Question about a couple calls in the JAX game

[Dismas]

Two (non) calls stood out to me yesterday, please tell me if I am mistaken.

First, Jax WR has foot out of bounds, then catches ball . . refs call it incomplete. Isn't that supposed to be an illegal touch or something? I am sure there is a rule where a guy cannot go out of bounds then be first to touch the ball.


Second: Henne was about to get sacked, looks to the right, almost throws the ball to a lineman, then just spikes it into the dirt. He was still in the pocket, but the refs just casually called it incomplete. Was that not the textbook example of intentional grounding?


Those two non calls frustrated me badly . . not because of any edge they may have given JAX, but because they seemed horrible to me . . wtf? these refs are supposed to be somewhat competent, and both those calls seemed horribly obvious to me . . why were they missed?

 

[JesterHawk]

I think the receiver call was close. He was in the act of catching the ball when he stepped out (ball was in the air).

On a second look at the incomplete pass Henne was trying to throw it outside to the flat, but the contact from the Seattle player caused it to fall short, he didn't spike it.

 

[MOCHawk]

It is a foul for illegal touching if a forward pass (legal or illegal), thrown from behind the line of scrimmage:
(a) is first touched intentionally or is caught by an ineligible offensive player; or
(b) first touches or is caught by an eligible receiver who has gone out of bounds, either of his own volition or by being legally forced out of bounds, and has re-established
himself inbounds.
Penalty: Loss of five yards.
Note 1: If a forward pass (legal or illegal) is caught by an ineligible offensive player, the ball remains alive.
Note 2: The bat of a pass in flight by any player does not end a pass, nor does it change the impetus if the bat sends it in touch.
Note 3: If a player touches the ball after having been out of bounds, but prior to re-establishing himself inbounds with both feet or any part of his body other than his hands,
the pass is incomplete, and there is no penalty for illegal touching.

The grounding penalty was a miss, though one of the side judges pointed, indicating that an eligible received was in the area.

 

[LawlessHawk]

I don't believe it's illegal touching unless he steps out of bounds then returns in bounds and is the first to touch the ball. Catching the ball while out of bounds is simply an incomplete pass.

 

[fenderbender123]

Grounding wasn't called because the hit affected the pass

 

[sutz]

Grounding wasn't called because the hit affected the pass

Yeah, when the ball is tipped, a lot of rules go out the window.

 

[Jazzhawk]

He stepped out of bounds AS he was in the act of catching, so I don't think we can really expect it to be called a penalty.

 

[ivotuk]

I think the OP is correct. The refs even said "stepped out of bounds and did not re-establish both feet inbounds before catching the ball." That is illegal touching.

And Henne started to throw the ball to Joeckel then tried to pull it back when he realized he was a tackle (ineligible receiver). There was no "tipped ball." Henne threw it in to the ground, while still in the pocket, and since there is no more tuck rule, that is either intentional grounding, or a fumble. The hit was after he released the ball. If the hit had caused Chad to lose the ball, it would have been a fumble.

And there wasn't an eligible receiver in the area.

 

[fenderbender123]

And Henne started to throw the ball to Joeckel then tried to pull it back when he realized he was a tackle (ineligible receiver). There was no "tipped ball." Henne threw it in to the ground, while still in the pocket, and since there is no more tuck rule, that is either intentional grounding, or a fumble. The hit was after he released the ball. If the hit had caused Chad to lose the ball, it would have been a fumble.

I disagree. Although the ball wasn't tipped, the hit affected the pass. Think of situations when a QB throws a pass as he's getting hit and the ball winds up nowhere near a receiver. Grounding never gets called in those situations.

 

[Seahawk Mike]

There was also a play where Babin's entire head was lined up offsides and he ended up sacking Wilson...Big Breno couldn't even get out of his stance by the time Babin was by him.

It seems this exact thing happens multiple times during a game...

 

[Attyla the Hawk]

I think the OP is correct. The refs even said "stepped out of bounds and did not re-establish both feet inbounds before catching the ball." That is illegal touching.

Illegal touching would have required that he stepped out, then stepped back in bounds with both feet, then was the first to touch the ball. If he hadn't reestablished position in bounds, then it's simply an incomplete pass.

 

[Sprfunk]

There were a few holding penalties that were not called on us that should have been called. If that was an away game I think we get a few more holding calls.

 

[HawkHack]

Hey, I'm just happy the refs kept the hankies in their pockets for the most part. I think avoiding Mike Carey - type games benefits us.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

There was also a play where Babin's entire head was lined up offsides and he ended up sacking Wilson...Big Breno couldn't even get out of his stance by the time Babin was by him.

It seems this exact thing happens multiple times during a game...

I saw Babin (pretty sure it was him) lined up in the neutral zone on at least 3 different occasions with no call. Towards the end of the game I saw us do it a couple times too though. Absolutely HATE that no-call when it's so obviously off sides.

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

Like Larry Foote circa February 2006. Get a sack, was so obviously offsides. Next play the offense throws an Int, QB gets flagged for making a tackle.

Replacement Refs please... at least they make the right judgements and follow the rule books better.

 

[The Radish]

On the Henne near sack play that he basically threw the ball into the ground he was outside the hashmarks about 2'. I watched the replay to be sure.

:les: