Hawks Planning to Interview Thomas Brown (Bears Interim Coach) for OC

Fresno Hawk

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The Rooney rule was implemented because your last sentence wasn't taking place. And, as is evident by some of the replies, it's not hard to see why.

Oh, believe me, I know.
It seems to me that you're taking what I wrote as a personal attack. Or steering what I said in another direction other than football.
 

getnasty

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It does, but that does mean that our interview of this particular guy was purely to satisfy the Roomey Rule
Maybe, maybe not. We would know if the reason didn't exist though.
 

12AngryHawks

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I think the Rooney rule has its flaws, but I don't think, in this particular case, they're interviewing Brown simply to fill a quota. There must be something they like about him specifically. They could've interviewed or asked to interview a number of minority coaches that would've made more sense, in terms of philosophy or their relation to MM. Like Tee Martin or Marcus Brady.
 

chrispy

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Rooney Rule promotes "best person for the job" hiring. The statistics bear it out. Minorities were not interviewed for decades because of racial bias and the Rooney Rule is helping to even the opportunities. It doesn't have anything to do with hiring, only interviewing. It doesn't limit the number of candidates interviewed so it disadvantages no one. Anti Rooney Rule is just anti opportunity. Anti Rooney Rule allows a racist owner to DQ any minority hire, and that happened for decades so saying it wouldn't is disingenuous.
 

SoulfishHawk

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Are you seriously wondering why someone would think that when there's a rule that says just that?
I'm saying a guy is qualified, black, white, silver etc. I took that comment as someone assuming that the ONLY reason he was being interviewed was because of the Rooney Rule. Seems ridiculous, to me. He got the interview because he's qualified. I'm glad the rule exists, but it's likely pretty insulting, to the candidate, to hear that someone thinks that it's the ONLY reason he got interviewed.
 
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cymatica

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He got the interview because he's qualified. I'm glad the rule exists, but it's pretty insulting, to ME, to hear that someone thinks that it's the ONLY reason he got interviewed.
How do you know? You are assuming he is qualified just as someone else is assuming he isn't. The fact that there's a rule that forces interviews based on race creates a Schrodinger's cat situation. Only Mike and John know if they really think he's qualified.

It's just like the DEI situation. If you create policies like this that use race or gender as driving factors in the hiring process, don't act surprised and offended when people point to that if things ever go wrong. If reactions like that insult you, then you simply aren't looking at it objectively.
 

SoulfishHawk

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I'm not offended at all. Just voicing an opinion like you are. It's ridiculous to assume a guy is getting an interview JUST because he's black.
 

oldhawkfan

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The psych studies on unconscious racism are kinda scary tbh. There are studies where they send out identical resumes with only changing the name to be a typically white name or black name and the white names get more requests for interviews. There's the old doll study where kids of different races tended to rate white dolls more highly than black dolls (and even the black kids in the study were usually doing this too). Unconscious racism and racial bias are probably definitely things that happen. In the NFL, an equal or less qualified white coach might get the nod over a black coach because he still seems like a better candidate.

I dunno about the Rooney Rule. It's got quotas teams need to meet for minority hires now and meeting quotas comes with all sorts of baggage. Teams are going to hire less qualified people to meet the quotas, and they're also going to hire more qualified people who seemed less qualified because of a racial bias too. If it's more of the former, then you'd want to drop the rule. If it's more of the latter, keep it until you find a better system. The trouble is we have no way of actually knowing what the rule is really achieving.
People are flawed. We all are. Unconcious racism hits the nail on the head. Racism at its core is just a dislike for something different. As a society, we have used the term racism to relate to skin color. But it’s much deeper than that. Any two people are going to find things to dislike about each other. Regardless of race. Race is just an excuse to dislike something or someone I don’t know or understand.

Having said that, the Rooney Rule is a good thing. As I understand it, a team has to interview at least one person of color. I’m not sure about any quotas. What it does do is allow people who might not be considered just because of their name, skin color, ethnicity, whatever a foot in the door.

The disregard that some might have for hiring only whites might be intentional or unintentionally racially biased. I’ve been in personnel and have been responsible for hiring. Whether you know it or not bias does creep in. People hiring might have a type in mind for a job based on their own personal experiences with previous people in the position having an influence on the decision. For example, someone being interviewed might remind the interviewer, even in a slight way of a characteristic that the previous person had in the role. The interviewer could think consciously or even unconsciously that they don’t want them based on one simple thing. It doesn’t mean that person isn’t the best for that job, just that bias creeped in and helped make the decision.

The Rooney Rule at least opens the door for those that might not be considered otherwise. The decision still lies with those doing the interview. Racism is real. Those that have gone before set the table for how they think things should be. Racism isnt conquered over night. It’s going to take awhile for humanity to reach Gene Roddenberrys vision in Star Trek of true equality for all.
 
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chrispy

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How do you know? You are assuming he is qualified just as someone else is assuming he isn't. The fact that there's a rule that forces interviews based on race creates a Schrodinger's cat situation. Only Mike and John know if they really think he's qualified.

It's just like the DEI situation. If you create policies like this that use race or gender as driving factors in the hiring process, don't act surprised and offended when people point to that if things ever go wrong. If reactions like that insult you, then you simply aren't looking at it objectively.
"When things go wrong"... The Rooney Rule has directly resulted in several black head coaches leading teams to the playoffs year after year. A decade ago it never happened. That's going right, not wrong. ...best person for the job, not best white person for the job.

"driving factors in the hiring process"... The Rooney Rule is unique in that it only directs interviewing, not hiring. It's completely different from "DEI situation" with which you lump it. It's opportunity based, not hiring-quota based.

Qualified...Any Head Coach in the NFL is inherently qualified for one of an OC or DC job. It's a step backwards. If it were a position coach, your proposition could be justified. Declaring someone, taking on a smaller role- a role they've directly supervised, as unqualified and only being considered because of their skin color is ridiculous. His resume and experience make him over-qualified. An interview and references is the only way to confirm or negate.
 
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HawkFreak

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I was just trying to let you all know they were thinking about interviewing an additional person for the OC position....
 

WmHBonney

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I don't want anyone that is even remotely responsible for the shit show that is the Bears.
 

cymatica

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"When things go wrong"... The Rooney Rule has directly resulted in several black head coaches leading teams to the playoffs year after year. A decade ago it never happened. That's going right, not wrong. ...best person for the job, not best white person for the job.

Just stop. You are assuming racism when you have no clue, then using correlation as proof without even considering other circumstances.

Do you know why there happens to be a larger pool of white coaches? Could it be that there are a disproportionately large number of black athletes that make the teams because they are genetically more gifted forcing more white players at a younger age into other roles? Nah, it must be racism and nothing else.
 
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