Quinn: Wilson Is Elite. CK, Not Quite There.

Robert Quinn, monster DE for the Rams was on Total Access last night. They asked him if he thought Russell Wilson should be considered an elite quarterback. He said absolutely. They asked him if he felt the same about Kaepernick and he said no. He gave him props for being a good, young QB but said that Colin is more quick to run with a strong arm and decent accuracy, but that Russell will run and still look to throw while going through all of his reads. Wasn't a slam on Colin, just an observation that he felt Russell is on that elite level where Colin needs to be more disciplined and complete a player.

He wasn't talking smack, he was in fact quite down to earth and matter-of-fact. Interesting observation from a powerhouse DE in our division.

PS...I'm paraphrasing of course, but that was the general jist of it.

You can't call one elite and not the other one. I know we all hate Kaep, becuase he is a dousche and a a Niner, but dude has won 4 playoff games.. I think they are very similar.

Showmeyourtd's":d8g2nptt said:

You can't call one elite and not the other one. I know we all hate Kaep, becuase he is a dousche and a a Niner, but dude has won 4 playoff games.. I think they are very similar.

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Dilfer won a Super Bowl. Does that make him Elite too?

Showmeyourtd's":ljr2m35t said:

You can't call one elite and not the other one. I know we all hate Kaep, becuase he is a dousche and a a Niner, but dude has won 4 playoff games.. I think they are very similar.

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I think a guy who plays four games a year against them has every right to call one elite and not the other.

Also Flacco, clearly he's elite right?

Wilson is elite because he makes the players around him better. Kaepernick is very good, but he's dependent on his system to make him what he is. That's the difference.

Aros":2g7pbz5l said:

Russell will run and still look to throw while going through all of his reads.

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Avoiding the minefield of the rest of it, but this is absolutely true, and one of the really special things about Wilson as a player (and probably the biggest thing that makes him so fun to watch). Save for climbing the pocket (his biggest weakness right now, IMO), he's the most instinctual young QB I think I've ever seen. Kap has gotten better at climbing the pocket this year (whereas Wilson hasn't IMO), but Kap is still pretty mechanical back there in a way I've NEVER seen Wilson struggle with.

Saw the interview, dude seema to be nervous around the camera.
But glad to see he gave props. I thought that the rams hated the seahawks.

Showmeyourtd's":2mmyx1i6 said:

You can't call one elite and not the other one. I know we all hate Kaep, becuase he is a dousche and a a Niner, but dude has won 4 playoff games.. I think they are very similar.

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Nonsense, you can easily make the statement, but it depends on how you define the QB position. Kap is a huge threat because of his legs, but being able to audible and run through his reads is his weakness. He KNOWS he's quick and will lean on that as opposed to his arm to get him out of a jam. That's why we need to hit him and make him get the ball out quick on Sunday. He's not BAD by any means, but QB is first and foremost, in my mind, still a passing position. If you can't execute the pass both in and out of the pocket, then you're lacking as a QB. Kap is still young, and none of his flaws are in his physical ability, which should scare us. He's still learning. But so is Russell. As Brady and Peyton have one last duel, I can easily see Russell and Kap taking up the mantle for the next big QB rivalry of the ages.

And Robert Quinn is scary good. Not a knock on our guys, but I would love to have him in Seahawk colors

Sarlacc83":2ajeu1p2 said:

Wilson is elite because he makes the players around him better. Kaepernick is very good, but he's dependent on his system to make him what he is. That's the difference.

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Absolutely! Great point. It's also what separates the Bradys, Mannings, and Brees' from the rest too.

This wasn't meant to be a slam Kaep thread (although those are always fun too), I just felt it was interesting coming from one of the best DE's in the NFL, that happens to play both teams twice a year. I will trust his opinion over a fan's any day. Everything is debatable of course but at the end of the day, Wilson is a more COMPLETE QB than Kaepernick, mainly because he knows how to audible well, and progress through ALL of his reads, not just one and run.

I think it's fair to say that Wilson is more advanced than Kaepernick at this stage as a passer, but that Kaepernick has enjoyed more overall success (he DID go to the Superbowl last year).

Where I think the RW vs CK argument gets silly is when people try to make firm absolute statements about what a pair of second year starters can and can't do as if they won't ever improve from where they are at this point in time. It's absurd.

Any clear headed Niners fan will admit that Kap has room for growth in this game. What young QB doesn't? We saw a similar thing with early Steve Young. More of a runner than a passer. Needed to settle down. Relied on his athleticism too much. It took time but Young put together a run of seasons that may be unmatched in NFL history. I'm not saying Kap is going to be Young (he doesn't appear to have the same level of intellectual capacity Young had). But I used that as a cautionary example of people writing off an athletic QB for having poor passing skills because of where he is very early in his career. Remember that Tampa gave up on Young to draft Testaverde. They wanted a pure pocket passer. They sure got one. But they guy they said could never get better sure did.

When I saw the thread title I thought "Come on Dan Quinn, why are you giving whiteboard material to them". Good to read that an opponent feels the same as most of us do though.

Canuck49":3nutmvr6 said:

Any clear headed Niners fan will admit that Kap has room for growth in this game.

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Oh yeah, absolutely. And the same is true of Wilson of course. I personally think Wilson is a little farther along (he's younger, but he has more playing time, and IMO just has better natural instincts for the position), but it's close to splitting hairs.

TBF I think 9ers fans are particularly sensitive and touchy on this subject, just because when Kap was slumping this year Hawks fans (and the national media to a fair extent) piled on and insisted he was an awful and inherently limited QB, rather than a young QB who was slumping. 9ers fans see Wilson now having a five game streak that's markedly worse than Kap in the depth of the worst string of play of his football career*, and they get really testy and edgy about what they think is Wilson not getting the same "awful"/"unprepared"/"flawed as a player" treatment that Kaepernick got.**

*And not because Wilson is an awful qb, he's instead a great QB, but a young one, and having the same ups and downs as anyone else.

**Part of this is also Kap's own doing. Retweeting people saying this stuff about him, for personal motivation or not, extends the story of it in a way that isn't too bright, IMO.

I don't think either QB is "elite."

Elite to me is just that, a handful of QB's that have been at the top of the QB heap for many many years AND won SB's. Brees, Manning, Brady, Rodgers.........that's it.

If we start calling guys that have only been in the league a couple years with no rings and haven't proven it over a long period of time "elite," then that lessens the word entirely for me.

Popeye - you're right. Each of these guys has fewer than 40 starts - including playoffs. That's an absurdly small sample size to make any long-term predictive conclusions. It takes time for a QB to become truly elite. I don't think either of our guys is there yet. They are both on the right track. I doubt either ends up in the Brady or Manning category (those guys are pretty rare). But I think they have both shown the ability to win Superbowls. As a fan, that's all that really counts.

Young players go through slumps. Consistency comes with reps, experience, and confidence. I thought the national media piled on Kaepernick unfairly this year (FYI - I'm a professional journalist. I cover politics for a living. So I view a lot of the talking head sports "journalism" with a jaded eye). I personally found that the beat reporters gave a more nuanced view of it because they live and breathe it every day. As did a lot of the more in-depth analysts who actually look at all-22 film. Kap definitely struggled. But - much like Wilson's low passing numbers lately - it was sometimes due to factors that go beyond the QB himself.

ManBunts":1anm46v0 said:

Showmeyourtd's":1anm46v0 said:

You can't call one elite and not the other one. I know we all hate Kaep, becuase he is a dousche and a a Niner, but dude has won 4 playoff games.. I think they are very similar.

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Nonsense, you can easily make the statement, but it depends on how you define the QB position. Kap is a huge threat because of his legs, but being able to audible and run through his reads is his weakness. He KNOWS he's quick and will lean on that as opposed to his arm to get him out of a jam. That's why we need to hit him and make him get the ball out quick on Sunday. He's not BAD by any means, but QB is first and foremost, in my mind, still a passing position. If you can't execute the pass both in and out of the pocket, then you're lacking as a QB. Kap is still young, and none of his flaws are in his physical ability, which should scare us. He's still learning. But so is Russell. As Brady and Peyton have one last duel, I can easily see Russell and Kap taking up the mantle for the next big QB rivalry of the ages.

And Robert Quinn is scary good. Not a knock on our guys, but I would love to have him in Seahawk colors

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His 4 wins becomes less impressive when you consider half of those were against the HAPLESS Packers who can't seem to figure out how to stop Kaepernick from destroying them. Kaep's career has in large part been defined from taking GB behind the woodshed in 3 games.

Quinn definitely would have a good perspective of the two. A player who actually has been on the field against another player would have a better more hands on example of their play style. Interesting statement none the less.

Canuck49":3cvszpmj said:

Each of these guys has fewer than 40 starts - including playoffs. That's an absurdly small sample size to make any long-term predictive conclusions. It takes time for a QB to become truly elite. I don't think either of our guys is there yet. They are both on the right track. I doubt either ends up in the Brady or Manning category (those guys are pretty rare). But I think they have both shown the ability to win Superbowls. As a fan, that's all that really counts.

Young players go through slumps. Consistency comes with reps, experience, and confidence. I thought the national media piled on Kaepernick unfairly this year (FYI - I'm a professional journalist. I cover politics for a living. So I view a lot of the talking head sports "journalism" with a jaded eye). I personally found that the beat reporters gave a more nuanced view of it because they live and breathe it every day. As did a lot of the more in-depth analysts who actually look at all-22 film. Kap definitely struggled. But - much like Wilson's low passing numbers lately - it was sometimes due to factors that go beyond the QB himself.

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100% agreed with every single piece of this post. Thanks for writing it.

And cool to hear that you're a journalist. For new jobs my wife and I just moved to Canada this year (we looooove it here!), and are subletting from a columnist for the Toronto Star.