A few observations on the OL - Week 3

[thehands816]

Thanks for the write up Kearly. Great input, as always.

What are your thoughts on the other guys that were competing at C? Who will be starting? And who SHOULD be starting, in your opinion? It seemed like an abrupt switch from Jeanpierre to Nowak.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

I dunno, two words would do, he sucked.

Yup. I honestly can't remember the last time a Hawks OL disappointed me more. He's playing this preseason like he gained weight instead of the opposite. He looked terrific this time two years ago, and it's just been a steady decline since then.

Yes, Bailey has been awful and it's obvious to anyone that's watched the games. So what the hell does the team do when the inevitable Okung injury happens and he misses 5 games?

Gilliam to LT, Poole or Britt at RT, Britt or Glow at LG.

That was my thought as well. Here's hoping Okung breaks the injury cycle of previous years.

 

[morgulon1]

I didn't get to see the game, so this kind of review is quite helpful, and to be honest, a bit relieving. I know the OL isn't where we'd all love it to be, but it's nice to see improvement.

I want Gilliam to work out at tackle so badly. I love the idea of Britt at LG, and hope our C will be solidified. But if we can't open holes for Lynch, it'll be a long season.

Here's the fact though (IMHO), Lynch will be hitting lanes like C Michael and the others wish and dream about. I went and rewatched the game and with my limited knowledge, saw play after play where the back up running backs either got to the hole late or chose to take a different route entirely thus making the oline look worse than they actually were playing. If I had to guess, the LA Charger game was an extended tryout for C Michael .


And he failed.

 

[DavidSeven]

It'll be interesting to see what they do with Graham once the games actually start to matter. Watching him and Bailey block from the same side was a scary sight. On the other hand, they've been pretty successful on getting him the ball on that drag route they run with him releasing from the same spot, which probably only continues to work if they make him block sometimes too.

Underrated off-season storyline? T. Poole looks like a complete draft day miss so far, even (especially?) for a 4th rounder. He may make it just for lack of Tackle depth alone, though. So, he should have a chance to get some coaching.

 

[kearly]

What are your thoughts on the other guys that were competing at C? Who will be starting? And who SHOULD be starting, in your opinion? It seemed like an abrupt switch from Jeanpierre to Nowak.

It's very telling that Nowak started and played well into the 2nd half during the 'dress rehearsal' game. I think they've got him penciled in for week one. Nowak is solid in protection and we'll need that vs. Aaron Donald.

Lewis was impressive last year, and IIRC JS even name checked Lewis after making the Unger trade. But there are probably things he's done in practices, or perhaps in conditioning, that have caused Tom Cable to move on from him.

I think Sokoli, or someone like him, is the long term answer at center. They want an athlete there. Lewis, Nowak, and LJP are below average athletes for ZBS. I think it is likely that the team views the center spot as a placeholder this year and could address the position relatively early in the 2016 draft.

Underrated off-season storyline? T. Poole looks like a complete draft day miss so far, even (especially?) for a 4th rounder. He may make it just for lack of Tackle depth alone, though. So, he should have a chance to get some coaching.

Not really a surprise though. The Glow and Sokoli picks had many fans around here, but the Poole pick left pretty much everyone scratching their heads. Somewhere between the scouts, the GM, and Tom Cable, there seems to be a split on how to evaluate OL, because guys like Carp, Bailey, and Poole seem like total opposites of the hyper-athletic types (Sweezy, Glowinski, Britt, Sokoli, etc).

 

[seahawk12thman]

What are your thoughts on the other guys that were competing at C? Who will be starting? And who SHOULD be starting, in your opinion? It seemed like an abrupt switch from Jeanpierre to Nowak.

It's very telling that Nowak started and played well into the 2nd half during the 'dress rehearsal' game. I think they've got him penciled in for week one. Nowak is solid in protection and we'll need that vs. Aaron Donald.

Lewis was impressive last year, and IIRC JS even name checked Lewis after making the Unger trade. But there are probably things he's done in practices, or perhaps in conditioning, that have caused Tom Cable to move on from him.

I think Sokoli, or someone like him, is the long term answer at center. They want an athlete there. Lewis, Nowak, and LJP are below average athletes for ZBS. I think it is likely that the team views the center spot as a placeholder this year and could address the position relatively early in the 2016 draft.

Lewis is the biggest misnomer. Cables finest line was that game against Arizona. They manhandled one of the most physical defenses in Football. ???

 

[kearly]

Some overall thoughts on the current OL:

It feels like the Seahawks are plugging the dike. In previous years, the Seahawks went all out with run blockers, and also featured a very good blocking TE in Zach Miller. This year, they are mixing and matching pass pro guys (Gilliam, Nowak) with speedy run blocking missiles who suffer in pass pro (Britt, Sweezy). Nowak also stands out as being not that athletic while being surrounded by awesome athletes. It definitely feels like a line that was just thrown together a couple weeks ago. This isn't how they planned it when they drew up their offseason plan in February.

The result is a line that will be bad, but not horrible, in protection. And bad, but not horrible, in the run game. Seattle's line had issues the past two years, but they were mostly good in the run game.

The biggest concern for me is that, because our line is mostly undersized, they struggle in power run blocking situations. Lewis and Carp are country strong and helped make up for this last season, but now they've been replaced by a speed run blocker and a mediocre athlete.

That said, I do expect the OL to gel over time and it's possible this could be the best pass pro OL of the Wilson era, if everyone stays healthy. And while the run blocking will take a step back, Lynch can turn mediocre run blocking into good performances.

I mostly worry about the absence of a real blocking TE. I think the reason the team moved Britt to guard to suddenly after week one was because they had a strong dose of reality for what life after Zach Miller would look like.

I also think Coleman should never play FB again. Keep him for specials, but Tukuafu is a far superior power blocker, and Lynch trusts him. Lynch does not trust Coleman, even when he should.

 

[hawknation2015]

Your perception on Nowak's athleticism is wrong . . . he is one of the best athletes among the linemen. Tied for the fastest 3-cone with Sokoli (7.25), 2nd fastest short shuttle (4.40 vs. Sokoli's 4.36), etc.

 

[CalgaryHawk]

Your perception on Nowak's athleticism is wrong . . . he is one of the best athletes among the linemen. Tied for the fastest 3-cone with Sokoli (7.25), 2nd fastest short shuttle (4.40 vs. Sokoli's 4.36), etc.

Can't someone be both, that is very athletic in drills, but not athletic in their actual play? (e.g. does not mentally process game action fast enough to move quickly and fluently) Also, if Nowak is inexperienced at the position, that's also going to affect his ability to allow natural athletic instincts show themselves, and he may appear "slow" in game tape.

 

[hawknation2015]

Your perception on Nowak's athleticism is wrong . . . he is one of the best athletes among the linemen. Tied for the fastest 3-cone with Sokoli (7.25), 2nd fastest short shuttle (4.40 vs. Sokoli's 4.36), etc.

Can't someone be both, that is very athletic in drills, but not athletic in their actual play? (e.g. does not mentally process game action fast enough to move quickly and fluently) Also, if Nowak is inexperienced at the position, that's also going to affect his ability to allow natural athletic instincts show themselves, and he may appear "slow" in game tape.

I also don't agree about him not looking athletic in his play. He has demonstrated a lot of explosiveness in getting to the second level and a lot of raw power. He has shown great quickness in pass pro, not allowing a single pressure in three preseason games. All of his measurables are better than Unger's . . . IMO, he just needs the experience.

To say he is not a good athlete is nothing more than spreading misinformation.



How many 300 pounders do you know who can explode off the ball like this, seamlessly come off a combo block to target an ILB in the hole, and then knock the ILB back two yards while turning him away from the play?

 

[Sprfunk]

Thanks for the write up and opinion! Always love seeing a thread started by you.

 

[kearly]

Your perception on Nowak's athleticism is wrong . . . he is one of the best athletes among the linemen. Tied for the fastest 3-cone with Sokoli (7.25), 2nd fastest short shuttle (4.40 vs. Sokoli's 4.36), etc.

Can't someone be both, that is very athletic in drills, but not athletic in their actual play? (e.g. does not mentally process game action fast enough to move quickly and fluently) Also, if Nowak is inexperienced at the position, that's also going to affect his ability to allow natural athletic instincts show themselves, and he may appear "slow" in game tape.

You hit the nail on the head, and to be honest, I should have been more forgiving with Nowak considering that a lot of what we see as field speed is really a function of experience and knowing instantly what to do, or knowing little techniques that can save you a step, etc.

Nowak's pro day numbers paint a fairly accurate picture of the player he's been. He's a fairly good lateral movement guy, both in protection and in pulls. But he's not very strong at the point of attack, which is supported by his 17 bench reps. He's not particularly explosive to the 2nd level. Which is shown by a 10 yard split, vertical, and broad jump that when taken a a whole are nowhere near the same class as Britt, Sweezy, or Sokoli.

But as HN correctly points out, Max Unger is very similar to Nowak in terms of bench, vert, and broad jumps, and his 10 yard split was actually far worse than Nowak's. I actually didn't know that, so it makes me feel a lot better about Nowak's potential.

One thing I like about Nowak, that I think Cable loves, is that Nowak will play through the whistle every time, and sometimes even a bit just after it. I feel like Cable can consistently get through to guys who play angry.

 

[Hasselbeck]

I think the absolute biggest thing the OL needs right now is continuity. I get sitting Okung if he's banged up, but we need these 5 guys in there working together all 16 weeks. I just hope Kung can hold up the whole season this year.

 

[hawknation2015]

Nowak's pro day numbers paint a fairly accurate picture of the player he's been. He's a fairly good lateral movement guy, both in protection and in pulls. But he's not very strong at the point of attack, which is supported by his 17 bench reps.

Coach Carroll wholeheartedly disagrees with your assessment:

On C Drew Nowak: “He’s very strong. He’s stronger than the guys we’ve played with over the years. He’s got great hand strength. He’s a brute in there and he’s a very physical player. He’s really smart, he understands it. Of course he’s still learning and this is still new to him, but because he’s applied himself so well, he’s such a good competitor, and he’s got this really nice strength about him, it shows up. He made some nice plays, some nice blocks, and nice combination work that was really obvious.”
http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/seah ... e-carroll/

Nowak has had three years in the league to get stronger, and clearly he has gotten stronger for Carroll (and Cable) to make their assessments of Nowak's power and explosiveness.

 

[seedhawk]

Could it be we see rotating centers this year depending on scheme and matchup?

 

[hawknation2015]

Could it be we see rotating centers this year depending on scheme and matchup?

Generally, you want your center to get into a rhythm with your QB and in making the calls for the rest of the offensive line. Unless an injury occurs, changing up the centers is a bad idea.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

The result is a line that will be bad, but not horrible, in protection. And bad, but not horrible, in the run game. Seattle's line had issues the past two years, but they were mostly good in the run game.

That doesn't sound like a formula for repeating a Super Bowl run. Running is the key to this team.

 

[Laloosh]

Thanks for sharing, Kearly.

As someone who doesn't understand the intricacies of offensive line play, I really would just like to watch a game or two where they weren't "looking" terrible to the untrained eye.

I mean, Britt and Sweezy vs Denver was... scary. Seems like things have improved but if we're going to be bad, I really hope we can be bad with really good run blocking.