Tre Flowers is....

[SoulfishHawk]

I hear ya, it's not easy. But more and more, I just realize I have spent so much time in the past being angry. Sometimes the other guy just plays better. I can't stand Rodgers, but he was nails when it counted.

 

[Seymour]

I hear ya, it's not easy. But more and more, I just realize I have spent so much time in the past being angry. Sometimes the other guy just plays better. I can't stand Rodgers, but he was nails when it counted.

So was Russ, and if it wasn't for a dropped pass in the chest of Turner he very well may have pulled it off again! :2thumbs:

There is no shame in that loss with our injuries compared to theirs. That said, Flowers appears to be a very weak link IMO regardless of the opponent.

 

[SeaWolv]

As I've said for months now, Tre Flowers is not a CB and it seems pretty clear he'll never be. We need to get a lockdown corner to play opposite Griffin. Perhaps PC can turn someone like Trevon Diggs or Paulson Adebo into one or we need to sign someone like Logan Ryan.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Absolutely, two future HOF QB's going at it, that's good football. It felt like whatever guy had the ball last would win it. That Turner drop is unacceptable.

 

[Appyhawk]

I've been supportive of Flowers and his potential for improvement. But the gap between his potential and the challenge presented by what an elite receiver does to him appears to be too large for him to make up. Especially in an off season and TC. If they can identify "the guy" who has a head start of strong performance at the position and likelihood for potential improvement that could make a big difference for our defensive outlook in the secondary. But a really good D Line would do wonders to help cover for lack of legendary coverage.

 

[Elemas]

See everyone's points. Rodgers to Adams....probably one of the top 5-7, maybe better, QB to WR tandems in the game.

My main frustration with Flowers is the coverage often being blatantly "wrong". Not turning his head, soft zone with him covering the low and not being anywhere close. Missed tackles...it just exasperated the exposure when we ran Hill back there with him (I'm still trying to figure out why McDougald and Diggs weren't in during those critical plays).

It's easy to get frustrated. Last year, I was all for firing Shaq as his rookie season showed a lot more promise. It took him a bit to adjust (like...an entire season without LOB members with him) but, I'm liking his development. Maybe Flowers needs the same thing but the dynamics are so hard because the team make up has been fairly static in the backfield since last season. It's truly not the same level of development nor football intelligence that the position requires.

I honestly want a few experiments to end...Hill, Malik Turner, etc...Flowers has inched closer, if not crossed, this list.

A defense can't survive playing great for two downs only to get destroyed on third and 7s, third and 9s, because the other team knows you simply have to isolate a PI/lack of coverage corner...add the scenario with a safety as well.

I like Pete. I'm not sure how much I "trust" after some very bad decision making this season but, unless something changes (new DC???), he simply can't take one of the lowest ranked defenses and put the ball into the offense's hands. Flowers should've never been in the position(s) he was in. Doesn't account for his ineptitude but, jeezus, it's pretty damn clear.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

It does seem that people have a hard time giving credit to an opponent. He's a beast and it showed. I was more mad that they didn't double him and/or have Griffin follow him around. Horrific D play calling and decisions by that coaching staff.

Guilty as charged!

Especially when it comes to games like Andy flippen Dalton putting up over 400 yards passing against us, or Matt Schaub 460!! ukeface:

If we had to play KC in the playoffs with their insane offensive roster of weapons?

Hell yeah I'll give credit. But when your opponent literally has ONE WR as a threat, and you don't have a CB or scheme to shut him down? Nope, you don't deserve to win a SB.

Flowers is not a good CB, end of story. Upgrade, now. You go into next year with Flowers at CB, we're having this same conversation next January.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

If they could somehow get Slay in here? This D would get a MASSIVE upgrade.

 

[Grahamhawker]

I know it's a team effort and the whole secondary functions as a unit, but several factors went into making this one of the worst units in the league and I cannot believe that personnel is not at the top of the list. This was Flowers' 2nd year and the 3rd for Thompson and Hill (and remember Tyson?). With what we've seen repeatedly, I don't think it's happening. I sincerely hope Pete was referring to Blair and Amadi as the ones needing more time. As of now we have no one to even push Flowers (King?).

 

[Jville]

(On what his message was to Tre Flowers) “We’ve got to get better. Come back next year and capitalize on all of the experiences. Settle in. That’s what I was talking about going into the game. Trying to do a nice job of getting him settled down. This is two big years that he’s had. It was hard yesterday, they ran some good stuff at him, against a really good player too. He’s going to continue to get better. He’s a really smart player, he’s tough as hell. He really competes and all that, he’ll make good progress I think from the year two to three.” -- Pete Carroll 1/13/20

 

[QuahHawk]

I like him. I think he tackles well and is usually in good position. I think he is just scratching the surface, he is what Tharold Simon was suppose to be and he will continue to get better. I think our Safety play of Tedric and Lano has been a much bigger weakness. Flowers will show up big time year 3. I bet he will be hungry and hopefully one of the most improved on our defense. Shaq sure took leaps year #3

 

[chris98251]

I like him. I think he tackles well and is usually in good position. I think he is just scratching the surface, he is what Tharold Simon was suppose to be and he will continue to get better. I think our Safety play of Tedric and Lano has been a much bigger weakness. Flowers will show up big time year 3. I bet he will be hungry and hopefully one of the most improved on our defense. Shaq sure took leaps year #3

He is still learning, year two he is still learning how to play other players and what they do on offense, he is still fighting safety instincts also.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I like him. I think he tackles well and is usually in good position. I think he is just scratching the surface, he is what Tharold Simon was suppose to be and he will continue to get better. I think our Safety play of Tedric and Lano has been a much bigger weakness. Flowers will show up big time year 3. I bet he will be hungry and hopefully one of the most improved on our defense. Shaq sure took leaps year #3

He is still learning, year two he is still learning how to play other players and what they do on offense, he is still fighting safety instincts also.

If I thought we were still 2-3 years away from competing for a SB I'd agree with you guys, but we are squarely in our SB window with Russell in his prime............so as we saw Sunday night with Adams abusing Flowers we cannot afford to wait for Flowers to become a good CB, if that ever happens.

If you want to keep him competing as a backup for the remainder of his rookie deal? I'm fine with that. But for a team that REALLY needs playmakers on defense in order to get back to an elite defense to compliment Pete's style of offense?

Flowers just isn't good enough. We need that position upgraded, either through FA or the draft. Waiting for him to get better WHILE he's struggling is not an option for me.

 

[irfuben32]

It’s Tharold Simon guys not Kelly Jennings.

Pretty close, getting burned by Edelman all game in the Super Bowl. The only difference is Tre doesn't whine for OPI every time they catch the ball on him.

that was a HUGE coaching failure

Tharold Simon should never have been covering Edelman. He wasn't built for it.

Marcus Burley had done a great job in the slot but was left inactive for that game. A game where we had multiple injuries to our secondary going into it.

 

[kobebryant]

... young at the position, a tremendous salary/draft value, with plenty of room for improvement, and deserves to be challenged for the CB2 spot for 2020.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

... young at the position, a tremendous salary/draft value, with plenty of room for improvement, and deserves to be challenged for the CB2 spot for 2020.

As long as Flowers is competing and challenging for his spot next year, that's fine. But that wasn't the case this year, he was given the #2 spot.

So yeah I'm fine with him being on the roster, but I still want to see us actively looking at trades, FA's and draft picks to upgrade the position.

 

[kobebryant]

... young at the position, a tremendous salary/draft value, with plenty of room for improvement, and deserves to be challenged for the CB2 spot for 2020.

As long as Flowers is competing and challenging for his spot next year, that's fine. But that wasn't the case this year, he was given the #2 spot.

So yeah I'm fine with him being on the roster, but I still want to see us actively looking at trades, FA's and draft picks to upgrade the position.

Agreed. I think if I wrote "should be challenged" instead of using deserves it would have read better.

 

[Largent80]

He's only as good as the rest of them with a decent pass rush.

 

[chris98251]

... young at the position, a tremendous salary/draft value, with plenty of room for improvement, and deserves to be challenged for the CB2 spot for 2020.

As long as Flowers is competing and challenging for his spot next year, that's fine. But that wasn't the case this year, he was given the #2 spot.

So yeah I'm fine with him being on the roster, but I still want to see us actively looking at trades, FA's and draft picks to upgrade the position.

Bet you don't say that to the wife

 

[Sgt. Largent]

... young at the position, a tremendous salary/draft value, with plenty of room for improvement, and deserves to be challenged for the CB2 spot for 2020.

As long as Flowers is competing and challenging for his spot next year, that's fine. But that wasn't the case this year, he was given the #2 spot.

So yeah I'm fine with him being on the roster, but I still want to see us actively looking at trades, FA's and draft picks to upgrade the position.

Bet you don't say that to the wife

I made a huge mistake and signed her to a guaranteed contract with a no trade clause.