Getting harder to argue against.

[CalgaryFan05]

Seahawks' John Schneider's personnel decisions should put his job in jeopardy

The Seattle Seahawks have changed head coaches but the results are the same. Is general manager John Schneider to blame?

12thmanrising.com

Just sayin.

 

[JPatera76]

Just saying what? Please do add some context or some of your opinion. Passing along a fan done article is hardly anything different then what everyone here is crying about or has be stated repeatedly.

 

[pittpnthrs]

I agree with everything said in that article.

 

[CalgaryFan05]

Just saying what? Please do add some context or some of your opinion. Passing along a fan done article is hardly anything different then what everyone here is crying about or has be stated repeatedly.

Specifically; there seems to be 2 developing opinions;

"It's all JS/MM fault - so burn it all down. "

Or, - "Hey, it's still year 1 for MM under JS and with Grubb under him - let's all simmer down and give the process 2 or 3 years to develop".

It's getting harder to argue for option number 2 week by week. That was actually the title of the post.

Wasn't specifically trying to piss in your cornflakes.

It's also getting easier to see who the problem might have been in the JS/PC relationship - just like the 'who was more responsible for the Patriots success - Brady or BB'. One left and didn't suck. One stayed and started sucking. Same drill here.

Unless MM can successfully motivate the players, and magically fix/coach the co-ordinators - and the first point is a big question mark for me at this point. And, to me, whether MM fails or succeeds is a huge indicator and indictment of JS - both on the hiring and roster fronts.

As a final point - I never saw MM as a 'savior' although I certainly hoped for success - but I have to say Pete's warts are looking alot less 'warty'.

And none of this gives me any joy to say.

Just sayin. You can switch your cereal bowl now

 

[JPatera76]

All valid (and the article isn’t wrong), I just wanted to read your take on it and see your opinion. Thank you

 

[TheLegendOfBoom]

Although MM has only been through 9 games in his current tenure, JS, has been GM since 2010 and since 2010, JS, has not proven himself as being capable of building a good offensive line.

While, the sample size with MM is limited, the results for cohesion and a quality offensive line has been consistently awful.

As far as I’m concerned, JS, deserves his share of the blame and fans have a right to vouch their displeasure and frustrations.

Calling for JS to do better is justified, it is warranted.

Shape up or ship out! It’s been 14 years of JS drafts and trades!

No excuses!

MM can stay though!

 

[jammerhawk]

I agree with everything said in that article.

You would, but then again you have a clear position that absolutely nothing JS has done is right and he should have been canned when Pete was moved out.

We are half way through a season with a lot of very young or first time coaches. It is clear the OLine has been a disaster yet the real issues are defensive and that is inconsistent with the apparent talent here. I think your bias, long held, is showing through.

 

[pittpnthrs]

You would, but then again you have a clear position that absolutely nothing JS has done is right and he should have been canned when Pete was moved out.

We are half way through a season with a lot of very young or first time coaches. It is clear the OLine has been a disaster yet the real issues are defensive and that is inconsistent with the apparent talent here. I think your bias, long held, is showing through.

Yeah, I guess I am biased. I'm biased against a GM that doesn't prioritize the Oline or can't evaluate talent when it comes to it. He should have went with Pete. A fresh start should have been a fresh start.

The defense is already better than last year and will continue to get better. The Oline? Not so much.

 

[jammerhawk]

I don't know how it can be fairly argued that the OLine hasn't been prioritized the sheer number of roster moves to they to bolster the OLine argues strongly against that position.

However it is fair to question that JS or the team collectively has difficulty evaluating OLine talent or those chosen underperform their abilities previous shown or anticipated. Do think that the team will reasonably assess JS when it is finally sold as we can expect over the next few seasons. If the OLine is not improved relative to now JS may well be looking at finding a new job as this critical area is a continuing area of weakness. Frankly the team has been screwed on the Line with injuries and that is not on JS directly but the effective depth is simply missing or not ready yet. BTW I agree the Line is not better than it was last year and last year it was pretty awful. Reality though is there are many teams around the league that are finding difficulty find good OLine players. It is true the DLine looks better and the D is better than last year but still has vulnerabilities.

Meanwhile I believe blowing the whole thing up and hiring a completely new FO staff from top to bottom is short sighted as the continuity of the team leadership would be lost. There should be no doubt that JS's seat is less comfortable than it has been before as with overall control there is responsibility. I still think there are signs however that the whole team is now headed in a new and positive direction. Some patience is needed for the coaching staff as it is hard to be new coaches in the NFL and a period of reasonable adjustment is to expected before they can fairly assessed. JS's position with this has become less secure if the direction doesn't change. It is clear without a doubt that the OLine needs improvement.

 

[Shane Falco]

This off-season, they drafted a 3rd rnd guard, payed (if you can call it that ) an old vet who's best days are behind him. And the same for an aging swing tackle. Relying on late rnd picks that they drafted the previous year that had shown nothing to indicate readiness/capability. And all that while losing the previous years' starting LG and C. Not to mention the up in the air status of Lucas. That's not prioritizing the oline.

 

[Seahawk_Dan]

Investing in the Oline is not the same as prioritizing it, if that makes sense.

 

[Shane Falco]

Investing in the Oline is not the same as prioritizing it, if that makes sense.

I'd argue they haven't done either. Cross has been the big investment. Outside of that, business as usual.

I don't think they have drafted offensive linemen any differently than other good franchises. The big difference is the lack of money investment they put into the line. So that's where they don't invest/prioritize in the line. I think that's safe to say.

 

[seabowl]

Abe Lucas going down was a tremendous blow to this line. During his rookie year, we were seeing good improvement on the line with he and Cross. Not making an excuse, but it is what happened.

 

[HawkFreak]

Abe Lucas going down was a tremendous blow to this line. During his rookie year, we were seeing good improvement on the line with he and Cross. Not making an excuse, but it is what happened.

I agree. I mean - doesn't that draft with Lucas and Cross show a some amount (vs. none/zero being communicated here) of willingness to prioritize and invest (draft capital) in the O-line?

It looked like a great move at the time and a huge step in improving the line. If we look back at the posts/temp in here during that time - I believe the early returns had people talking about the line being set at those positions for years. It's a shame injuries derailed that.

 

[Shane Falco]

I agree. I mean - doesn't that draft with Lucas and Cross show a some amount (vs. none/zero being communicated here) of willingness to prioritize and invest (draft capital) in the O-line?

It looked like a great move at the time and a huge step in improving the line. If we look back at the posts/temp in here during that time - I believe the early returns had people talking about the line being set at those positions for years. It's a shame injuries derailed that.

They DO invest draft capital into the offensive line. That's not the problem. It's paying anybody for either continuity or upgrades. That's where they differ. And I think as some have said, they don't seem to hit on picks as much as other teams in that department. Whether that's scouting or luck who knows.

But if you can't put a quality oline out there with the draft alone, then you just don't say, "oh well, we tried.". You do what it takes using all avenues.

 

[Seahawk_Dan]

They DO invest draft capital into the offensive line. That's not the problem. It's paying anybody for either continuity or upgrades.

This.

Seattle hasn't had a consistent line in years. It seems like the mentality is to treat it like college, where you cycle line men every 2-4 years and hope that your coaching just makes up the difference.

 

[HawkFreak]

I know people have commented that they can't evaluate O-line talent. But do people feel they have evaluated well and and made much more successful trades at other positions?

 

[ronnieboycefanclub]

I thought that the selection of Players is down to the coaching staff. All JS does is arrange the contracts and personal terms.

In other words, the players are handed to him to make the best of.

 

[Seahawk_Dan]

I know people have commented that they can't evaluate O-line talent. But do people feel they have evaluated well and and made much more successful trades at other positions?

I wouldn't.

Well, I guess its split. The franchise has made some good trades. Lynch, Diggs, Duane Brown, Chris Clemons - These were all trades that greatly benefited the team. You have some more that were kinda just there, like didn't amount to anything or hurt the team per say, but the problem has been trades for rental players for a year, or the huge trades that put the franchise into a deficit.

Percy Harvin
Jamal Adams
Jimmy Graham
Sheldon Richardson
Clowney
EJ4 (just happened, but he is a rental unless they decide to re-sign him)
Leonard Williams (TBD, hasn't been stellar this year but the team was damned if they do or don't with this one)

Just to name a few that have had little impact or way too much invested for little to no outcome.

 

[James in PA]

Selecting Abe & Chuck did show commitment, but what about the interior? Just an awful plan with those 3 positions coming into the season.