Receiving is part of being a TE, especially in the context of being a modern day TE. Often times the lines between the two are blurred in today's NFL. We cannot discount his receiving, and quite frankly I think he had a bigger impact on the game than Tice or Fauria had. He also had more accolades while on the Seahawks than the other two ever had in their career. I don't think we can say they were better than Jimmy Graham. He's really the only logical choice for this position. Seattle has not had a great run of TEs.chris98251":3a7ca8tx said:Spin Doctor":3a7ca8tx said:T Walter Jones
G Steve Hutchinson
C Max Unger
G Chris Gray
T Howard Ballard
TE Jimmy Graham
WR Steve Largent
WR Darrell Jackson
WR Doug Baldwin
QB Russell Wilson
RB Shaun Alexander
RB Marshawn Lynch
FB John L Williams
DE Michael Sinclair
DT Cortez Kennedy
DT Joe Nash
DE Jacob Green
LB Bobby Wagner
LB KJ Wright
LB Julian Peterson
CB Richard Sherman
CB Marcus Trufant
S Kenny Easley
S Earl Thomas
S Kam Chancellor
K Norm Johnson
P Michael Dickson
LS JP Darche
PR Joey Galloway
KR Leon Washington
So I made a few changes here, the most controversial would probably be Julian Peterson at the last OLB spot. Tatupu played ILB, not outside. Even though Julian Peterson only played here a few years he was a pro bowler each of those years. Even though the system called him to play a ton in coverage he racked up the sacks and QB hits.
The second change was swapping out Lockett. While he does have the most punt return yards, he also has the most volume. His body of work was also unimpressive when compared to Nate Burleson and Joey Galloway. Burleson and Galloway both averaged almost 3 more yards per return, and had more TDs on punt returns than Lockett. Galloway had 4 TDs and Burleson had two.
I decided to forego Brian Blades in favor of Darrell Jackson and Doug Baldwin. Jackson had better overall single seasons and had more TDs than Blades and a higher Y/A. Baldwin had more TDs and a higher Y/A. Each of these players were about 1000 yards off Blades total yardage -- but he also played for the Seahawks for many more years than Jackson and Baldwin. I left off Engram because his numbers trailed both Jackson and Baldwin.
The only TE that deserves to be on here is Jimmy Graham, he far and away has the best stats for TE's. He may have gotten flack here, but he was unquestionably the best TE we've ever had, he also sustained his play for longer than anyone else we've had at that position.
Wrong on Graham, he was a tall WR, never played like a real TE.
If your going to list TE's that were great that played here you have to list them as what they did at the position not stats as a receiver.
Tice, Fauria, both exceeded Graham as a TE but had less yards, they also played in a different system.
Good list except for a few things here. Avril doesn't even have good numbers compared to other Carroll era DEs. Clark, and Clemons both have more sacks in a shorter amount of time with the Seahawks. If we include all of the DE's Seattle has ever had, we run into guys like Jacob Green and Sinclair. Jacob Green had 7 years above 9 sacks and is the all-time Seahawk sack leader. With the Seahawks, Bennett only had one year above 9 sacks.niveky":s0uj82z5 said:T Walter Jones
G Steve Hutchinson
C Max Unger
G Steve Hutchinson(poison pill sucked but i think a lot of people omit because of that just from a fan perspective)
T Walter Jones
TE Jimmy Graham
WR Steve Largent
WR Darrell Jackson
WR Doug Baldwin
QB Russell Wilson
RB Shaun Alexander
RB Marshawn Lynch
FB Mack Strong
DE Michael Bennett
DT Cortez Kennedy
DT Brandon Mebane(i always wished Marcus Tubbs could have stayed healthy..i felt like without the injuries he could have really been dominant)
DE Cliff Avril
LB Bobby Wagner
LB KJ Wright
LB Chad Brown
CB Richard Sherman
CB Marcus Trufant
S Kenny Easley
S Earl Thomas
S Kam Chancellor
K Norm Johnson
P Michael Dickson
LS JP Darche
PR Joey Galloway
KR Leon Washington
Aros":3hbro90m said:FB Strong / John L. Williams...Can't decide. Strong was excellent but John L. was far more fun to watch and very productive.
Spin Doctor":1mbig0qh said:Receiving is part of being a TE, especially in the context of being a modern day TE. Often times the lines between the two are blurred in today's NFL. We cannot discount his receiving, and quite frankly I think he had a bigger impact on the game than Tice or Fauria had. He also had more accolades while on the Seahawks than the other two ever had in their career. I don't think we can say they were better than Jimmy Graham. He's really the only logical choice for this position. Seattle has not had a great run of TEs.chris98251":1mbig0qh said:Spin Doctor":1mbig0qh said:T Walter Jones
G Steve Hutchinson
C Max Unger
G Chris Gray
T Howard Ballard
TE Jimmy Graham
WR Steve Largent
WR Darrell Jackson
WR Doug Baldwin
QB Russell Wilson
RB Shaun Alexander
RB Marshawn Lynch
FB John L Williams
DE Michael Sinclair
DT Cortez Kennedy
DT Joe Nash
DE Jacob Green
LB Bobby Wagner
LB KJ Wright
LB Julian Peterson
CB Richard Sherman
CB Marcus Trufant
S Kenny Easley
S Earl Thomas
S Kam Chancellor
K Norm Johnson
P Michael Dickson
LS JP Darche
PR Joey Galloway
KR Leon Washington
So I made a few changes here, the most controversial would probably be Julian Peterson at the last OLB spot. Tatupu played ILB, not outside. Even though Julian Peterson only played here a few years he was a pro bowler each of those years. Even though the system called him to play a ton in coverage he racked up the sacks and QB hits.
The second change was swapping out Lockett. While he does have the most punt return yards, he also has the most volume. His body of work was also unimpressive when compared to Nate Burleson and Joey Galloway. Burleson and Galloway both averaged almost 3 more yards per return, and had more TDs on punt returns than Lockett. Galloway had 4 TDs and Burleson had two.
I decided to forego Brian Blades in favor of Darrell Jackson and Doug Baldwin. Jackson had better overall single seasons and had more TDs than Blades and a higher Y/A. Baldwin had more TDs and a higher Y/A. Each of these players were about 1000 yards off Blades total yardage -- but he also played for the Seahawks for many more years than Jackson and Baldwin. I left off Engram because his numbers trailed both Jackson and Baldwin.
The only TE that deserves to be on here is Jimmy Graham, he far and away has the best stats for TE's. He may have gotten flack here, but he was unquestionably the best TE we've ever had, he also sustained his play for longer than anyone else we've had at that position.
Wrong on Graham, he was a tall WR, never played like a real TE.
If your going to list TE's that were great that played here you have to list them as what they did at the position not stats as a receiver.
Tice, Fauria, both exceeded Graham as a TE but had less yards, they also played in a different system.
Tusc2000":bsvseotb said:Pretty good list. I think Michael Bennett belongs here, but DK is indeed a little premature. And regarding Jimmy Graham, while he may have been the most talented TE to ever put on a Hawks uniform, his best years were unfortunately with New Orleans, not with Seattle. Suffice to say, we have yet to have a truly great TE perform in that slot.
Again, this is the modern NFL, and in the three years we had Jimmy Graham we passed more than we ran the football. I absolutely do not agree with your assertions here, Jimmy Graham was far and away the best TE we've ever had. He got more accolades in his three years here than any of our TE's ever got in their entire careers, save for Young and that was at the first three years of his career. Jimmy Graham almost amassed more passing stats in one year here, than Charlie Young had in three years here. What I'm saying is, yes while he was not a good blocker, we cannot overlook what he did in the passing game. I personally don't like Jimmy Graham, but he was far and away our best TE. We can't just say "but he sucked blocking" and outright ignore his contributions in the passing game.chris98251":24tei8ki said:Spin Doctor":24tei8ki said:Receiving is part of being a TE, especially in the context of being a modern day TE. Often times the lines between the two are blurred in today's NFL. We cannot discount his receiving, and quite frankly I think he had a bigger impact on the game than Tice or Fauria had. He also had more accolades while on the Seahawks than the other two ever had in their career. I don't think we can say they were better than Jimmy Graham. He's really the only logical choice for this position. Seattle has not had a great run of TEs.chris98251":24tei8ki said:Spin Doctor":24tei8ki said:T Walter Jones
G Steve Hutchinson
C Max Unger
G Chris Gray
T Howard Ballard
TE Jimmy Graham
WR Steve Largent
WR Darrell Jackson
WR Doug Baldwin
QB Russell Wilson
RB Shaun Alexander
RB Marshawn Lynch
FB John L Williams
DE Michael Sinclair
DT Cortez Kennedy
DT Joe Nash
DE Jacob Green
LB Bobby Wagner
LB KJ Wright
LB Julian Peterson
CB Richard Sherman
CB Marcus Trufant
S Kenny Easley
S Earl Thomas
S Kam Chancellor
K Norm Johnson
P Michael Dickson
LS JP Darche
PR Joey Galloway
KR Leon Washington
So I made a few changes here, the most controversial would probably be Julian Peterson at the last OLB spot. Tatupu played ILB, not outside. Even though Julian Peterson only played here a few years he was a pro bowler each of those years. Even though the system called him to play a ton in coverage he racked up the sacks and QB hits.
The second change was swapping out Lockett. While he does have the most punt return yards, he also has the most volume. His body of work was also unimpressive when compared to Nate Burleson and Joey Galloway. Burleson and Galloway both averaged almost 3 more yards per return, and had more TDs on punt returns than Lockett. Galloway had 4 TDs and Burleson had two.
I decided to forego Brian Blades in favor of Darrell Jackson and Doug Baldwin. Jackson had better overall single seasons and had more TDs than Blades and a higher Y/A. Baldwin had more TDs and a higher Y/A. Each of these players were about 1000 yards off Blades total yardage -- but he also played for the Seahawks for many more years than Jackson and Baldwin. I left off Engram because his numbers trailed both Jackson and Baldwin.
The only TE that deserves to be on here is Jimmy Graham, he far and away has the best stats for TE's. He may have gotten flack here, but he was unquestionably the best TE we've ever had, he also sustained his play for longer than anyone else we've had at that position.
Wrong on Graham, he was a tall WR, never played like a real TE.
If your going to list TE's that were great that played here you have to list them as what they did at the position not stats as a receiver.
Tice, Fauria, both exceeded Graham as a TE but had less yards, they also played in a different system.
Ok then you are still wrong, Charlie Young was heads and shoulders above all the others as a receiver and blocker even if his best years were not here,he did well here also but since you are seemingly including careers here then Young is the best.
If you are just talking Eras and then cherry picking which ones and going further and cherry picking just receiving stats then maybe you have something. Choose favorite players on teams that you know and watched and forget the rest.
There is more to playing a position then raw stats in catches and yards. I would bet Graham had less blocks in his career then the others did in a season, remember, we are a RUNNING team first, Blocking is important, why we got Dissley, Olsen here now. We have always had a history as a primarily a running team.
RockinHawks":2jlbqr1g said:Marshawn made Graham look better than he had any right to look, as a TE.
RockinHawks":2mw7w3sd said:It's easy to look at stats and pro bowls, but Graham brought ZERO to our running game, Marshawn made Graham look better than he had any right to look, as a TE.
I would argue that Carlson is a close 2nd, where numbers are concerned:KinesProf":ol8scv3r said:Jimmy's blocking would only be relevant to this debate if anyone else was even remotely close in productivity. Jimmy holds most franchise records at the position, without there really being a close 2nd.
RockinHawks":33h4px10 said: