Why we shouldn't echo national experts' opinions on our QB

[Own The West]

In other news, a poster on another forum was referring to Wilson as a BroncHoe now. It made me lol.

 

[toffee]

If you don’t like Geno Maelmstrom and KEasly will go after you then “oh but I don’t think he’s good either” so when he sucks they can act like they knew it all along. It’s just a littke whiny B move. They will pivot in a few weeks. So really. Just disingenuous and taking both sides of an issue after repeatedly mobbing people who disagree. It‘ll be interesting to see.

couple of thoughts:

1. A player could be productive on the field but his locker room antics constantly pulls the team down. Nothing is absolute.
2. People do learn or gather data over time, and change their perspectives basing on new data.

 

[Rock_the_Hawk]

A potential problem with Geno as starter: for the last 6.5 games, either he played it very safe or the coaches limited his plays. With that safe approach, games will likely to enter 4th quarter with tight scores. Geno hasn't displayed ability to play efficiently under pressure, in fact the major difference between Geno and Russ in 2021 was under pressure (see below), if we couldn't score enough in first 3 quarters, Geno will be stressed, and we shall see.
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We all do agree that a playoff run is pretty darn unlikely with the current quarterbacks.

There are more people complaining about delusional Geno fans than there actually are delusional Geno fans.

Here is my take on Geno. The Very first thing that Makes me take a step back is that the thing I hear the most about Geno is that,

"We all know what we have with Geno."

Really?

Do we really know what we have in Geno?

Everybody says that, almost every "EXPERT" analyst in the Damn world says those exact words.

except one person. Who is that you ask?

How about Pete. LOL

I trust none of them because they are just looking for a story they are not evaluating from a coaching standpoint.

Pete had the chance to get a number of decent QB's in the off season. He chose to stick with Geno

Why Is that?

Because on some level Pete thinks Geno is worthy of the starting job. Pete thinks that Geno has earned this opportunity. I'm 100 percent sure that If Pete thought for a second that Geno couldn't do this job, he would not give him the opportunity period! Pete doesn't tank it's against EVERYTHING he believes in!

The one thing that I do know is that Pete is has made a 40-year career out of making the "experts" look like bumbling fools!

The other HUGE factor is that IF Geno was not good enough to be the starting QB of the Seattle Seahawks he Absolutely would NOT have the respect of his teammates, and this is a fact.

I don't know the exact reasons why Geno did not have success in his early career, I'm pretty sure it wasn't lack of talent. I would bet money that he wasn't properly brought along as a rookie he probably needed to sit for a year and be brought up slowly. that's my bet but I'm unsure.

Geno Has been in a backup Role with the Seahawks for 4 years. He has learned from Wilson and Carroll and I'm willing to bet that the 4-year experience has helped him understand the position in much more depth than in his previous years with the Giants and Jets.

Geno has played in 4 regular season games since he has been with the Hawks all last year. I went back and watched those games. I saw improvement in each game. what I did see is that the players around Geno were the reason they lost the games with the exception of the Pittsburg game.

I don't believe we as fans nor the "experts" have seen enough of Geno to make an informed statement that we know what we are going to get out of Geno..

do we know what we have in Geno I say NO! We don't and i think he is going to surprise a lot of people.

 

[hawkfan68]

Here is my take on Geno. The Very first thing that Makes me take a step back is that the thing I hear the most about Geno is that,

"We all know what we have with Geno."

Really?

Do we really know what we have in Geno?

Everybody says that, almost every "EXPERT" analyst in the Damn world says those exact words.

except one person. Who is that you ask?

How about Pete. LOL

I trust none of them because they are just looking for a story they are not evaluating from a coaching standpoint.

Pete had the chance to get a number of decent QB's in the off season. He chose to stick with Geno

Why Is that?

Because on some level Pete thinks Geno is worthy of the starting job. Pete thinks that Geno has earned this opportunity. I'm 100 percent sure that If Pete thought for a second that Geno couldn't do this job, he would not give him the opportunity period! Pete doesn't tank it's against EVERYTHING he believes in!

The one thing that I do know is that Pete is has made a 40-year career out of making the "experts" look like bumbling fools!

The other HUGE factor is that IF Geno was not good enough to be the starting QB of the Seattle Seahawks he Absolutely would NOT have the respect of his teammates, and this is a fact.

I don't know the exact reasons why Geno did not have success in his early career, I'm pretty sure it wasn't lack of talent. I would bet money that he wasn't properly brought along as a rookie he probably needed to sit for a year and be brought up slowly. that's my bet but I'm unsure.

Geno Has been in a backup Role with the Seahawks for 4 years. He has learned from Wilson and Carroll and I'm willing to bet that the 4-year experience has helped him understand the position in much more depth than in his previous years with the Giants and Jets.

Geno has played in 4 regular season games since he has been with the Hawks all last year. I went back and watched those games. I saw improvement in each game. what I did see is that the players around Geno were the reason they lost the games with the exception of the Pittsburg game.

I don't believe we as fans nor the "experts" have seen enough of Geno to make an informed statement that we know what we are going to get out of Geno..

do we know what we have in Geno I say NO! We don't and i think he is going to surprise a lot of people.

Great post. You make some valid points. However, just a minor correction - this will be Geno's 3rd season with the Seahawks. He signed in the 2020. https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/15864/geno-smith
Even with that said, he's the longest tenured Seahawk QB on the roster. This is Lock's first season.

 

[toffee]

Here is my take on Geno. The Very first thing that Makes me take a step back is that the thing I hear the most about Geno is that,

"We all know what we have with Geno."

Really?

Do we really know what we have in Geno?

Everybody says that, almost every "EXPERT" analyst in the Damn world says those exact words.

except one person. Who is that you ask?

How about Pete. LOL

I trust none of them because they are just looking for a story they are not evaluating from a coaching standpoint.

Pete had the chance to get a number of decent QB's in the off season. He chose to stick with Geno

Why Is that?

Because on some level Pete thinks Geno is worthy of the starting job. Pete thinks that Geno has earned this opportunity. I'm 100 percent sure that If Pete thought for a second that Geno couldn't do this job, he would not give him the opportunity period! Pete doesn't tank it's against EVERYTHING he believes in!

The one thing that I do know is that Pete is has made a 40-year career out of making the "experts" look like bumbling fools!

The other HUGE factor is that IF Geno was not good enough to be the starting QB of the Seattle Seahawks he Absolutely would NOT have the respect of his teammates, and this is a fact.

I don't know the exact reasons why Geno did not have success in his early career, I'm pretty sure it wasn't lack of talent. I would bet money that he wasn't properly brought along as a rookie he probably needed to sit for a year and be brought up slowly. that's my bet but I'm unsure.

Geno Has been in a backup Role with the Seahawks for 4 years. He has learned from Wilson and Carroll and I'm willing to bet that the 4-year experience has helped him understand the position in much more depth than in his previous years with the Giants and Jets.

Geno has played in 4 regular season games since he has been with the Hawks all last year. I went back and watched those games. I saw improvement in each game. what I did see is that the players around Geno were the reason they lost the games with the exception of the Pittsburg game.

I don't believe we as fans nor the "experts" have seen enough of Geno to make an informed statement that we know what we are going to get out of Geno..

do we know what we have in Geno I say NO! We don't and i think he is going to surprise a lot of people.

Well said, and Pete just predicted a 10+ win season. He has either totally lost his marbles, or he knows something that we all don't. I was not a Geno guy, even against signing him this off season after the DUI. I started watching films after Pete signed him and I was surprised, Geno is physically gifted, his ball velocity is the same as Russ, FASTER THAN LOCK, who supposed to have strong arms. And Geno is faster and more athletic than Lock, who was supposed to be very athletic.

I felt like it would be reasonable to say that Geno has all the tools, except whatever between the ears. Stealing from Joe Montana and Bill Walsh on QB:

1. Read, and make the right read, (Montana)
2. Footwork (Walsh)
3. Throw the ball in time (Montana)
4. Poise under pressure (Walsh)

(1) is pure football IQ, and quick mind to process, (2) is skill, (3) is a result of 1 and 2, (4) is something can't be taught. Watching Geno is the past few games, he was pretty good with (1), not perfect but doable. His footwork (2) was better to my eyes than Lock, (3) again not bad, (4) still lacking.

Unless he regress or cracked under pressure, I think we got ourself that game manager for Peteball.

Side note, the more I read into Geno and Lock, the more mysterious about all the Lock strong points, i.e strong arm, running ability, etc., Lock is substantially slower than Geno and Russ, his ball velocity was lower than Geno and Russ.

Combine score wise, Lock didn't excel. He hasn't shown any progress in making the right read, and his footwork was strange. I would be worried if Geno goes down.

Off topic, Allen, Brady and Mahomes excelled at ball velocity, their fast ball was way faster than Russ Geno and Lock. Mahomes' 3 cone made him a really nimble guy,

	Russell Wilson	Geno Smith	Drew Lock	Patrick Mahomes	John Allen	Tom Brady
Height	5'10"	6'2"	6'3"	6'2"	6'5"	6'4"
Weight	204	218	228	225	237	211
Arm length	31	32.5	32.5	33.25	33.25	32.75
Hand Size	10.25	9.28	9	9.25	10.13	9.38
Wingspan		76	77.25	78.5	78.375
40 yard dash	4.53	4.58	4.69	4.8	4.75	5.3
40 yard mph	18.06	17.86	17.44	17.04	17.22	15.44
20 yard split	2.63	2.69	2.74	2.8	2.74	2.99
10 yard split	1.55	1.62	1.61	1.65	1.59	1.77
QB ball velocity	55	55	54	60	62	61
Wonderlic	28	24		24		33
Vertical leap	34	33.5		30	33.5	24.5
broad jump
20 yard shuttle	4.09		4.12	4.08	4.4	4.28
3 cones	6.97		7.03	6.88	6.9	7.2

 

[Bear-Hawk]

Here is my take on Geno. The Very first thing that Makes me take a step back is that the thing I hear the most about Geno is that,

"We all know what we have with Geno."

Really?

Do we really know what we have in Geno?

Everybody says that, almost every "EXPERT" analyst in the Damn world says those exact words.

except one person. Who is that you ask?

How about Pete. LOL

I trust none of them because they are just looking for a story they are not evaluating from a coaching standpoint.

Pete had the chance to get a number of decent QB's in the off season. He chose to stick with Geno

Why Is that?

Because on some level Pete thinks Geno is worthy of the starting job. Pete thinks that Geno has earned this opportunity. I'm 100 percent sure that If Pete thought for a second that Geno couldn't do this job, he would not give him the opportunity period! Pete doesn't tank it's against EVERYTHING he believes in!

The one thing that I do know is that Pete is has made a 40-year career out of making the "experts" look like bumbling fools!

The other HUGE factor is that IF Geno was not good enough to be the starting QB of the Seattle Seahawks he Absolutely would NOT have the respect of his teammates, and this is a fact.

I don't know the exact reasons why Geno did not have success in his early career, I'm pretty sure it wasn't lack of talent. I would bet money that he wasn't properly brought along as a rookie he probably needed to sit for a year and be brought up slowly. that's my bet but I'm unsure.

Geno Has been in a backup Role with the Seahawks for 4 years. He has learned from Wilson and Carroll and I'm willing to bet that the 4-year experience has helped him understand the position in much more depth than in his previous years with the Giants and Jets.

Geno has played in 4 regular season games since he has been with the Hawks all last year. I went back and watched those games. I saw improvement in each game. what I did see is that the players around Geno were the reason they lost the games with the exception of the Pittsburg game.

I don't believe we as fans nor the "experts" have seen enough of Geno to make an informed statement that we know what we are going to get out of Geno..

do we know what we have in Geno I say NO! We don't and i think he is going to surprise a lot of people.

I agree with most of this, but here’s my question: If the 49ers had cut Jimmy G, would the Seahawks have pursued him?

 

[Rock_the_Hawk]

Well said, and Pete just predicted a 10+ win season. He has either totally lost his marbles, or he knows something that we all don't. I was not a Geno guy, even against signing him this off season after the DUI. I started watching films after Pete signed him and I was surprised, Geno is physically gifted, his ball velocity is the same as Russ, FASTER THAN LOCK, who supposed to have strong arms. And Geno is faster and more athletic than Lock, who was supposed to be very athletic.

I felt like it would be reasonable to say that Geno has all the tools, except whatever between the ears. Stealing from Joe Montana and Bill Walsh on QB:

1. Read, and make the right read, (Montana)
2. Footwork (Walsh)
3. Throw the ball in time (Montana)
4. Poise under pressure (Walsh)

(1) is pure football IQ, and quick mind to process, (2) is skill, (3) is a result of 1 and 2, (4) is something can't be taught. Watching Geno is the past few games, he was pretty good with (1), not perfect but doable. His footwork (2) was better to my eyes than Lock, (3) again not bad, (4) still lacking.

Unless he regress or cracked under pressure, I think we got ourself that game manager for Peteball.

Side note, the more I read into Geno and Lock, the more mysterious about all the Lock strong points, i.e strong arm, running ability, etc., Lock is substantially slower than Geno and Russ, his ball velocity was lower than Geno and Russ.

Combine score wise, Lock didn't excel. He hasn't shown any progress in making the right read, and his footwork was strange. I would be worried if Geno goes down.

Off topic, Allen, Brady and Mahomes excelled at ball velocity, their fast ball was way faster than Russ Geno and Lock. Mahomes' 3 cone made him a really nimble guy,

	Russell Wilson	Geno Smith	Drew Lock	Patrick Mahomes	John Allen	Tom Brady
Height	5'10"	6'2"	6'3"	6'2"	6'5"	6'4"
Weight	204	218	228	225	237	211
Arm length	31	32.5	32.5	33.25	33.25	32.75
Hand Size	10.25	9.28	9	9.25	10.13	9.38
Wingspan		76	77.25	78.5	78.375
40 yard dash	4.53	4.58	4.69	4.8	4.75	5.3
40 yard mph	18.06	17.86	17.44	17.04	17.22	15.44
20 yard split	2.63	2.69	2.74	2.8	2.74	2.99
10 yard split	1.55	1.62	1.61	1.65	1.59	1.77
QB ball velocity	55	55	54	60	62	61
Wonderlic	28	24		24		33
Vertical leap	34	33.5		30	33.5	24.5
broad jump
20 yard shuttle	4.09		4.12	4.08	4.4	4.28
3 cones	6.97		7.03	6.88	6.9	7.2

Wow that's impressive!

Here is the thing I've been watching player interviews and Ive been noticing like today with Lockett, that They seem to act like there is a surprise coming...So it feels to me that the Hawks have are going to match a scheme that really fits Geno and the personnel they have. Defensively as well... I think something special is coming! I feel it in my bones!

Here is my other point, What is it that Pete does best? Well, from my perspective he puts players in position to have success this is a Pete Carroll staple! Ask yourself the question, do you think the games Geno played in last year that they had the time to scheme around is strengths? Maybe a little bit.... but If you were Pete and Waldren the overall scheme was probably geared around Wilson last year; Geno just took over and they just adopted the scheme to Geno... I would think this year it would be different... the scheme is going to be around Geno's strengths, and I THINK this is a really good point that might be overlooked.

 

[Rock_the_Hawk]

I agree with most of this, but here’s my question: If the 49ers had cut Jimmy G, would the Seahawks have pursued him?

Impossible to know...

 

[Sun Tzu]

I agree with most of this, but here’s my question: If the 49ers had cut Jimmy G, would the Seahawks have pursued him?

My guess is no. But, there is no way for any of us to know.

 

[Scout]

The current paradigm is to hit gold by drafting a franchise QB and win the Super Bowl before he can go free agent and break the bank with his second contract that sucks up so much cap space that you can’t afford a Super Bowl caliber roster around him. I’m hoping the Seahawks can go that route.

Ideally this is what the Hawks will do with the 2023 draft as having a starting QB on a rookie contract is a great opportunity to build a core of the team for the long haul.

 

[toffee]

Ideally this is what the Hawks will do with the 2023 draft as having a starting QB on a rookie contract is a great opportunity to build a core of the team for the long haul.

If Geno did ok this season, ie wins 7 games or so, didn't embarrass the team or himself, we will keep him for next season as the starter. With full understanding that he will mentor and yield to our next 'savior' draft pick when the kid is ready. This way, the kid didn't need to step in right away if he isn't ready, like Tre Lance. And Geno gets to make a few more millions for his later years. Not all rookies are ready to start, Russ was unique.

 

[Bear-Hawk]

I am really looking forward to both the free agency market and the dfraft for both the Seahawks and Bears. Both have the cap space and draft picks to be quite active in 2023 and accelerate their rebuilds.

I hope the Seahawks don’t miss in the QB sweepstakes like the Bears did with Trubisky. But, if you miss, keep drafting a QB until you find a winner. We Bears fans are hoping Fields is “the guy”.

 

[Appyhawk]

Hasn't this been dropped a thousand times? You don't always have a qb waiting in thr wings when you HAVE to let the one you have go. And just because the guy you want to replace the guy who left isn't available, doesn't mean you go and get whatever Tom, Dick or Harry who is standing around.

You improve the parts of your team that you can improve in the meantime, and get the qb you want when he's there.

None of that has to do with tanking? It's called smart football.

If you were in a loveless marriage, would you not get a divorce because you didn't have a side piece waiting for you?

And if you got a divorce, would you just shack up with the next chick or dude who came along, just so you could have a partner?

Smart guy or gal doesn't screw up twice and makes the next one count.

Doesnt mean your life has to be sh!t in the meantime..

And just because the qb that we will have at the controls for the next 10 years wasn't here in 2022, in the rediculously short 6 month window we were 'shopping', doesn't mean we have to suck in the meantime, or that we want to suck.

Don't get the logic...

I have to admit Welchers cracks me up. "people say I'm borderline clairvoyant".
Can't accuse him of lacking a good sense of humor.

 

[hawks4thewin]

I'm excited to see what happens..

 

[Appyhawk]

I'm excited to see what happens..

Me too! And I fully expect to be back in contention for tops in our division and conference by year after next.

 

[toffee]

Wow that's impressive!

Here is the thing I've been watching player interviews and Ive been noticing like today with Lockett, that They seem to act like there is a surprise coming...So it feels to me that the Hawks have are going to match a scheme that really fits Geno and the personnel they have. Defensively as well... I think something special is coming! I feel it in my bones!

Here is my other point, What is it that Pete does best? Well, from my perspective he puts players in position to have success this is a Pete Carroll staple! Ask yourself the question, do you think the games Geno played in last year that they had the time to scheme around is strengths? Maybe a little bit.... but If you were Pete and Waldren the overall scheme was probably geared around Wilson last year; Geno just took over and they just adopted the scheme to Geno... I would think this year it would be different... the scheme is going to be around Geno's strengths, and I THINK this is a really good point that might be overlooked.

It could also be the opposite, last year, especially the Rams game. Nothing was prepared against Geno, all game planning was for Russ and his i don't throw to the middle Russball. When Geno stepped in, the middle was wide open and he took advantage. This year, DCs will pay attention to Geno, watch film on him and game plan against him. DBs will watch enough film to know what the smallest twist of Geno's boby means In the end, things happen on any given Sunday, we shall see.

 

[Bear-Hawk]

My guess is no. But, there is no way for any of us to know.

I think they would have at least talked to him. He will be a free agent in 2023. He is a solid QB, and could make Seahawks a contender when the rebuild is complete. It’s an option if things don’t work out in the 2023 draft.

 

[Rock_the_Hawk]

It could also be the opposite, last year, especially the Rams game. Nothing was prepared against Geno, all game planning was for Russ and his i don't throw to the middle Russball. When Geno stepped in, the middle was wide open and he took advantage. This year, DCs will pay attention to Geno, watch film on him and game plan against him. DBs will watch enough film to know what the smallest twist of Geno's boby means In the end, things happen on any given Sunday, we shall see.

Im sure they are going to game plan for Geno and when they do, they are going to notice that Geno had a run game that consisted of a hurt collins... then they are going to remember what Penny looked like the last 6 games. Geno's last game was agaist the Jags and he looked really flipping good... i was horribly disappointed that we didnt get to see him play against the pack.. that would have answered a bunch of questions everybody is asking now... just sayin man...

 

[toffee]

Im sure they are going to do that. and when they do, they are going to notice that Geno had a run game that consisted of a hurt collins... then they are going to remember what Penny looked like the last 6 games. Geno's last game was agaist the Jags and he looked really flipping good... i was horribly disappointed that we didnt get to see him play against the pack.. that would have answered a bunch of questions everybody is asking now... just sayin man...

Geno isn't slow, in fact, quite fast. Not Russell Wilson fast but very fast for a QB at 4.58 sec 40yards, Russ was 4.53, Lock? 4.69 sec. I listed Brady just to remind folks that combine stuff do not made or break QB. But Geno's fast, faster than Mahomes, Allen and Lock. Geno didn't have Russ' ability to break tackles, or run in circles.

 

[pittpnthrs]

If you extrapolate his stats over a season, he'd have thrown close to 30 tds and 6 INTs.

I frankly don't give a flying Flip if that's 'qb1' worthy or not. It's better than the number of TDs Troy Aikman ever tossed in a season in his career... by 3. And Troy's completion percentage was 61.5 percent career passer.

Dude is in the Hall, and before you say 'it was a different era', the difference was that he didn't have to carry his team. Marino did, and put up stats that woukd be elite in this eraz so the 'period' arguement is squat. Marino didn't win diddly, put up Godly stats, but if you gave me a choice right now for this team between Marino and Aikman both in their primes, I'd have zero problem taking Aikman and his 'less than qb1' TD stats.

LOL. Aikman won Super Bowls. Geno will never sniff one unless somebody else takes him there. Which one would you rather have?