Meet the Seahawks athletic freak LT...

[xgeoff]

I am very worried about having Gilliam at LT. I do like his athleticism. The problem is that he just gets owned physically far too often. And that is a huge problem at LT. What is he going to do against Aaron Donald? He will go up against the best pass rusher of every team. I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

I wasn't a fan of Okung either, so I'm not unhappy that he is gone. I don't see Gilliam as the answer, though, and I am so hopeful that we can get some good OLinemen in the draft.

 

[titan3131]

Uhm I could be wrong but Aaron donald doesnt rush from the outside...

vs the rams he would be going against robert quinn right?

 

[McGruff]

I am very worried about having Gilliam at LT. I do like his athleticism. The problem is that he just gets owned physically far too often. And that is a huge problem at LT. What is he going to do against Aaron Donald? He will go up against the best pass rusher of every team. I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

I wasn't a fan of Okung either, so I'm not unhappy that he is gone. I don't see Gilliam as the answer, though, and I am so hopeful that we can get some good OLinemen in the draft.

Typically the best pass rusher on a team is a speed guy. That's what you normally go against at LT. Aaron Donald is a DT, so if Gilliam ends up going against him it will usually be as part of a combo block, not a one on one situation.

Gilliam was going against power ends last year as a RT. Not exactly his forte, but he got better there as the year progressed. I think a move to LT helps him WAY more than it hurts him.

 

[xgeoff]

I am very worried about having Gilliam at LT. I do like his athleticism. The problem is that he just gets owned physically far too often. And that is a huge problem at LT. What is he going to do against Aaron Donald? He will go up against the best pass rusher of every team. I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

I wasn't a fan of Okung either, so I'm not unhappy that he is gone. I don't see Gilliam as the answer, though, and I am so hopeful that we can get some good OLinemen in the draft.

Typically the best pass rusher on a team is a speed guy. That's what you normally go against at LT. Aaron Donald is a DT, so if Gilliam ends up going against him it will usually be as part of a combo block, not a one on one situation.

Gilliam was going against power ends last year as a RT. Not exactly his forte, but he got better there as the year progressed. I think a move to LT helps him WAY more than it hurts him.

I hope you're right. And, frankly, we do need to see what we get in the draft. Gilliam may end up competing against Sowell and a draft choice for the position.

 

[Alexander]

I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

How do you expect this unnamed "big fat immoveable object guy" to fare against speed rushers coming around the edge?

 

[McGruff]

I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

How do you expect this unnamed "big fat immoveable object guy" to fare against speed rushers coming around the edge?

Longer distance to run around?

It makes no sense, and in fact one of the things Robbie Tobeck said will become even more important with the elimination of the chop block is fast, agile linemen.

The fat lineman is dead.

 

[ivotuk]

I am very worried about having Gilliam at LT. I do like his athleticism. The problem is that he just gets owned physically far too often. And that is a huge problem at LT. What is he going to do against Aaron Donald? He will go up against the best pass rusher of every team. I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

I wasn't a fan of Okung either, so I'm not unhappy that he is gone. I don't see Gilliam as the answer, though, and I am so hopeful that we can get some good OLinemen in the draft.

Point taken. But Aaron Donald would just run around a big fat, immovable object (Bailey/Carpenter) guy.

 

[kearly]

I don't see how Gilliam is being rushed like Mike Zunino. This will be Gilliam's 3rd season in the NFL. His first year he was a backup LT and spent time learning the position. Last year he got the starting role at RT and though he had a rough beginning there is plenty of data showing a significant and steady improvement as the season went on. Now this 3rd season he is being given the chance to compete for the starting LT position. That seems like a very natural progression to me and I would trust Pete and his staff not to anoint Gilliam the LT if he doesn't legitimately beat out a couple of guys that they brought in with experience playing tackle in the NFL.

So are you saying that you thought Gilliam was NFL ready when Seattle plunged him into the starting RT job at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season? If that's what you think then fine. We would have very different opinions.

IMO, watching Gilliam last year was like watching Tyler Polumbus in 2010. He didn't kill us out there, but he didn't help us much either. If Seattle had kept Polumbus and moved him to LT I would not have been excited about it.

 

[LickMyNuts]

i agree with this 100%

the guy does not look like a LT to me on tape

there are tons of guys who can blow the doors off the gym but they will never be football players

yes, he has the physical tools but if he is our starting left tackle week one i'll be concerned

I don't see how Gilliam is being rushed like Mike Zunino. This will be Gilliam's 3rd season in the NFL. His first year he was a backup LT and spent time learning the position. Last year he got the starting role at RT and though he had a rough beginning there is plenty of data showing a significant and steady improvement as the season went on. Now this 3rd season he is being given the chance to compete for the starting LT position. That seems like a very natural progression to me and I would trust Pete and his staff not to anoint Gilliam the LT if he doesn't legitimately beat out a couple of guys that they brought in with experience playing tackle in the NFL.

So are you saying that you though Gilliam was NFL ready when Seattle plunged him into the starting RT job at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season? If that's what you think then fine. We would have very different opinions.

 

[kearly]

After a bad showing by Justin Britt at RT the Seahawks put Gilliam at RT and Britt at LG. Gilliam was originally a backup LT but he had to switch to RT. He was given two weeks to learn his new position before facing Robert Quinn and Chris Long and the St. Louis Rams in week 1.

Weeks 1-5 Gilliam was ranked 54th in pass protection and 26th in run blocking. Weeks 5-10 he was ranked 25th in pass protection and 11th in run blocking. Weeks 11-13 Gilliam was ranked 17th in pass protection and 1st in run blocking."

This is most likely from PFF, an agency that scores every play on a subjective -2 to +2 scale based on how that play looked. Ergo, the entire Seahawks OL had abysmal blocking grades when Lynch and Michael were lined up at RB, but good grades when Thomas Rawls was back there. Their system doesn't account for a RB or QB making them look better than they really are (and vice-versa).

I appreciate what PFF attempts to do but I do not personally think they are very good at it. And even if they were, I don't much like how they puff their chests as experts or as a stats company when in reality they are closer to being a film critic than an actual statistician.

 

[McGruff]

I don't see how Gilliam is being rushed like Mike Zunino. This will be Gilliam's 3rd season in the NFL. His first year he was a backup LT and spent time learning the position. Last year he got the starting role at RT and though he had a rough beginning there is plenty of data showing a significant and steady improvement as the season went on. Now this 3rd season he is being given the chance to compete for the starting LT position. That seems like a very natural progression to me and I would trust Pete and his staff not to anoint Gilliam the LT if he doesn't legitimately beat out a couple of guys that they brought in with experience playing tackle in the NFL.

So are you saying that you thought Gilliam was NFL ready when Seattle plunged him into the starting RT job at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season? If that's what you think then fine. We would have very different opinions.

IMO, watching Gilliam last year was like watching Tyler Polumbus in 2010. He didn't kill us out there, but he didn't help us much either.

I think that partially points to, well, the point.

They threw Gilliam out there early, at a position that didn't suit him, with little experience, and he didn't kill us.

And from there, he continued to improve. Dramatically by my eye. To the point where by the end of the season, I thought he was our best lineman.

If he can do that over the course of a year at a position that works against his natural skills, imagine what he can do with more time at a position that better suits him.

I admit, its a projection, but one I feel confident in.

 

[kearly]

I think that partially points to, well, the point.

They threw Gilliam out there early, at a position that didn't suit him, with little experience, and he didn't kill us.

And from there, he continued to improve. Dramatically by my eye. To the point where by the end of the season, I thought he was our best lineman.

If he can do that over the course of a year at a position that works against his natural skills, imagine what he can do with more time at a position that better suits him.

I can't dispute your opinion because I didn't watch Gilliam closely last season. What I can say is that when I did notice him, it was almost always for negative reasons.

To be brutally honest I don't know if there was a single bright spot on the 2015 OL for me. Lewis and Carp got me to notice their play for good reasons in 2014. Sweezy and Breno got me to notice their good play in 2013. Same thing with Unger and Okung in 2011-2012. But nobody really leaped out at me as a player who looked impressive last year.

Anyway, as much as I like prospects like Coleman and Ifedi, they are waste benders and may very well end up at LG. If Seattle views them as guards and Conklin gets taken before #26, then it's possible that Garry Gilliam, as unimpressive as he is, might actually be better as a 2016 starter than the available options at #26. I personally don't feel that way but my opinion is meaningless, it's all about what PC/JS and Tom Cable think.

 

[McGruff]

I think that partially points to, well, the point.

They threw Gilliam out there early, at a position that didn't suit him, with little experience, and he didn't kill us.

And from there, he continued to improve. Dramatically by my eye. To the point where by the end of the season, I thought he was our best lineman.

If he can do that over the course of a year at a position that works against his natural skills, imagine what he can do with more time at a position that better suits him.

I can't dispute your opinion because I didn't watch Gilliam closely last season. What I can say is that when I did notice him, it was almost always for negative reasons.

To be brutally honest I don't know if there was a single bright spot on the 2015 OL for me. Lewis and Carp got me to notice their play for good reasons in 2014. Sweezy and Breno got me to notice their good play in 2013. Same thing with Unger and Okung in 2011-2012. But nobody really leaped out at me as a player who looked impressive last year.

But isn't that pretty much always the case with line play? Not noticing unless its bad.

And BTW, I largely agree with you. When I say Gilliam was our best at the end of the season, its not necessarily a ringing endorsement. But given his relative inexperience at the position and upward trajectory over the course of the season, I think it's reason for hope.

 

[kearly]

But isn't that pretty much always the case with line play? Not noticing unless its bad.

Um, maybe you didn't read the text you just quoted, but I just gave you six examples of players I noticed for playing well.

But like I said, I didn't watch Gilliam all that closely so maybe my opinion would change if I did. What I can tell you is that the entire OL as a whole played WAY better when Rawls was in there compared to when he wasn't. To me that speaks much more of Rawls' value than the OL.

 

[Own The West]

I'm curious as to why Spriggs gets no love on here. Is it because he's actually played LT?

 

[xgeoff]

I'd rather have a big fat immoveable object guy.

How do you expect this unnamed "big fat immoveable object guy" to fare against speed rushers coming around the edge?

Longer distance to run around?

It makes no sense, and in fact one of the things Robbie Tobeck said will become even more important with the elimination of the chop block is fast, agile linemen.

The fat lineman is dead.

A lot of times you just have to push the speed rusher past. You see that sometimes with cliff Avril. He beats the guy to the edge and the qb steps up and the tackle just pushes him on by.

If the fat tackle is dead I think it is because the NFL is a copycat league, not because it is impractical.

 

[DJrmb]

I don't see how Gilliam is being rushed like Mike Zunino. This will be Gilliam's 3rd season in the NFL. His first year he was a backup LT and spent time learning the position. Last year he got the starting role at RT and though he had a rough beginning there is plenty of data showing a significant and steady improvement as the season went on. Now this 3rd season he is being given the chance to compete for the starting LT position. That seems like a very natural progression to me and I would trust Pete and his staff not to anoint Gilliam the LT if he doesn't legitimately beat out a couple of guys that they brought in with experience playing tackle in the NFL.

So are you saying that you thought Gilliam was NFL ready when Seattle plunged him into the starting RT job at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season? If that's what you think then fine. We would have very different opinions.

IMO, watching Gilliam last year was like watching Tyler Polumbus in 2010. He didn't kill us out there, but he didn't help us much either. If Seattle had kept Polumbus and moved him to LT I would not have been excited about it.

In my opinion yes Gilliam was as NFL ready as he likely would have ever been to play at RT last year. I don't believe you can teach a player everything they need to know in practices, especially with the new CBA taking so much away from practices. At some point you have to push the bird out of the nest and let them fly or fall and I think Gilliam was at that point last year. He struggled at first but not so much that he completely failed. He got the valuable and necessary reps and improved weekly to the point that he was a competent starter towards the end of the season.

I agree with you and McGruff that he's no world beater. However, talent is there and to me it feels like a good time to let him compete for LT if he really wants it...