Could Aaron Rodgers survive 1 season behind our O-line?

[toffee]

The people being disingenuous, are the ones that are openly ignoring stats and actual production to suggest that Rodgers would somehow outperform Russ on the Seahawks. You’re all pretending Rodgers is this short/intermediate passing QB whose time to throw isn’t literally 2.7 seconds or longer every season.

Also, Russ’ O-line has consistently been worse than Rodgers in pass block win rate. Why would you openly ignore that? Russ’ O-line has only ever finished middle of the pack or worse. And it finished middle of the pack, because the pass protection for the back half of the season was terrible. The O-line was top 5 for the first 6 weeks and during that time, Rodgers couldn’t hold Wilson’s jockstrap.

I feel Russ is limited when it comes to using areas of the field to help vs 2 high and pass rush, and also that Russ inexplicably ignores blitzing corners or safeties off the edge, creating sacks that are attributed to OL but are all Russ.

That said I firmly believe OL should be a much higher priority. Which is why I dislike drafting an okay WR3 rather than a center who, even if he doesn’t play immediately, provides depth, because our OL is often thwarted by injury as much as anything else.

Russ has proven he can be productive with a receiving core of Tate, Baldwin, and jermaine Kearse. He can throw to nobodies, what he doesn’t do well is get the ball out quickly over the short middle.

well the facts show he can do all those things you seem to think he can't do, but that's okay. also he has shown he can get the ball out quickly over the short middle., Just because you dont do it alot does not mean you can't, The system they use does not call for short middle. Remember PC has said he does not like short middle to much possibility of hit, batted balls and there for high risk. Historically speakign in PC as a coached teams they dont use shor tmiddle much that is a system thing not a QB thing.

Show the tape of Wilson not being hesitant vs zone under in the short middle, not some “facts” you cherry pick and massage.

Because I can show you multiple open routes over short middle that Wilson ignored in a single game and sometimes series where you can see Wilson looking at them so the vaunted “but...but...progression” excuse you’re so fond of isn’t available

It was all Pete's fault, Russell of course could handle whatever the defense game planned against him. It's Pete that was too slow to make adjustment at the line of scrimmage.

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[John63]

One thing I noticed is that Rodgers, like Brady, gets shaken up after a few hits. Russ is used to getting hit.

another thing problem is there are several here who would take a high school back up over Wilson just because they dont like Wilson.

 

[John63]

The people being disingenuous, are the ones that are openly ignoring stats and actual production to suggest that Rodgers would somehow outperform Russ on the Seahawks. You’re all pretending Rodgers is this short/intermediate passing QB whose time to throw isn’t literally 2.7 seconds or longer every season.

Also, Russ’ O-line has consistently been worse than Rodgers in pass block win rate. Why would you openly ignore that? Russ’ O-line has only ever finished middle of the pack or worse. And it finished middle of the pack, because the pass protection for the back half of the season was terrible. The O-line was top 5 for the first 6 weeks and during that time, Rodgers couldn’t hold Wilson’s jockstrap.

I feel Russ is limited when it comes to using areas of the field to help vs 2 high and pass rush, and also that Russ inexplicably ignores blitzing corners or safeties off the edge, creating sacks that are attributed to OL but are all Russ.

That said I firmly believe OL should be a much higher priority. Which is why I dislike drafting an okay WR3 rather than a center who, even if he doesn’t play immediately, provides depth, because our OL is often thwarted by injury as much as anything else.

Russ has proven he can be productive with a receiving core of Tate, Baldwin, and jermaine Kearse. He can throw to nobodies, what he doesn’t do well is get the ball out quickly over the short middle.

well the facts show he can do all those things you seem to think he can't do, but that's okay. also he has shown he can get the ball out quickly over the short middle., Just because you dont do it alot does not mean you can't, The system they use does not call for short middle. Remember PC has said he does not like short middle to much possibility of hit, batted balls and there for high risk. Historically speakign in PC as a coached teams they dont use shor tmiddle much that is a system thing not a QB thing.

Show the tape of Wilson not being hesitant vs zone under in the short middle, not some “facts” you cherry pick and massage.

Because I can show you multiple open routes over short middle that Wilson ignored in a single game and sometimes series where you can see Wilson looking at them so the vaunted “but...but...progression” excuse you’re so fond of isn’t available

great you can show a game, now all you need to do is prove he never does it. I am not going to waste my time to prove something you know damn good and well is BS. There have been charts posted here numerous times which clearly show he can, and has done what you want go find them they are in this forum. FYI I can show you videos of him throwing short over the middle too. There is a difference between cant and does not do it a lot.

fyi this might help you some

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/list/type/team/2020/week notice 109 qb rating short over the middle. you change by yer if you want also

 

[chris98251]

The one pass he it in the middle consistently but it was not a go to play was when Baldwin would do the short 8 yard curl or slant route on the left side, usually we had the WR out on the edge to pull the CB deeper and the LB in coverage, rarely a nickel package, it also was a three WR set with a man on the right as well.

So Baldwin against a LB match up. That was the most use of the middle we seemed to use.

 

[IndyHawk]

Erin would do just fine...
He's not going to let 2 high bother him and he is going to throw the quick
slants and outs so the DL is going to back off some which they don't do
with RW.
When RW had speed he could get away with a lot of weak areas of passing
but not much anymore and this is where Erin fills in the gaps.

 

[CPHawk]

Of course he could. He’s spent his entire career crying to the Refs, so he gets every call. If anyone hits him, it’s a flag.

 

[toffee]

Erin would do just fine...
He's not going to let 2 high bother him and he is going to throw the quick
slants and outs so the DL is going to back off some which they don't do
with RW.
When RW had speed he could get away with a lot of weak areas of passing
but not much anymore and this is where Erin fills in the gaps.

Have you run that by Wilson homers?

 

[kf3339]

Erin would do just fine...
He's not going to let 2 high bother him and he is going to throw the quick
slants and outs so the DL is going to back off some which they don't do
with RW.
When RW had speed he could get away with a lot of weak areas of passing
but not much anymore and this is where Erin fills in the gaps.

This is very true about RW to date. I think this season the OC will design those type of plays and we will see if RW can bring a much more faster passing attack where quick throws will be at least an equal part of the plan. That is the only reason why we went WR in the second and brought in nearly the same player in Cody Thompson. At least that is my guess.

 

[John63]

Erin would do just fine...
He's not going to let 2 high bother him and he is going to throw the quick
slants and outs so the DL is going to back off some which they don't do
with RW.
When RW had speed he could get away with a lot of weak areas of passing
but not much anymore and this is where Erin fills in the gaps.

This is very true about RW to date. I think this season the OC will design those type of plays and we will see if RW can bring a much more faster passing attack where quick throws will be at least an equal part of the plan. That is the only reason why we went WR in the second and brought in nearly the same player in Cody Thompson. At least that is my guess.

ah I love when people say things that are false. Wilson has shown he can do just fine against 2 high safeties. the issue is the system and play call. in 2015 they tried the same 2 high safety thing and Wilson roasted them, the thing was they had plays called and designed for it. Scotty did not or was not allowed to. That's said I do agree the new OC should merge a quick passing attack with the shots down the field. What should also help is having a reliable 3rd option as last year it was not just 2 high safeties but the fact they would also double DK and Lockett, and could single cover all the other options as none of them were special.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

I swear, people think this guy walks on water. :?
And yes, I know he's a hell of a QB, but relax...….1-4 in Championship games. ONE super bowl appearance. Flat out trying to ruin the Packers, telling other players to not sign there, calling out the GM, telling everyone he isn't coming back etc. And before I get accused of being a Russ homer, This has NOTHING to do with Russ.
He earned the MVP. And him and his team choked when it mattered, yet again.

But yes, I'm sure he could survive behind this line. That being said, the O Line he has played behind has been damn good for most of his career.

 

[chris98251]

I swear, people think this guy walks on water. :?
And yes, I know he's a hell of a QB, but relax...….1-4 in Championship games. ONE super bowl appearance. Flat out trying to ruin the Packers, telling other players to not sign there, calling out the GM, telling everyone he isn't coming back etc. And before I get accused of being a Russ homer, This has NOTHING to do with Russ.
He earned the MVP. And him and his team choked when it mattered, yet again.

But yes, I'm sure he could survive behind this line. That being said, the O Line he has played behind has been damn good for most of his career.

The thing about Rodgers, he does not like getting hit and loses his composure, a bad line he would self destruct and then turn on team mates. He has done it in Green Bay, also remember the games here when we had a decent D line and the LOB and hit him chased him, and picked him off, he was going ballistic.

 

[Tokadub]

Rodgers is the kind of QB that makes OL's look way better then they are.

I agree with you but I still don't think he could last a whole season behind a Seahawks O line.

All it takes is one freak play and he's out.

 

[Tinamedina]

Quarterbacks make the protection calls and call out protection changes.

So who is better at making and changing protection calls? Arron Rogers or Russell Wilson?

That is not totally true at all. First sometimes the center does, sometime sit is the Qb but here is the thing whoever does it can call out the right protection but the oline still needs to execute, the Te still needs to execute, the Rb still needs to execute.

It's not a democracy out there on the field. The quarterback always has the final say on protection calls. So who is better? Arron Rogers or Russell Wilson?


There is another typically ignored question. Who makes better use of their protection blocking? Arron Rogers or Russell Wilson?

Wilson. And Rodgers does not read defenses as well as Wilson either. Rodgers is a safe thrower. He rarely takes risks. I think it’s curious people attribute words like intelligent to Rodgers but never Wilson.

I think it’s laughable. If Rodgers is so great, why did he struggle with McCarthy and put up pedestrian numbers? Why has he struggled in games where teams like the 49ers got pressure? Seriously, it’s like you guys commit to a belief and refuse to adjust based on the evidence. We have plenty of evidence to show that Rodgers struggles with actual pressure and a struggling O-line, which is rare for him. Rodgers has a better arm, Wilson is better overall and is far more capable of carrying scraps no matter the injuries or talent on the team. The respect for Russ does not match the insane reality of his abilities, so bizarre.

Because Russell Wilson is black and black qb are not as smart as white qbs, most people are too coward to say it out loud so they hide behind words like "mental game" "decisions". We saw it with Justin Fields saying he is not as smart but scored the highest on the aptitude test.



And now wilson, who has always carried himself with the upmost class is some kind of dumb jock? Really? Stop being a coward and say what you really wanna say seahawks fans.

 

[Tinamedina]

And no Rodgers would not last because Rodgers would not be okay with letting pete Carroll have all control, they would clash.



Oh, Rodgers isnt as good as wilson, no more 4th quarter comebacks, 5 and 11.

 

[Fade]

First of all, Rodgers loves to hold the ball as well. He would get sacked 50+ times a year playing in a Peteball scheme, behind Seattle O-Lines. He would get hurt.

Second and more importantly, you would be trading out the clutchest QB for the least clutchest QB. Just have a look at Rodgers career record against a winning team when trailing by 1 point or more in the 4th quarter.

Thirdly, why would you trade a 33 yr old for a 38 yr old?

Rodgers, Mahomes, Josh Allen, Russell Wilson, Deshaun Watson all hold the ball. The diff. Is the other guys played with sophisticated offensive coaches that value the O-Line, not pay their QB then proceed to rank 32nd in O-Line spending with only one 1st round pick spent on the O-Line (Germaine Ifedi) since hitting the lottery in 2012.

Wilson had been stuck with Simple Pete, forcing his archaic scheme on his "yes" men OC.

Waldron will fix this (I think), if not Wilson will be looking to move on.

If Wilson had been playing with GB O-Lines his entire career he'd have a lot more than 1 superbowl that's for sure.

 

[Jville]

Speaking of Green Bay, the gunslinger of Green Bay had his fanatics that insisted he was flawless and laid blame on his team mates for any disappointing outcomes. He was named all pro a number of times saw some pro bowls. He went to two supper bowls and experienced a loss in one and victory in the other. Over the years, he really didn't change that much. He played as a flawed gun slinging quarterback. His plus plays covered his minus plays and then some. In the end, he was traded and finished his career in Minnesota and New York. Later, he was inducted into the hall of fame, flaws and all, after 20 years of playing the game his way.

At this point in his career, I think Russell Wilson has already matured into the quarterback he has become. I don't expect him to evolve much beyond what we have already seen. A new offensive coordinator can contribute by bringing some new wrinkles to build around him. But, Russell Wilson is who he is. And he plays the game his way. Will he play out his career in Seattle and eventually finish it like Brett Favre finished his? Maybe. Finishing his career in another venue is certainly possible. Eventual induction into the hall of fame is certain ...... despite any accompanying human flaws.

I prefer to appreciate Russell Wilson for who he is ...... untarnished by diverting excuses.

 

[chris98251]

Speaking of Green Bay, the gunslinger of Green Bay had his fanatics that insisted he was flawless and laid blame on his team mates for any disappointing outcomes. He was named all pro a number of times saw some pro bowls. He went to two supper bowls and experienced a loss in one and victory in the other. Over the years, he really didn't change that much. He played as a flawed gun slinging quarterback. His plus plays covered his minus plays and then some. In the end, he was traded and finished his career in Minnesota and New York. Later, he was inducted into the hall of fame, flaws and all, after 20 years of playing the game his way.

At this point in his career, I think Russell Wilson has already matured into the quarterback he has become. I don't expect him to evolve much beyond what we have already seen. A new offensive coordinator can contribute by bringing some new wrinkles to build around him. But, Russell Wilson is who he is. And he plays the game his way. Will he play out his career in Seattle and eventually finish it like Brett Favre finished his? Maybe. Finishing his career in another venue is certainly possible. Eventual induction into the hall of fame is certain ...... despite any accompanying human flaws.

I prefer to appreciate Russell Wilson for who he is ...... untarnished by diverting excuses.

System is everything, Jim Plunkett a great example, Fran Tarkington was not as good in New York as he was as a Viking in my opinion, Wilson could explode with the leash off and not having to worry about an occasional turnover and a Coach willing go for the throat from the first quarter.