cause teams to decay.

I think the turnaround can be close to entirely tracked back to McVay's arrival and the culture he installed. He won 11 games in his first year after inheriting a team that went 4-12.

 

[Fade]

The NFL is all about using assets to build a winner. Teams need to use draft picks and cap space to acquire talent. The Rams went from 2003 to 2017 without winning more than 7 games in a season. Since 2017 their lowest season win total has been 9 games. They win because they have good players and used draft picks(via trade or picks) to acquire good players. If losing DNA was a thing they would still be bad.

The idea that teams "need to build a winning mentality" is BS. Teams win because they draft well and maximize cap spending. That is what builds winners.

Teams that are indecisive in holding onto picks or players too long cause teams to decay.

Sounds like you're describing what's been going on in Seattle for a long time and it finally caught up to them.

 

[sdog1981]

I think the turnaround can be close to entirely tracked back to McVay's arrival and the culture he installed. He won 11 games in his first year after inheriting a team that went 4-12.

That is not what happened at all. They started winning because they implemented a new scheme not because McVay was some "winning DNA" guru.

 

[chawx]

Except we have seen almost none of this in the past 7-8 years with our young guys. Very few of them have developed in a way that was higher then expected and many more instances of exactly the opposite. I don't have a ton of faith that Pete is still some miracle worker at exposing talent.

IMO I don't think we've seen it in the past 7-8 years because the talent we got in 2012 and 2013 was just too good... we had to pay those players, young guns coming in were going up against established all-pro's. No young guy was going to "compete" hard enough to bench Earl, Kam, Sherm, Bobby, KJ, Russ, Doug, Lockett, I mean the list goes on and on. This is why Pete references the "program" losing it's way. I guarantee his "always compete, no job is safe" mantra fell on deaf ears with the young draft picks because the front office had just paid big $$ to the guy they were competing against.
Now that the team is back to square one, the dogs are going to show up, these young draft picks don't have anyone really they can't beat out (except probably Jamal Adams, DK, and Lockett — so, WRs got it bad, everyone else though...look out)
I'm excited to see Pete and this team return to the original form of no names making a name for themselves. No one expected in 2011 a 7-9 team QB'd by an old game-manager in Hasselbeck would win a playoff game, no one expected rookie Russ and the LOB to do what they did in year 1—the fight they showed, Year 2 of the Russ/true LOB era it all came together, and so on... once those no names got paid, Pete's "Always compete" mantra started falling on deaf ears plugged up with bags of money, the identity of stay simple and go toe-to-toe and out-work your opponent started to die.
Watch. This team is going to shock people... despite Geno/Lock/whoever is behind the Center... and it'll be because of Pete and Schneider no longer being handcuffed by the big names. LOB v2 is going to be lit.

 

[scutterhawk]

You shouldn't tank because you don't know where that will get you, and it destroys the motivation of your young players.

I've been looking at Davey O'Brien watchlists, and their top QBs change from year to year. Guys in the top 10 in '21, aren't even in the '22 watchlist.

Besides, we have 2 1sts, and 2 2nds. We can move around if we need to. Denver will be mediocre because of it's roster. We'll play hard, but still be mediocre with our QBs skill set as it is.

BUT...#1 reason NOT to tank? The NFL will take away your highest value 1st and 2nd round picks if they even suspect you're tanking. Which would make the point of tanking moot.

And not to mention getting your Head Coach sh!tcanned for pulling petty stunts, & messing up the "Always Compete" Mantra & besides, I'd be willing to wager a dollar to a dog turd that Pete & John already have the Quarterback of the Future and or an alternate or two in mind for the '23' Draft.