Mina Kimes ranks Pete Carroll at #10 among coaches

[pittpnthrs]

You keep disregarding the facts that matter to prove points that don't matter.

Winning matters, Pro Bowls matter, statistics matter, SB's matter. You're also not taking into account one of the major factors as to why Wilson's O-line deteriorated after our SB's, he got paid and the organization had to save cap elsewhere. O-line was one of those places.

Lastly, your argument isn't even fair to Pete as he's only a portion of the O-line equation. Schneider, coordinators and the players themselves are culpable for any O-line failures.

But we know you're directive here pitt, it's a one man crusade to bash Pete. It's why literally no one on here other than the other Pete bashers take you seriously when you beat this lame drum.

I already said there were a lot of variables involved and its not solely directed at Pete, its just that everything starts and ends with him.

It doesnt matter anyways. It was just an observation that was brought up. Everything is great in Seahawkland as it always is.

 

[Fade]

The Shanny running system, which Pete has utilized in some form or fashion since he became a HC in the NFL doesn't prioritize pass protection. They value LT as the exception, but after that, they believe a running game, play action, and a QB with good movement skills is more than enough. They especially don't value Guard traditionally as pass protecters instead looking for guys that can run block.

The system works as long as the running game is firing on all cylinders.

 

[scutterhawk]

The Shanny running system, which Pete has utilized in some form or fashion since he became a HC in the NFL doesn't prioritize pass protection. They value LT as the exception, but after that, they believe a running game, play action, and a QB with good movement skills is more than enough. They especially don't value Guard traditionally as pass protecters instead looking for guys that can run block.

The system works as long as the running game is firing on all cylinders.

And so, with Pete having only missed the Playoffs two times in his stint with the Seahawks, and being the 3rd most winningest HC in the entire League right now, I'd say that Mina Kimes flubbed the monkey in placing Pete @ #10, eh?

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

The Shanny running system, which Pete has utilized in some form or fashion since he became a HC in the NFL doesn't prioritize pass protection. They value LT as the exception, but after that, they believe a running game, play action, and a QB with good movement skills is more than enough. They especially don't value Guard traditionally as pass protecters instead looking for guys that can run block.

The system works as long as the running game is firing on all cylinders.

So are SF quarterbacks sacked an inordinate number of times? Just curious.

 

[keasley45]

The Shanny running system, which Pete has utilized in some form or fashion since he became a HC in the NFL doesn't prioritize pass protection. They value LT as the exception, but after that, they believe a running game, play action, and a QB with good movement skills is more than enough. They especially don't value Guard traditionally as pass protecters instead looking for guys that can run block.

The system works as long as the running game is firing on all cylinders.

Yet they drafted LT and RT.

And the LEAGUE doesn't value guards. It's why they're the lowest paid players on the line. Centers and Tackles are where you invest.

And what's the use of a Guard who can backpedal in pass pro but can't run block when your offense is predicted on a balanced attack and running the ball.

 

[Hawkmode]

So are SF quarterbacks sacked an inordinate number of times? Just curious.

No unfortunately they usually rank top 10 in least sacked QB. 2020 they gave up 2.4 sacks per game (20th) but since having Alex Mack at C in 2021 and his heir Jake Brendel at C in 2022 they rose to averaging only 1.9 sacks per game ranking 8th in 2021 and 6th best last year. Shanahans schemes normally provide quick open targets...so that might play a role.

 

[Hawkmode]

Yet they drafted LT and RT.

And the LEAGUE doesn't value guards. It's why they're the lowest paid players on the line. Centers and Tackles are where you invest.

And what's the use of a Guard who can backpedal in pass pro but can't run block when your offense is predicted on a balanced attack and running the ball.

Tom Cable made a comment years ago about the value of getting pass pro O-Line players out of college. He said since most college teams were going into more spread offenses the O-line players coming out of college were used to not having to sustain their blocks beyond 2 sec...making new NFL arrivals a coaching project to get strong pass protection out of them. He said most arrive ready to run block. Perhaps he played a role in Schneider seeking free agents who demonstrated pass pro skills?

 

[bileever]

No unfortunately they usually rank top 10 in least sacked QB. 2020 they gave up 2.4 sacks per game (20th) but since having Alex Mack at C in 2021 and his heir Jake Brendel at C in 2022 they rose to averaging only 1.9 sacks per game ranking 8th in 2021 and 6th best last year. Shanahans schemes normally provide quick open targets...so that might play a role.

I read somewhere that Brock Purdy's average time to throw is very good, but I can't find it right now. Even Jimmy Garroppolo was good at that, averaging 2.58 seconds to throw. You won't get sacked if you get the ball out that quickly. Russell Wilson, on the other hand, was the second worst in time to throw last year.

 

[scutterhawk]

I read somewhere that Brock Purdy's average time to throw is very good, but I can't find it right now. Even Jimmy Garroppolo was good at that, averaging 2.58 seconds to throw. You won't get sacked if you get the ball out that quickly. Russell Wilson, on the other hand, was the second worst in time to throw last year.

Yep, Russ has relied on his ability to juke & scramble his way out of being hit & sacked, problem is, that's all well & good when you're young & zippy, and even then, you are going to get sacked more often.
Once you age & start to slow down, the Big Plays will diminish & you'd better be working on getting that ball OUT of your hands as quick as possible.

 

[CallMeADawg]

So are SF quarterbacks sacked an inordinate number of times? Just curious.

No, they aren't. Fade just made things up to suit his narrative.

 

[scutterhawk]

It was Carrolls first year and Hass didnt even play the entire season. It was broken down earlier that if he played those extra games, he most likely would have been high atop the most sacked list too.

Jezzuzzz Chryst >>S-P-E-C-U-L-A-T-I-O-N, NOT, (I repeat) N-O-T F-A-C-T ^^^^

 

[pittpnthrs]

Jezzuzzz Chryst >>S-P-E-C-U-L-A-T-I-O-N, NOT, (I repeat) N-O-T F-A-C-T ^^^^

Your right. Let me rephrase that. Besides Hass, all other Seahawk QBs under Pete Carroll have been some of the most sacked QB's in the league. FACT

 

[scutterhawk]

Your right. Let me rephrase that. Besides Hass, all other Seahawk QBs under Pete Carroll have been some of the most sacked QB's in the league. FACT

Some?, you mean not ALL???
THIRD MOST winningest Head Coach in the League over a ten + year period = F-A-C-T
That means there WERE/ARE 29 other NFL Teams with NOWHERE NEAR as successful Head Coaches as Pete Carroll. = F-A-C-T

 

[pittpnthrs]

Some?, you mean not ALL???
THIRD MOST winningest Head Coach in the League over a ten + year period = F-A-C-T
That means there WERE/ARE 29 other NFL Teams with NOWHERE NEAR as successful Head Coaches as Pete Carroll. = F-A-C-T

They all have been in the top 5 for being sacked (sans Hass and his one incomplete season) so yes, there have been random QB's sacked more than Seattle QB's throughout those years. Not many, but yes, some.

Pete Carrolls NFL record without Russell Wilson as his QB = sub .500. F-A-C-T (guess who he doesnt have anymore?)
Seahawks post season record since 2015 = abysmal. F-A-C-T
Prize for regular season wins = nothing. F-A-C-T

 

[Hawkmode]

They all have been in the top 5 for being sacked (sans Hass and his one incomplete season) so yes, there have been random QB's sacked more than Seattle QB's throughout those years. Not many, but yes, some.

Pete Carrolls NFL record without Russell Wilson as his QB = sub .500. F-A-C-T (guess who he doesnt have anymore?)
Seahawks post season record since 2015 = abysmal. F-A-C-T
Prize for regular season wins = nothing. F-A-C-T

Its interesting to note RW had less sacks in 2016 when he wore a leg brace and was "forced" to linger in the pocket from lack of mobility...it's gotta be a connection to his play style (release/ability to make quick reads)...perhaps there's a causal effect beyond knowing Pete would rather have his QB take a sack...rather then force a throw into coverage.

 

[keasley45]

They all have been in the top 5 for being sacked (sans Hass and his one incomplete season) so yes, there have been random QB's sacked more than Seattle QB's throughout those years. Not many, but yes, some.

Pete Carrolls NFL record without Russell Wilson as his QB = sub .500. F-A-C-T (guess who he doesnt have anymore?)
Seahawks post season record since 2015 = abysmal. F-A-C-T
Prize for regular season wins = nothing. F-A-C-T

What's Russ's record without Pete?

What's Bill Walsh's record without Joe Montana and Steve Young? 8-24

How many Superbowls would we have won /been in without the LOB and or Beast Mode? Well, we know that answer. We could rarely get by the first round of the playoffs with just Russ.

Your point?

Which team, between the one that Russ went to and the one that Pete coaches, is on the brink of Championship contention ... again?

Pete seems to be doing fine without Russ, and with a QB who, before the 2022 season, you and the Russ Paraders said was (if not in direct terms, certainly implied) a sign of how lost the franchise was.

Pete builds complete teams. That's his strength, and what he got away from.

And he's doing it again.

We will seriously compete again, this year or next, while Mr Wilson and his wife are spending his early retirement years selling perfumes and body lotions court-side at Nuggets games. Scratch that. When he's done, I don't think he'll find too many friendly faces in Denver.

 

[pittpnthrs]

Its interesting to note RW had less sacks in 2016 when he wore a leg brace and was "forced" to linger in the pocket from lack of mobility...it's gotta be a connection to his play style (release/ability to make quick reads)...perhaps there's a causal effect beyond knowing Pete would rather have his QB take a sack...rather then force a throw into coverage.

Yes, and i've even mentioned the correlation between the sacks and Petes philosophy of maybe being better off taking sacks than forcing the ball. With that being the case, my observation was that better protection should have been a bigger priority which would have alleviated some of the excessive sacks in that type of philosophy but I got crucified as usual because something was mentioned that opposed a positive light in Seahawk land. Russell Wilson mentioned it too, but he's the devil.

As for 2016, my biggest memory that season was Wilson being in his leg brace and Carroll and Bevell still ran the zone option offense when defenses knew Wilson wasnt capable of taking it himself and running. It was brilliant I tell you.

 

[scutterhawk]

They all have been in the top 5 for being sacked (sans Hass and his one incomplete season) so yes, there have been random QB's sacked more than Seattle QB's throughout those years. Not many, but yes, some.

Pete Carrolls NFL record without Russell Wilson as his QB = sub .500. F-A-C-T (guess who he doesnt have anymore?)
Seahawks post season record since 2015 = abysmal. F-A-C-T
Prize for regular season wins = nothing. F-A-C-T

BWAHAHAHAHAHAA!! So Russ was Pete's Quarterback through that "Abysmal" dry spell "Since 2015", and right up until 2022, that's SEVEN years of SHIT PLAY from Russ = F-A-C-T.
NOW, Russ goes to Denver WITH A CRAPLOAD OF CONTROL, and get's his a$$ SACKED to a record HIGH there, and though Pete's Backup QB Geno, takes a bunch of sacks, the number is still nowhere near the same numbers of his predecessor...striking difference between the two,...way more sacks = Wilsons FAULT, & NOT on Pete. = F-A-C-T

 

[scutterhawk]

Yes, and i've even mentioned the correlation between the sacks and Petes philosophy of maybe being better off taking sacks than forcing the ball. With that being the case, my observation was that better protection should have been a bigger priority which would have alleviated some of the excessive sacks in that type of philosophy but I got crucified as usual because something was mentioned that opposed a positive light in Seahawk land. Russell Wilson mentioned it too, but he's the devil.

As for 2016, my biggest memory that season was Wilson being in his leg brace and Carroll and Bevell still ran the zone option offense when defenses knew Wilson wasnt capable of taking it himself and running. It was brilliant I tell you.

Once More Pitt, WILSON C-O-N-S-T-A-N-T-L-Y RAN HIS ASS AWAY FROM PASS PROTECTION, No O-Line can cover for a guy who scrambles on damned near EVERY PLAY...His failure in Denver PROVED that.

 

[pittpnthrs]

What's Russ's record without Pete?

What's Bill Walsh's record without Joe Montana and Steve Young? 8-24

How many Superbowls would we have won /been in without the LOB and or Beast Mode? Well, we know that answer. We could rarely get by the first round of the playoffs with just Russ.

Your point?

Which team, between the one that Russ went to and the one that Pete coaches, is on the brink of Championship contention ... again?

Pete seems to be doing fine without Russ, and with a QB who, before the 2022 season, you and the Russ Paraders said was (if not in direct terms, certainly implied) a sign of how lost the franchise was.

Pete builds complete teams. That's his strength, and what he got away from.

And he's doing it again.

We will seriously compete again, this year or next, while Mr Wilson and his wife are spending his early retirement years selling perfumes and body lotions court-side at Nuggets games. Scratch that. When he's done, I don't think he'll find too many friendly faces in Denver.

Lol, Wilson only has one season away from the Seahawks and you want to make that as a point? Same with Walsh, you want to use two QB's in that example and concentrate on his first two seasons when the Niners were hopeless.

Pete has a much larger sample size. From a losing record in New York, to a Patriots team that got worse all three years he was the coach, to .500 ball without Wilson in Seattle with a 9-8 record last season with the great Geno Smith.

Seriously compete again is pure speculation. I dont feel Seattle will with the remaining years of Pete Carroll. Pretenders is the ceiling in my book.