Earl Thomas to hold out until contract resolved

[toffee]

Earl Thomas is the 6th highest paid safety in the NFL. There's an argument that 4 of those being paid more can't hold his jock when it comes to their play....Reshad Jones, LaMarcus Joyner anyone...please. He has a legit gripe in my book. He should and deserves to be paid at the minimum Kam Chancellor type of money. Kam earns $12M/yr per Sporttrac.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/safety/

Great. Well Russell makes $21.9M per year and is the 11th highest paid QB in the league. I guess given your logic that Russell needs to sit out until "justice" is served.

https://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/

Or better yet. Since NFL wages are going up at such high rates, nobody can have more than a 1 year deal from here forward so nobody has to do without!! :2thumbs:

quite our Earl doesn’t see it your way.


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[hawkfan68]

Earl Thomas is the 6th highest paid safety in the NFL. There's an argument that 4 of those being paid more can't hold his jock when it comes to their play....Reshad Jones, LaMarcus Joyner anyone...please. He has a legit gripe in my book. He should and deserves to be paid at the minimum Kam Chancellor type of money. Kam earns $12M/yr per Sporttrac.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/safety/

Great. Well Russell makes $21.9M per year and is the 11th highest paid QB in the league. I guess given your logic that Russell needs to sit out until "justice" is served.

https://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/

Or better yet. Since NFL wages are going up at such high rates, nobody can have more than a 1 year deal from here forward so nobody has to do without!! :2thumbs:

Sure...RW will have a legit beef next offseason when he will be entering the final year of his deal. Who knows he might even do the same next offseason as Earl is doing now. 90% of members on this forum would be doing the same if they were in the same situation as these athletes. It's easy to pass judgements when you're not in a similar boat.

 

[hawkfan68]

Earl Thomas is the 6th highest paid safety in the NFL. There's an argument that 2 of those being paid more can't hold his jock when it comes to their play....Reshad Jones, LaMarcus Joyner anyone...please. He has a legit gripe in my book. He should and deserves to be paid at the minimum Kam Chancellor type of money. Kam earns $12M/yr per Sporttrac.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/safety/

Earl Thomas needs nobody's pity. To date he has already received from the Seattle Seahawks ...... $50,700,000

Per OTC ....... the dead cap money that would be incurred via outright release or trade would be $1,900,000.
However, the accompanying cap savings to be realized would be $8,500,000.

Seattle easily leads all other teams in position cost $27,672,136 at safety.

Earl Thomas is currently scheduled to receive $1,700,000 more in salary checks this year than Kam Chancellor.


It's so early in the process. So what if he misses a mini camp. After 8 years, this opens up a great opportunity for 4+ alternatives to benefit from needed coaching and reps.

What Earl Thomas made thus far has no bearing at all. So he made over $50M during his career. He earned every penny of it. That doesn't preclude him from trying to get the best deal for him for his future.
The question is do folks believe he's a top 3 safety in the league? I believe he is. He's still playing like it. He should get paid like it. I know I'm in the minority here. That's ok.

 

[FinNasty]

Earl Thomas is the 6th highest paid safety in the NFL. There's an argument that 2 of those being paid more can't hold his jock when it comes to their play....Reshad Jones, LaMarcus Joyner anyone...please. He has a legit gripe in my book. He should and deserves to be paid at the minimum Kam Chancellor type of money. Kam earns $12M/yr per Sporttrac.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/safety/

Hey now about Reshad Jones. First, dude is a SS not a FS. Secondly, he’s one of the best SS in the league, maybe be only behind Kam...

 

[bigskydoc]

I think his open market value is a pretty good reflection of his HOF chances.

I don't see how these two things are tied together at all.

HOF is a career defining evaluation of talent. What's going on now in the open market is every other team has the same opinion of Earl as we do..............amazingly talented free safety, but with too many health concerns to give a massive contract extension.

Exactly my point. Earl's career has a HOF trajectory, but he does not yet have a HOF resume. There are legitimate concerns about whether he can continue to produce at the same level that he has in the past, else some team would have taken the gamble. His shot at the HOF is about as big as his shot at big, long contract. If he comes back and produces this year, his shot at both are pretty good.

 

[jammerhawk]

Sadly the history of holdouts after a delayed return is not in his favour.

It’s strange his agent or his advisors hsven’t more care carefully the downside of his position.

Besides limiting his value to the team he is actively decreasing his value on the open market. It’s a weak bargaining position.

 

[Jville]

Fortunately, we enjoy a full time front office and organization that continually addresses contingency planning.

Pete Carroll offered some recent insight at safety ...........

(On what he’s seen from the safeties with Kam Chancellor and Earl Thomas not here) “Bradley (McDougald) has really taken the lead, and just as he did last year when he played, he just picked right up and came in. He has started a lot of football games in the league, he’s got a lot of background and it shows. He’s very confident and he’s a good communicator and he helps people, just like our guys need to, so he has just embraced that from the first day. So that’s not a problem at all. And then we’re moving guys around. Tedric Thompson has always looked really good on the back end, Delano Hill is another guy that we’re really excited about too. When we picked them a couple of years ago, we thought someday they’re going to be players out here, so they’re making their pitch. Mo Alexander hasn’t had a chance yet because we’re resting him with him with his shoulder that’s in rehab, but Mo’s an exciting player to add in here too. He’s a big hitter, real physical kid, he’s played a lot of football. So he brings experience and toughness-he’s almost 230 pounds, he’s a big kid back there. So it’s a good group, it’s a really good group.”



(On Bradley McDougald’s versatility and experience playing both safety positions) “Yeah, he brings us such versatility and experience that we’re very comfortable moving him around and matching him up with people, as we did last year at times. He can do everything that you need a guy to do. He’s good on the back end, very effective up at the line of scrimmage, and he’s a really good cover guy. So he brings a nice package to us and we don’t have any problem spotting him around doing all kinds of things. He could play in a game, back and forth, in different spots because he’s that well-versed in what’s going on.”



(On Mike Tyson and if he could still play safety) “Mike is working at safety. We moved him there to take a look at him there. Most of his background is at safety. We wanted to see him in coverage role, we wanted to see what he did, he’s playing some nickel spots stuff for us as well. So he’s showing good versatility. Mike’s a good ballplayer. He’s right in the middle of a competition so we’ll see what it means later on.”



(On Delano Hill) “Yeah he was mostly a special teams guy. He’s a particularly good tackler, a good open field player. He’s real fast for a safety. We thought he was one of the best coverage safeties in the draft two years ago. So he played kind of in the nickel spot a lot, and played the slots a lot. We got to see him play a lot of coverage stuff. What’s jumped out is his tackling ability and open field stuff and that showed up on special teams – he did a really nice job. So there’s nothing holding him back. He’s going to get a great opportunity. We’re going to see where he fits in. Like Bradley, the coverage skills that he has really adds to his game too so he could play on the deep end and he could cover receivers and tight ends really without any problems. It’s just a matter of time, it’s just experience and really just opps to let him show what he can do.”



(On Tedric Thompson) “He just needs to play some more. We really are confident in his understanding of the scheme. He’s a really bright kid, takes care of his business, really sharp. So it’s just play time and see how he does when he’s out there. He’s got to make his open field tackles and all those things that will give us the sense of security that he can make his plays when he’s back there. He was a big playmaker in college if you guys remember. He had more pass defenses than anybody in the country coming out, and you see it on the practice field all the time. So really just a real positive upside, just got to get him a lot of turns.”

........................................................... I think they are as prepared as they can be for come what may. :2thumbs:

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I think his open market value is a pretty good reflection of his HOF chances.

I don't see how these two things are tied together at all.

HOF is a career defining evaluation of talent. What's going on now in the open market is every other team has the same opinion of Earl as we do..............amazingly talented free safety, but with too many health concerns to give a massive contract extension.

Exactly my point. Earl's career has a HOF trajectory, but he does not yet have a HOF resume. There are legitimate concerns about whether he can continue to produce at the same level that he has in the past, else some team would have taken the gamble. His shot at the HOF is about as big as his shot at big, long contract. If he comes back and produces this year, his shot at both are pretty good.

But he's going to play, either here or elsewhere. It's not like he's retiring and never playing again, thus hurting his HOF chances.

He might not be happy, but he'll play. Earl loves the game too much to hang it up, and my guess is he and his family also love the paychecks.

So even if Earl plays another 5-6 years, and has more injuries, it shouldn't diminish his stats at the end of his career making him one of the best free safeties to ever play.

 

[KitsapGuy]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/bcondotta/status/1007152993945333761[/tweet]

 

[Sgt. Largent]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/bcondotta/status/1007152993945333761[/tweet]

Like I said above, we'll see how stubborn Earl and his agent are when he starts missing his $850,000 game checks.

Right now, it's all posturing, on both sides. Although I really don't think our FO is going to blink, the backup plan with McDougall is already in place.

 

[ivotuk]

The problem with paying someone that hold out is, they aren't in game shape and almost always get injured once they get paid.

There's a lot to be said for hitting in camps, and preseason games getting bodies ready to play. When players hold out and get paid, they're all excited and roar right out on the field trying to play like they always do when their bodies not ready for it. A coach can try and ease them in to game shape, but once they're on the field, they're not thinking about that. They're thinking about making the play. And inevitably, a hamstring gets pulled.

 

[Rocket]

I believe Earl may have somebody that has bitter feelings towards the Seahawks in his ear..........hmmm?

I believe that somebody is Sherm, but he denies it. bBut he's a smart dude and has a degree in Sports Marketing IIRC.
The influence jumped out at me when I read what Earl wrote... it sounded more like Sherm to me.
https://247sports.com/nfl/seattle-s...involvement-in-Earl-Thomas-holdout-119026080/

 

[hawknation2018]

Sherman: "I have never spoken to him about his situation."

I expected Sherman to cheer on Earl's holdout because his ego would benefit if the Seahawks defense suffers without him, and it would fit in with his narrative that the front office is being unreasonable in not fairly compensating its core players.

But he hasn't done that, so I'll just take him at his word.

 

[jammerhawk]

“I’m going to hold out until my contract situation is resolved.”

Translation = I’m not happy with only being paid $8.5 million this season and want to be paid more because others are being paid more than me. I want a new deal. $8.5 million/year doesn’t show me enough respect. I need security (cough) for my family. OK, sure thing.

The player is under contract for another year and subject to the franchise tag like any other player. He’s hardly underpaid. He’s in, or he’s not. At present he’s not in. Maybe he doesn’t really want to be either. His destruction of his own trade value by his conduct could mean he wants to stay, or is just foolish petulance, or some oddball negotiating position. Earl is hardly a regular guy. The upside for him could be a new deal where he gets what he wants, or a trade so he goes to some team that will pay him, Alternatively the downside is more stark, He doesn’t get paid until he shows up and then is exposed to league mandated fines for non attendance, or his contract tolls and he remains in limbo.

There is no question about his talent, but in the team’s situation do you pay him what he wants for past performance with league leading significant cap cracking guaranteed money when the evidence is starting to show that his commitment may be waning and his physical abilities are starting to decline? There are of course numerous positions to be taken regarding this situation, pay the man, compromise with him (if that is even possible), let him sit out and hold his feet to the flames, or let him move on and have someone else pay him. It will be an interesting decision which I frankly can’t see being resolved prior to TC or even the regular season.

I love the player’s talent, but his bargaining position is weak. I don’t see the team giving in to him. It’s sad to see the end of a tremendous defensive backfield, but I think he’s as good as gone even if he plays enough to not have his contract toll.

 

[IndyHawk]

I hope he is traded..
We need "I'm in" players..The ones that are hungry enough
to show it every play and want to earn that first big contract.
There is nobody on team better than Earl but no player is
bigger than the team.
It seems after one or two extensions they get an attitude
and that isn't any good for the team play that PC wants.
I know it disgusts me to see it after Beast and Kam.

 

[Jac]

I'm not sure if there's ever been an All-Pro in his 20's with worse leverage. Contrast Thomas's message with KJ Wright's recent interview. Unfortunately for Thomas, some of his current/previous teammates spoiled the negotiating environment for him. Obviously some of those teammates (Sherman and Bennett) continued to take shots at the team despite how well they were financially taken care of and enabled to be themselves. I think the team is just done with it. There isn't any reassurance from the team that "we're continuing to talk to his agent", "we're trying to get something done", etc. It's "we expect him to be here and we're disappointed he's not here...period". That's not even accounting for the depressed safety market.

 

[KiwiHawk]

I'm saddened that we have to face the days when Earl Thomas is no longer playing for us, because I always hoped we'd keep him throughout his career.

I also am saddened that the team will take a hit because going form the best in the business to anyone is always a step down.

But these contract holdouts are always damaging to the team and the player, and for me anyway the fan as well. I don't have the same respect I had for Thomas the person. I understand all the crap about him having a limited window in order to earn all the cash for his career and when it's over it's over, so he has to make money while he can. Totally get that.

However, $50 million is a lot of money, and quite frankly I don't know that there would be any meaningful difference in $50 million vs $52 million. Either the player invests wisely and has more than enough money for the rest of his life, or he invests poorly in which case he'll throw the extra $2 million down the drain as well.

So there's no substantive reason for holding out other than the largely cosmetic numbers on the contract.

I would totally understand if a guy was making stuff-all on a UDFA contract and became a league-leader at his position. That sort of underpayment deserves looking at. But Thomas signed a deal that made him THE highest paid safety in the league based on average salary at the time he signed it. It's not a scrub salary, and it was plenty "respectful". Now he needs to honour it.

 

[JustTheTip]

The Seahawks have given way too much leeway to players in recent years (Lynch retirement then trade to the Raiders for peanuts while also allowing him to keep his prorated signing bonus, Kam's fines being waived when he came back from his holdout, Bennet's contract after he continually whined about a contract starting a year in.)

ET is one of my all-time favorite players, but I think he is also the best player to make an example of. Waive zero fines, give him no new contract, franchise him two years in a row.

At the same time continue to give new contracts to core players in their last year who don't use the media as part of their negotiation tactic.

This will say if you are in, you will be treated fairly. If you are not, it is not going to end well for you no matter who you are.

 

[LudwigsDrummer]

ET is playing a little hard ball, so let's play along.
He will make about 9M this year. FT for him next year should be about 12M. We get ET for 21M for two years. Tough luck if he is unhappy. IMO, he might miss a game or 2, but no more than that.
That is the hammer our FO can fall back on if need be.

 

[original poster]

Fortunately, all this has taken place while I've been 'away' from Seahawks land with a new baby.

I'm really not mad at either side in honesty. Earl wants security and money, I don't have a problem with that.

The team doesn't want to tie up valuable cap space in an aging player. I don't have a problem with that, either.

It is what it is, two sides that disagree on something. Nothing more, nothing less.

I maintain my thought that he will be traded, though. 3rd rounder that can become a 2nd if he makes the pro bowl.