Geno's Decision to Slide

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RiverDog

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Genuinely curious, what personality traits of Geno are you not fond of? Has this affected your analysis of him in the past? I’m also wondering if there’s something about Geno that has rubbed others the wrong way and influenced their opinions as well.

Back on topic, yes, it was a rather glaring mistake to not dive for the first, but I’m confident he’s the type of athlete that will have learned and won’t do it again in a similar situation.

Personally, I’ve found Geno’s story a fascinating study in perseverance and grit. His tenacity to not give up his dream of once again starting in this league and be given an opportunity to demonstrate his vast improvement since his early years has been very admirable. By all accounts, his teammates love him and have their full trust in him—and I think that speaks volumes.
His behavior in his DUI arrest a few years ago is one big factor. He's also blamed his failure to get a second chance on his skin color, essentially calling his previous coaches racist, ignoring the fact that up until he happened to be in the right place at the right time with us, that he'd thrown as many INT's as TD passes. I honestly don't think it's affected my judgment of him simply because I'm very aware of it. A lot of people won't admit to a personal bias as I have.

I hold personal biases against other players, too, including Russell Wilson and Aaron Rodgers.

This isn't the place to be discussing this topic and will be my only mention of it in this thread.
 
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RiverDog

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Russell's slow fat ass ain't making it there. Sorry.
That's not the point. The point that is being made is that Russell would likely have known that he needed to dive for the first down when he got that close to the line to gain and wouldn't have pulled up and done a hook slide. And Russell isn't the only quarterback. IMO most NFL-quality QB's, RB's, and WR's would know within a yard or two where the line to gain is and if they've passed it.
 

getnasty

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I just think he thought he had the yardage. Obviously a bad decision that I'm sure he'd like to have back.

I also think it's fairly common when your in the middle of the field with defenders coming from both sides. Not like your running toward the sideline where you can see the sticks and know a defensive player is only hitting you from one side.
 

Maelstrom787

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That's not the point. The point that is being made is that Russell would likely have known that he needed to dive for the first down when he got that close to the line to gain and wouldn't have pulled up and done a hook slide. And Russell isn't the only quarterback. IMO most NFL-quality QB's, RB's, and WR's would know within a yard or two where the line to gain is and if they've passed it.
It's literally the only point being made in the post I replied to, actually.

I'm staying out of the Geno discussion on this thread for now as people would accuse me of being a fluffer for my actual opinion on the matter, and I don't feel like engaging with that when the fanbase is all pissed off.
 

SoulfishHawk

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Yeah that's true
And that's the point. Geno is in his prime. Even this biggest Geno floats in midair folks should expect more from their QB.
Nobody is saying Russ NOW. Daniel Jones sure was fighting for extra yards.
And again, he's not even CLOSE to the reason they lost that game.
 

Maelstrom787

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And that's the point. Geno is in his prime. Even this biggest Geno floats in midair folks should expect more from their QB.
Nobody is saying Russ NOW. Daniel Jones sure was fighting for extra yards.
And again, he's not even CLOSE to the reason they lost that game.
Well, again, the comment I was replying to DID say present-day Russ. I was replying specifically to that message, not addressing the crowd on a soapbox or anything.
 

Maelstrom787

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I think it's pretty undeniable that Geno made a subpar decision here.

With that being said, I don't think it's an especially uncommon or indefensible error to make.

Quarterbacks are taught to err heavily on the side of sliding when they're about to get lit up by a defender. Geno was squared up with said defender.

Knowing what we know now, yes, putting his shoulder down or diving is the right choice.

But both are generally discouraged. First reason is increased turnover risk. Getting teed off on invites big fumble risk. Diving even more so, as diving QBs are not protected.

Second reason is injury risk. It's no secret that quarterbacks are taught sliding to avoid injury, as QBs are the most important players on the team. Ask Holmgren and his slip-n-slides about how he felt about "Matthew" not sliding, yknow?

So, yes, subpar decision. But a lot of people here are acting like a QB has never slid early, or that there's no thought process that could cause a slightly early slide. That's just not true.

Also - small addition here, Geno was squared up with a defender and slid. Also had a chance to draw a 15 yard penalty if he baited that defender into hitting him. Probably not a part of the thought process on that specific play, but part of the reason coaches hate their QBs diving and love them sliding.
 

Ozzy

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I have played and coached football at various levels. Is that supposed to validate or invalidate my opinion? Brock is entitled to his opinion. I doubt Grubb feels that way, and I doubt many 'football minds' would judge a quarterback harshly for coming short in that situation.

Bias? In your post, you compared a quarterback coming up inches short on third-and-long to a fricken turnover. This is peak hindsight bias. If Seattle converts that 4th downplay, is anyone criticizing Geno setting up fourth and short? No. The whole reason this is even a debate is because Geno made a great play.

The rest of your post is childish. Make an argument. Don't gaslight me to validate your opinion.
You continue to insult anyone who disagrees and then get upset when people react to you, the very definition of gaslighting. You did it to multiple people.

You’re the only person claiming being critical of this play is ridiculous to an absurd level, you have a history of trying to convince everyone he’s an elite QB and I genuinely think your bias is clouding your judgement here, that’s not an insult it’s just flat out true. Macdonald didn’t even disagree when the question was mentioned to him. Is he petty and childish too?

You accused me of a bias when multiple times I’ve said Geno was the main reason we were in that game. I can also acknowledge he had a mental miscue on that play. So what bias do I have? You’re now just throwing out insults because no one agrees it seems. This seems to happen with you in EVERY Geno thread
 

Maelstrom787

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If Geno lowered his shoulder and got lit up but got the first, Mike would've said "Hey good job man, don't do that again"
 

Ozzy

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If Geno lowered his shoulder and got lit up but got the first, Mike would've said "Hey good job man, don't do that again"
I don’t know man, it’s a crucial play and you take hits at times. I think Mike knows it’s part of football. It just really feels like we’re going to crazy lengths to excuse it away. It was an obvious mistake and again that’s ok. Without Geno we lose by 21 yesterday. he just made a mistake there and Macdonald, Huard, Wyman etc. I’ve heard talk about it all agree.
The way he was running a dive gets it and he doesn’t get blasted.
 

SoulfishHawk

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It's football. Sometimes you gotta' put that shoulder down and get those tough yards. Again, why was Jones doing it all day? QB's are gonna' take hits. They're gonna' have to man up and take hits from time to time.
I suspect next time; Geno gets that 1st down. He's very good at learning from mistakes. If he was on this thread, he would tell us he has to get that first down, imo. It's not Geno bashing, we're just talking about one particular play. He's been pretty damn good this season.
I got called a Troll for having an opinion. Fair enough..........meh.
 
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RiverDog

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I just think he thought he had the yardage. Obviously a bad decision that I'm sure he'd like to have back.

I also think it's fairly common when your in the middle of the field with defenders coming from both sides. Not like your running toward the sideline where you can see the sticks and know a defensive player is only hitting you from one side.
Maybe. My best guess is that he lost track of the game situation, didn't realize that it was 3rd down, perhaps because he assumed that we'd go for it on 4th down if it were close. That's an explanation, not an excuse.

But I disagree that it's quite common for players not to know where they're at on the field no matter what the defense is doing. It's as rare as a punter or quarterback not realizing where the back-end zone line is at, a situation we've seen once or twice. It's something that should register in your memory.
 
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West TX Hawk

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There’s a time and a place for the QB to take a hit. A crucial point in the game here was that time. Diving down low may have been his best option to get the first and avoid the most contact. Geno will likely look at the film, realize his error and not repeat it.

But QBs obviously have to be smart about this. They can’t do it all game every week. You look at Anthony Richardson as a guy who has been fearless but reckless and hasn’t learned. And for the record, Elway didn’t go helicopter every week either.
 

SoulfishHawk

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I have played and coached football at various levels. Is that supposed to validate or invalidate my opinion? Brock is entitled to his opinion. I doubt Grubb feels that way, and I doubt many 'football minds' would judge a quarterback harshly for coming short in that situation.

Bias? In your post, you compared a quarterback coming up inches short on third-and-long to a fricken turnover. This is peak hindsight bias. If Seattle converts that 4th downplay, is anyone criticizing Geno setting up fourth and short? No. The whole reason this is even a debate is because Geno made a great play.

The rest of your post is childish. Make an argument. Don't gaslight me to validate your opinion.
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I remember that play pretty well and I hit the rewind button a few times. Those defenders were coming in pretty hot, I don't think he could have made it.
 

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