What would Walter Jones say?

[chris98251]

If your a good High School Basketball player and someone asked you to play against a NBA player how often are you going to beat that guy. Thats how I kind of look at our O Line in many aspects, guys learning a position, learning how to play a position new to them going up against guys that are professionals that know what they are doing and exploiting the experience they have, the better athleticism in many cases as well as simplified scheme we use that makes it easier to diagnose whats coming.

They will get experience over time, the O line also needs to be cohesive, that requires knowing your position and what the guys on either side are going to do, we don't have that yet either. You can get by with inferior athletes if you have a cohesive unit that is smart.

I think were battling a lot of different issues right now, my biggest issue is that we are doing this every year and it's not just a learning curve thats this season.

 

[bmorepunk]

Holmgren once called Jones the best Athlete on the team and smartest player he ever coached. That says a lot considering who he has coached.

I believe Madden also said Jones was the best athlete to ever play football, including all positions.

He's one of the best at that position, ever. It's awesome that three of the best were playing at the same time (Jones, Ogden, Pace) and I got to see them.

Jones allowed 23 sacks in 180 games. He had nine holding penalties called on him in 180 games. No one on this line is 40% the player Jones was, no matter how much effort they put in.

 

[glad2bdada3]

I'm hearing about Walter Jones, Holmgren, effort etc. My God, why don't we stop trying to convert DL into
OL ?? We have 3 converted DL on our OL. Isn't that why they have the draft and free agency? Would it ever occur to anyone that maybe we should stop this stupid experiment and get some OL?? WE GOT A DT PLAYING CENTER ! I have a ton of respect for PCs and JSs ability to pick out talent, especially undrafted. But this stupid experiment has got to stop. This has been the worst decision since they brought Whitehurst in to be our starting QB.

 

[hawknation2015]

The offensive line is coming off their best performance, IMO. Nowak, Britt, and Okung did some great work as run blockers in this last game. Protection was alright; the worst breakdowns occurred with Bailey in the lineup.

We traded the learning curve of a new offensive line in exchange for adding contracts for Pro Bowlers Russell Wilson, Marshawn Lynch, Bobby Wagner, and Jimmy Graham. But people continue to complain without seeing how far this offensive line has come since Week 1 at St. Louis.

 

[hawknation2015]

I'm hearing about Walter Jones, Holmgren, effort etc. My God, why don't we stop trying to convert DL into
OL ?? We have 3 converted DL on our OL. Isn't that why they have the draft and free agency? Would it ever occur to anyone that maybe we should stop this stupid experiment and get some OL?? WE GOT A DT PLAYING CENTER ! I have a ton of respect for PCs and JSs ability to pick out talent, especially undrafted. But this stupid experiment has got to stop. This has been the worst decision since they brought Whitehurst in to be our starting QB.

Not drafting any offensive linemen before the 7th Round was a big problem the last four years -- other than Justin Britt. Hopefully, we will start to see those dividends from investing in the offensive line next year when draftees Mark Glowinski and Kristjan Sokoli start to play.

 

[chris98251]

The offensive line is coming off their best performance, IMO. Nowak, Britt, and Okung did some great work as run blockers in this last game. Protection was alright; the worst breakdowns occurred with Bailey in the lineup.

We traded the learning curve of a new offensive line in exchange for adding contracts for Pro Bowlers Russell Wilson, Marshawn Lynch, Bobby Wagner, and Jimmy Graham. But people continue to complain without seeing how far this offensive line has come since Week 1 at St. Louis.

Are they taking baby steps, yes I think they are, they may even get to marginal or acceptable by the end of the season, the issue is we re-roll again next year with possibly two or three gone or flopped again and start all over.

 

[hawknation2015]

The offensive line is coming off their best performance, IMO. Nowak, Britt, and Okung did some great work as run blockers in this last game. Protection was alright; the worst breakdowns occurred with Bailey in the lineup.

We traded the learning curve of a new offensive line in exchange for adding contracts for Pro Bowlers Russell Wilson, Marshawn Lynch, Bobby Wagner, and Jimmy Graham. But people continue to complain without seeing how far this offensive line has come since Week 1 at St. Louis.

Are they taking baby steps, yes I think they are, they may even get to marginal or acceptable by the end of the season, the issue is we re roll again next year with possibly two or three gone or flopped again and start all over.

But, as I mentioned above, next year they will be more prepared because they have three draftees on the roster who will have a year of experience in our system under their belts. Until this latest draft, they had neglected the position group and were relying on mostly undrafted guys.

Sweezy, the 7th Rounder, is an incredibly inconsistent lineman in both pass pro and run blocking. I could definitely see Mark Glowinski playing at a more consistent level at right guard next year.

You can see the improvement from Nowak, Britt, and Gilliam; they will be better players going into next year.

LT is the big question mark for me. . . hopefully they re-sign Okung for around the same amount he is making now. If not, then they have that money to use on a new LT in free agency or via trade. Worst case scenario, they use that money elsewhere, Gilliam goes to LT, and Britt/Sokoli/Poole/rookie play RT.

From where they were at rock bottom, I think things are looking up as this core of young linemen gains experience and they continue to invest in the position via the draft.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

LT is the big question mark for me. . . hopefully they re-sign Okung for around the same amount he is making now. If not, then they have that money to use on a new LT in free agency or via trade. Worst case scenario, they use that money elsewhere, Gilliam goes to LT, and Britt/Sokoli/Poole/rookie play RT.

From where they were at rock bottom, I think things are looking up as this core of young linemen gains experience.

I do not see improvement from the RT position. Both Gilliam and Bailey were destroyed consistently against a pretty weak sauce Niner front 7............and Gilliam has played the worst IMO of all the lineman this year, and that's saying something with how bad the pass protection is as a whole.

IMO we have to re-sign Okung and go hard after a front line RT, either in free agency or top pick in the draft. We can't be flirting with the sack record for the next 2-3 years waiting for this line to learn how to pass protect.

 

[ivotuk]

I don't know what Big Walt would say, but Robbie Tobeck had something to say. He says it comes down to personal responsibility and that if "Out of 60 plays, if I got a plus on 58 of them, I wouldn't sleep until I reviewed the 2 negatives."


Robby Tobeck calls in to cover the Cougars, the Seahawks offensive line, and the state of Pullman this week


http://mynorthwest.com/category/pod_pla ... and%20Salk

 

[chris98251]

Move Gilliam to LT, well thats their plan if Okung goes which I think he will, thats one change, Sweezy Gone and we have a player taking his place thats two change, RT was Gilliam thats three change, We are still not sure abount Center and LG based on play but I will not include them yet.

Thats a lot of change and shuffle again.

Cable loves the Sweeze so they may just pay him, but with Okungs injuries and his penalties I don't see them giving him a big long contract.

 

[hawknation2015]

LT is the big question mark for me. . . hopefully they re-sign Okung for around the same amount he is making now. If not, then they have that money to use on a new LT in free agency or via trade. Worst case scenario, they use that money elsewhere, Gilliam goes to LT, and Britt/Sokoli/Poole/rookie play RT.

From where they were at rock bottom, I think things are looking up as this core of young linemen gains experience.

I do not see improvement from the RT position. Both Gilliam and Bailey were destroyed consistently against a pretty weak sauce Niner front 7............and Gilliam has played the worst IMO of all the lineman this year, and that's saying something with how bad the pass protection is as a whole.

IMO we have to re-sign Okung and go hard after a front line RT, either in free agency or top pick in the draft. We can't be flirting with the sack record for the next 2-3 years waiting for this line to learn how to pass protect.

Bailey was destroyed pretty consistently, but Gilliam was not that bad. I agree that Gilliam is the biggest liability, because of the position he plays, but I have also seen improvement from him every week. He has exceeded my expectations, which were pretty low for him at the start of the season.

 

[hawknation2015]

Move Gilliam to LT, well thats their plan if Okung goes which I think he will, thats one change, Sweezy Gone and we have a player taking his place thats two change, RT was Gilliam thats three change, We are still not sure abount Center and LG based on play but I will not include them yet.

Thats a lot of change and shuffle again.

Cable loves the Sweeze so they may just pay him, but with Okungs injuries and his penalties I don't see them giving him a big long contract.

Every indication is that Sweezy will be gone. Schneider called re-signing Okung a priority this off-season, but neglected to mention Sweezy. They also drafted heavily at guard this year, adding three players, but did not draft an offensive tackle. And they have had Mark Glowinski training behind Sweezy at right guard for the last seven months.

They only way I could see Sweezy being re-signed is if they were priced out of re-signing Okung. Even then that money could be better spent elsewhere, given Sweezy's radical inconsistencies and available replacements.

Here are two examples of what the line would look like in a worst-case scenario:

LT Gilliam
LG Sokoli
C Nowak
RG Glowinski
RT Britt

OR

LT Gilliam
LG Britt
C Nowak
RG Glowinski
RT Sokoli/Poole/rookie

Ideally, Okung will be re-signed, but it's not the end of the world if they decide to use those resources to bolster a different part of the team.

 

[Tech Worlds]

That's it guys! All we gotta do is get them to try harder.

 

[twisted_steel2]

I don't know what Big Walt would say, but Robbie Tobeck had something to say. He says it comes down to personal responsibility and that if "Out of 60 plays, if I got a plus on 58 of them, I wouldn't sleep until I reviewed the 2 negatives."


Robby Tobeck calls in to cover the Cougars, the Seahawks offensive line, and the state of Pullman this week


http://mynorthwest.com/category/pod_pla ... and%20Salk

Thanks for posting this, listened this morning. Really interesting stuff. I think Brock even commented on what Hutch told him about the line, when he was out here for the 1st pre-season game.

 

[seahawkfreak]

Was thinking about how bad the Panthers line was last year. They seem to have stepped up quit a bit since last year so hopefully there is a method to Cable's madness. Problem I have is our linemen aren't just making dumb mistakes, there are times on many occasions where they are just totally destroyed.

 

[ctrcat]

Was thinking about how bad the Panthers line was last year. They seem to have stepped up quit a bit since last year so hopefully there is a method to Cable's madness. Problem I have is our linemen aren't just making dumb mistakes, there are times on many occasions where they are just totally destroyed.

The Panthers line is better only after replacing 4 of 5 starters on the OL, which included a combination of great scouting and good fortune.

 

[Largent80]

A bit unfair to compare Walter to ANY lineman on any team at any time.

 

[RolandDeschain]

He's probably thinking that Marshawn Lynch would have about 3,300 rushing yards behind our 2005 O-line.

 

[Smellyman]

About how pathetic an effort some of our players put forth? I just watched the Niners game again and watched how our linemen would barely push an opponent. Does anybody else remember the how Walter played the game? His opponent would be pushed back ten or more yards!!! He has to be slapping his forehead as he watches our linemen each week. If he was our OL Coach, you can bet your ass that these present masquerading linemen would be "set straight" right soon!

It's not effort, it's talent.

 

[scutterhawk]

I'm not sure , you hear the same bs from PC about it taking time for them to " figure all this out" etc etc etc.
What is all the OTAs and training camp for. Other teams seem to figure it out. For example , the New England Patriots have two rookies on their oline, and another guy that has less than a full season yet they flourish.

The difference?

New England drafts college offensive lineman and then have them play offensive line.

The other "Difference" that you left out, is that the Patriots still have the nucleus of O-Linemen that can and does mentor those newbies that as you pointed out, came out of College with a whole lot more familiarity with what's going on.
It takes a LOT longer than 6 or 7 games to "Get It".
It's called Continuity, and these guys are getting better, but they're not there ...YET.