After thinking about it, I'm rooting for Irvin to stay

[vin.couve12]

I do like Irvin a lot and I would definitely expect that there would be a big drop off if he doesn't come back, but 10M has really got to be out of our price range. Nary do you see a player at 260 running a 4.5 flat that can make outstanding pass plays in coverage, rush the passer, and set the edge with real force and I would think other teams have to know the value in that.

I agree with you, Kearly. I just don't think he'll stay though. 10M? Ugh, we've got another puzzle to put together this offseason and it's a tight fit. Really hard to see this happening....

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

Mike Morgan played over Irvin quite a few times at the end of the season.

Malcolm Smith also replaced him in the late 2013 run.

Not sure they even feel like they need a player like Irvin to play that role.

 

[AgentDib]

I'm pretty torn on this one like most. Irvin has been a key cog for us recently and it doesn't look like we have a replacement ready, but at the same time having an entire group of highly paid LB's is a questionable roster strategy.

Could Pinkins be the replacement? He has the speed and the size and pretty much a full year to gain LB experience.

 

[pehawk]

Finally kearly has thought this through. Although I think comparable vacancy isn't Maxwell its probably Carpenter (or even Breno to lesser extent).

Like those two Irvin gets unfairly critiqued due to a lack of understanding of scheme and role. Say Bruce can go using Fade's logic, sure. That makes sense. But this saying Bruce isnt a valuable player/specimen is ludicrous.

HoustonHawk's post is just, umm, wow.

 

[chris98251]

I'm sure greed enters the picture at some point with certain guys, and they won't even mind playing on losing team to get twice the contract, but economically speaking, anything more than 30 million in a bank account, is just showing off.

If you can't live the rest of your life on 40 million and relative good health, you're an idiot.

I'd rather play on a team that gets me trophies, national night games, rings, 40 million, and one-on one coverage, than play on a team that pays me 80 million, with a half-full stadium, no national night games, no rings, and I get triple covered in every game.

Greedy idiotic bastards.

Irvin has his ring, he likes the atmosphere and his team mates, but he is also sacrificing his body and watching others on the team have injuries and the inside information on people he has rubbed shoulders with on the long term effects I am sure weighs in on wanting to get paid so to speak. Also we have seen so called trustworthy financial consultants rape athletes of their money, I hope that isn't his case but not being him it's hard to judge his motives.

 

[DavidSeven]

Finally kearly has thought this through. Although I think comparable vacancy isn't Maxwell its probably Carpenter (or even Breno to lesser extent).

Like those two Irvin gets unfairly critiqued due to a lack of understanding of scheme and role. Say Bruce can go using Fade's logic, sure. That makes sense. But this saying Bruce isnt a valuable player/specimen is ludicrous.

HoustonHawk's post is just, umm, wow.

I would totally agree that Breno and Carp were underrated losses, but those guys also played every down. Bruce is lucky to be on the field for 2/3 of the game, and that's with his pass rushing duties. Unless the team is finally ready to believe in him as a consistent and true DE, I don't see any way justifying a big contract for a 3rd LB, who's on the field for half the game at best. Now, if they think Frank Clark or a rookie can fill the 3rd down role on the D-line, that makes the decision even easier. No one's paying Bruce to be just a 3rd LB who's taken out on nickel packages.

 

[pehawk]

Bruce played 72% of the snaps and missed a game or two, right?

 

[hawkfan68]

Finally kearly has thought this through. Although I think comparable vacancy isn't Maxwell its probably Carpenter (or even Breno to lesser extent).

Like those two Irvin gets unfairly critiqued due to a lack of understanding of scheme and role. Say Bruce can go using Fade's logic, sure. That makes sense. But this saying Bruce isnt a valuable player/specimen is ludicrous.

HoustonHawk's post is just, umm, wow.

I would totally agree that Breno and Carp were underrated losses, but those guys also played every down. Bruce is lucky to be on the field for 2/3 of the game, and that's with his pass rushing duties. Unless the team is finally ready to believe in him as a consistent and true DE, I don't see any way justifying a big contract for a 3rd LB, who's on the field for half the game at best. Now, if they think Frank Clark or a rookie can fill the 3rd down role on the D-line, that makes the decision even easier. No one's paying Bruce to be just a 3rd LB who's taken out on nickel packages.

Irvin was pretty good cover LB. He also could provide a pass rush. Not many LBs can do both. He can. He is a better cover guy than KJ Wright. Many laud Wright on here. The loss of Irvin (if he goes) is huge. Unfortunately, people won't realize it until he's gone. His impact may not show up much on the stat sheet but he does what he is asked to do and does it well.

 

[kearly]

I like Irvin as much as the next guy but the hype surrounding his free agency has baffled me.

He's grown. A lot. But he was probably our 11th most important defensive starter in 2013 and 2014. This dude was outplayed by Malcom Smith and O'Brien Schoefield in our championship run. If you're going to sign him to a crazy deal based on upside, you cannot also keep KJ Wright and Bobby Wagner. What are we doing sinking so many resources into the most fungible position group on the team?

We had a #1 defense with the ghost of Leroy Hill as a starting LB, for goodness sakes.

I thought he really stepped things up the past two seasons. He might be our best cover linebacker, he's easily our best pass rush linebacker, and while he's not quite as good in open space doing routine linebacker stuff as Wagner and Wright are, he's closed the gap considerably. He's also pretty good at fighting through bodies to get to the ball.

I thought KJ Wright really stepped up his game last year and solidified himself as one of the best 4-3 OLBs in the game, but to me he is more like Leroy Hill than Irvin is. I feel like Seattle could replace Wright's skillset with another 4th round LB if they had to, but with Irvin, to get a comparable physical talent you'd pretty much have to blow a 1st rounder.

I've recently been studying the very best 1st round LBs this year, guys that will probably not last to #26. Resources aside, just simply looking at them as players, I don't think I would take any of them over Irvin. If Seattle wants their SAM LB to have special physical talent and versatility then it seems that such a goal would require substantial investment, either in money or a high draft pick.

Initially, I had the same opinion as pretty much everyone else in here. Irvin was worth maybe $5-6m APY, that Seattle could replace him easily, etc. But having seen how badly teams exploited guys like KPL last year, as well as how hard it is to replace Irvin's skillset in the draft, I came to realize that I had been underestimating his rarity and value.

I'm not saying that Seattle HAS to keep Irvin for absurd money, only saying that if they do, I'll 100% understand why they did it.

 

[Jville]

My impression is that it is against those hurry up offenses (designed to prevent substitution) where Bruce Irvin's value really shows up. So, I would anticipate that the absence of a Bruce Irvin hybrid is something Chip Kelly or a Tom Brady would seek to exploit.

On the other hand, in an age when nickle defenses have become more prevalent verses a passing emphasis, the need for excellence out of that 5th defensive back and passing down rush specialist rivals that of a #3 linebacker. So .... somethings gotta give ... there is only so much money in the kitty ... and it looks like there is going to be a lot of interest in Bruce Irving.

If Irving moves on, the defensive mix is gonna change. The spectacle would be different and the resulting intrigue would be in how that mix would look and how well it would function. Irvin's departure would affect the competition at defensive end, linebacker as well as the defensive backfield. In my eyes, that isn't a bad thing.

I have enjoyed and appreciate Irvins' contributions and growth. But, after decades of following the Seahawks, I have become receptive to the changes that come with roster churn. So .... I'M IN .... regardless of where Bruce Irvin's future lies.

The show must go on!

 

[MontanaHawk05]

I like Irvin as much as the next guy but the hype surrounding his free agency has baffled me.

He's grown. A lot. But he was probably our 11th most important defensive starter in 2013 and 2014.

Irvin made a couple game-clinching sacks during that run. A lot of his value lay there.

 

[xgeoff]

Irvin's complete game skill set is rare, a lesser Von Miller if you will. Stands up strong against the run at the los, solid edge rusher, can cover downfield, 4.4 speed, tough guy.

So, you aren't going to replace the player with one guy if you lose him. It will take a plateau of 2/3 guys to try to do the job. KJ could move over and do 2/3rds of the job (run d and coverage), then get a run and chase rb on the other side and add another rotational edge rusher.

You look at the free agent lbers out there and you'd have to roll Barron, Perry and Upshaw into one player to try to come close to Bruce. But football people see that, and I think his deal is going to be very very impressive.

I so totally disagree with this. Irvin is not a good pass rusher, he's not a great cover guy, he doesn't pursue well. The only thing I've heard said that he does well is 'set the edge'. Big deal. He wasn't a first round talent and is only worth keeping if he doesn't want a bunch of money.

Agree with the assertion that we don't need to clone him. There are many LBers in the draft who *may* be able to step in.

 

[A-Dog]

The reason you let Irvin go is because he's a medicore pass rusher and his role as a SAM is limited on our team. It doesn't make sense to pay both him and KJ Wright. If Irvin was a top pass rusher then I'd want to keep him but he's simply not good enough in that role to justify his cost.

Take that $10-11M and put it towards Mario Williams. He becomes the starting LEO with Avril now playing passing downs and rotating in at Leo.

Move Wright to SAM on mixed downs. He's built like a SAM anyway and lacks speed and quickness as a WILL. He stays in with Wagner on passing downs.

Draft Feeney in the 3rd round and have him compete with KPL and Pinkings for the WILL spot on mixed downs.

A) D-Line gets bigger and stronger on mixed downs

B) Pass rush is improved

C) Better depth on the D-Line

D) More speed at WILL

E) 3rd round comp pick for Irvin as a bonus

 

[pehawk]

I so totally disagree with this. Irvin is not a good pass rusher, he's not a great cover guy, he doesn't pursue well. The only thing I've heard said that he does well is 'set the edge'. Big deal. He wasn't a first round talent and is only worth keeping if he doesn't want a bunch of money.

Agree with the assertion that we don't need to clone him. There are many LBers in the draft who *may* be able to step in.

See what I mean with the Carp analogy? Sure you have to swap out LB terminology for OL terminology, but still.

Kinda uncanny

 

[chris98251]

Irvin brings flexibility, is he down, is he up, is he in coverage, is he in run protect or pass protect, is he blitzing or is he edge rushing. All in one player, how many to replace that? That's why he has value. He may not be a All Pro at any of them, but he can do all of them well.

 

[peppersjap]

Irvin's complete game skill set is rare, a lesser Von Miller if you will. Stands up strong against the run at the los, solid edge rusher, can cover downfield, 4.4 speed, tough guy.

So, you aren't going to replace the player with one guy if you lose him. It will take a plateau of 2/3 guys to try to do the job. KJ could move over and do 2/3rds of the job (run d and coverage), then get a run and chase rb on the other side and add another rotational edge rusher.

You look at the free agent lbers out there and you'd have to roll Barron, Perry and Upshaw into one player to try to come close to Bruce. But football people see that, and I think his deal is going to be very very impressive.

I like Irvin and he is a "lesser" Von Miller as is every other player at that position in the league. Bruce Irvin's name has no business being brought up in the same sentence as Von Miller

 

[pehawk]

Bruce is seemingly leaking the thought of a hometown discount. And unlike others that say it, Irvin means it.

 

[JAGHAWK]

Bruce Irvin ‏@BIrvin_WVU11 6h6 hours ago
@Bwagz54 no matter what happens bro our brotherhood is bigger than football it's forever! I appreciate u b wagz love u bro!

Bruce Irvin ‏@BIrvin_WVU11 6h6 hours ago
12'sss I love you!


I thought I was ready for this. Turns out I'm not.

 

[pehawk]

Irvin leaving will be the first business decision exodus, in the Pete Era, I'll be emotionally disturbed over. Love, love, love Bruce.

 

[Popeyejones]

Irvin leaving will be the first business decision exodus, in the Pete Era, I'll be emotionally disturbed over. Love, love, love Bruce.

Not for Tate?

He, for me, embodied everything that was pretty awesome about the Seahawks at that time.

For a Hawks fan I'd also imagine that Browner leaving would have sucked, if only because it broke up the OG LOB.