Kaepernick & Lockette

Comeinpeace

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RolandDeschain":2iw30ka7 said:
OkieHawk":2iw30ka7 said:
How did nobody else pick up on this!? Roland has a crush on Kraperdink. Sorry man, but you put that out there. At least this isn't the shack :th2thumbs:
Tongue in cheek, bro. :)

5_Golden_Rings":2iw30ka7 said:
What if Kaepernick is also in the film room as much or more than anyone else on the team as well? That is, what if you didn't have to choose between a work out warrior and a film warrior because the player is both?
Ok, please show me some articles with 49ers players quotes referencing ridiculous work ethic habits. You know, stuff like these about Wilson, except for Kaepernick:
http://www.seahawks.com/news/articles/a ... 8dd24c3e23
http://seattle.sbnation.com/2012/9/2/32 ... work-ethic
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-o ... ell-wilson

Wilson was texting Percy Harvin before the trade was even finalized, making plans to practice in SoCal, and stuff. Just read those articles, then find some ones like that about Kaepernick, please. If he really does have an equal work ethic to Russell Wilson, I want to know about it.

http://blog.49ers.com/2013/07/03/mt-gor ... ck-praise/
Frank Gore - “One thing I love about that young guy, he works. He works very hard. Even before he got the starting job he used to be the first one there and one of the last guys out. As long as he keeps learning, working from the coaches and just being him, he’ll be fine.”

http://www.ninersnation.com/2013/1/14/3 ... kaepernick
Patrick Willis - "I'm the type of man I don't like to be outworked, but honestly I get there to the facility and he's outside already warming up."

From the two main faces of the 49ers

http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2013/05/27 ... es-injury/
Only two weeks after the Super Bowl, Kaep, Lockette, and Jenkins were in Atlanta for two months training and studying.

:roll:
 

RolandDeschain

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Did you even actually read those fully, Comeinpeace? In the Niners Nation one, Willis is specifically talking about him WORKING OUT a lot. Zero in there about anything not related to the physical; all his discussion in there is about how fast Kaepernick is. Well, if we rated QBs on how fast they could run, that might matter. In the sfgate.com one, yes, they played Entourage and lived together; QB plus two receivers. Where's Kaepernick paying to fly a DOZEN teammates to SoCal (or wherever) for off-season workouts like Russell Wilson did? Here, check this pic Tweeted by Sidney Rice: https://twitter.com/sidneyrice/status/3 ... 5208383488

Are you trying to say there isn't a big difference between that and "sure bro come room with me and we'll study"? Not that that isn't a good thing, it is; but there are considerable differences. Not to mention, if Kaepernick's such a "savant" and insanely hard worker, how come he never earned the starting gig over "All Pro" (GALLONS of sarcasm there) Alex Smith? The fact that Harbaugh used Smith's injury as an excuse to make Kaepernick the new long-term starter proves that Harbaugh was just waiting for a reason, and clearly, Kaepernick never provided that reason of his own.

Try harder, dude.
 

757Niner

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RolandDeschain":1wwpyqez said:
Did you even actually read those fully, Comeinpeace? In the Niners Nation one, Willis is specifically talking about him WORKING OUT a lot. Zero in there about anything not related to the physical; all his discussion in there is about how fast Kaepernick is. Well, if we rated QBs on how fast they could run, that might matter. In the sfgate.com one, yes, they played Entourage and lived together; QB plus two receivers. Where's Kaepernick paying to fly a DOZEN teammates to SoCal (or wherever) for off-season workouts like Russell Wilson did? Here, check this pic Tweeted by Sidney Rice: https://twitter.com/sidneyrice/status/3 ... 5208383488

Are you trying to say there isn't a big difference between that and "sure bro come room with me and we'll study"? Not that that isn't a good thing, it is; but there are considerable differences. Not to mention, if Kaepernick's such a "savant" and insanely hard worker, how come he never earned the starting gig over "All Pro" (GALLONS of sarcasm there) Alex Smith? The fact that Harbaugh used Smith's injury as an excuse to make Kaepernick the new long-term starter proves that Harbaugh was just waiting for a reason, and clearly, Kaepernick never provided that reason of his own.

Try harder, dude.

I think your trying too hard, dude....and the hate is obvious. I understand you think Russell Wilson is all-world and is the next coming of Jesus himself, but this shtick of yours that no one outworks him and he's the Film Room QB Of The Year takes the cake. Can it be possible that both QBs are great and have strong work ethics and spend countless hours trying to be the best at their respective position? Does it hurt your Hawk pride that much to give them both their just due? Being a fan is one thing but I would hope being divison rivals wouldn't cloud one's judgement when critiquing opposing players. But whatever helps you sleep better at night. If it makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside to think CK is a mental midget and is more concerned with his biceps than his mental prep, go right ahead. But when you say things like things he obviously isn't any good because he couldn't beat out Alex Smith as a rookie, well that just proves your football brain isnt as big as you think it is. Its very simple really....

CK was a raw rookie who needed some tutelage and some fundamental work before being ready to lead a team as a starting QB at the professional level. Its one of the reasons he wasn't a first round pick. He had a funky throwing motion and ran a 'gimmick' offense in college that scouts and critics both shunned during the draft process. The same offense your beloved Seahawks and a handful of other teams now incoperate heavily into their gameplans on Sundays. He never took a snap from center in college. He got by on a strong arm and his athletic ability. He was raw as passer. He needed work. Not unusual for a young QB with raw physical tools but lacking polish to sit and learn.

RW ran a pro-style offense his entire college career. He was better prepared to have a bigger impact as rookie than CK. Plus he came to team lacking talent at the position. Say what you will about Alex Smith but he was a couple of botched punts away from leading a underdog offense to a SB. He had proven he could be a capable NFL starter. Matt Flynn...not so much. Different circumstances, different personnel, different teams. I said the day we drafted CK he needed to sit a minimum of 2 years before he would be ready to compete for the starting job. So he actually was ahead of schedule in my eyes, when he was annoited the starter halfway through last season. I also said on this very forum after the 2012 draft that RW was the second best QB behind Luck in the that class and that he was better than Matt Flynn even before he took a single rep as a pro. I love being so right. So I'm not just here in defense of my QB, Im merely staring that talent is talent and I don't discriminate against it, no matter what color the jersey is. They're both dillegent students of the game with titireless work ethic and a drive to be great. That much, should be evident by now, from both fanbases.
 

RolandDeschain

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Question for you. What would you say if Wilson leads Kaepernick by the end of the regular season in TDs, TD-int ratio, completion percentage, and QB rating?
 

Comeinpeace

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The 2nd article you linked said that Wilson shows up at 630 am every morning.

http://www.sacbee.com/2013/07/28/560248 ... fting.html

That one says you can find Kaep's car outside the facility at 5:55 every morning. You asked someone to provide links that proved Kaep had an equal to superior work ethic, and mine proves that his are 35 minutes a day better. As for saying it's all physical, dude we can't possibly know their workout/video schedules. You can't really believe that they spend all their time outside of the film room. Russel's SoCal trip happened in March, Kaep was in ATL with a few WRs 2 weeks after the SB. Does that not show quality work ethic?

As far as what I would say if Wilson leads Kaep in those stats you listed. I would say it would be justified and he earned it, because he is a quality QB with a quality supporting cast around him.

What would you say if I said that Kaepernick didn't have to spend as much time as Russell studying film since he's more intelligent (higher GPA in HS, and a higher Wonderlic score), which enables him to hone his physical skills and build more chemistry with his young receivers. Not saying it's true, but the facts say that it is a possibility. And you are an advocate on facts right? I can provide links of that if needed as well.
 

Tech Worlds

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757Niner":2wh8rxp9 said:
RolandDeschain":2wh8rxp9 said:
Did you even actually read those fully, Comeinpeace? In the Niners Nation one, Willis is specifically talking about him WORKING OUT a lot. Zero in there about anything not related to the physical; all his discussion in there is about how fast Kaepernick is. Well, if we rated QBs on how fast they could run, that might matter. In the sfgate.com one, yes, they played Entourage and lived together; QB plus two receivers. Where's Kaepernick paying to fly a DOZEN teammates to SoCal (or wherever) for off-season workouts like Russell Wilson did? Here, check this pic Tweeted by Sidney Rice: https://twitter.com/sidneyrice/status/3 ... 5208383488

Are you trying to say there isn't a big difference between that and "sure bro come room with me and we'll study"? Not that that isn't a good thing, it is; but there are considerable differences. Not to mention, if Kaepernick's such a "savant" and insanely hard worker, how come he never earned the starting gig over "All Pro" (GALLONS of sarcasm there) Alex Smith? The fact that Harbaugh used Smith's injury as an excuse to make Kaepernick the new long-term starter proves that Harbaugh was just waiting for a reason, and clearly, Kaepernick never provided that reason of his own.

Try harder, dude.

I think your trying too hard, dude....and the hate is obvious. I understand you think Russell Wilson is all-world and is the next coming of Jesus himself, but this shtick of yours that no one outworks him and he's the Film Room QB Of The Year takes the cake. Can it be possible that both QBs are great and have strong work ethics and spend countless hours trying to be the best at their respective position? Does it hurt your Hawk pride that much to give them both their just due? Being a fan is one thing but I would hope being divison rivals wouldn't cloud one's judgement when critiquing opposing players. But whatever helps you sleep better at night. If it makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside to think CK is a mental midget and is more concerned with his biceps than his mental prep, go right ahead. But when you say things like things he obviously isn't any good because he couldn't beat out Alex Smith as a rookie, well that just proves your football brain isnt as big as you think it is. Its very simple really....

CK was a raw rookie who needed some tutelage and some fundamental work before being ready to lead a team as a starting QB at the professional level. Its one of the reasons he wasn't a first round pick. He had a funky throwing motion and ran a 'gimmick' offense in college that scouts and critics both shunned during the draft process. The same offense your beloved Seahawks and a handful of other teams now incoperate heavily into their gameplans on Sundays. He never took a snap from center in college. He got by on a strong arm and his athletic ability. He was raw as passer. He needed work. Not unusual for a young QB with raw physical tools but lacking polish to sit and learn.

RW ran a pro-style offense his entire college career. He was better prepared to have a bigger impact as rookie than CK. Plus he came to team lacking talent at the position. Say what you will about Alex Smith but he was a couple of botched punts away from leading a underdog offense to a SB. He had proven he could be a capable NFL starter. Matt Flynn...not so much. Different circumstances, different personnel, different teams. I said the day we drafted CK he needed to sit a minimum of 2 years before he would be ready to compete for the starting job. So he actually was ahead of schedule in my eyes, when he was annoited the starter halfway through last season. I also said on this very forum after the 2012 draft that RW was the second best QB behind Luck in the that class and that he was better than Matt Flynn even before he took a single rep as a pro. I love being so right. So I'm not just here in defense of my QB, Im merely staring that talent is talent and I don't discriminate against it, no matter what color the jersey is. They're both dillegent students of the game with titireless work ethic and a drive to be great. That much, should be evident by now, from both fanbases.

I hate to say this but that was a hell of a nice post.
 

Scottemojo

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Are two nerds actually arguing about which QB gets to work earlier?
Holy shit, let it go.
 

RolandDeschain

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Tech Worlds":2vvliu3l said:
I hate to say this but that was a hell of a nice post.
Overall, yeah. However, he's critically wrong about it being my shtick. I'm just referring to what other people are saying. National writers and such too, not just teammates and local reporters with a vested interest.

Scottemojo":2vvliu3l said:
Are two nerds actually arguing about which QB gets to work earlier?
Holy shit, let it go.
Since when is work ethic not a valid point of discussion about QBs? Now you're sounding like one of those forum members that tells people what they can and cannot discuss. Take it easy.

Comeinpeace":2vvliu3l said:
The 2nd article you linked said that Wilson shows up at 630 am every morning.

http://www.sacbee.com/2013/07/28/560248 ... fting.html

That one says you can find Kaep's car outside the facility at 5:55 every morning. You asked someone to provide links that proved Kaep had an equal to superior work ethic, and mine proves that his are 35 minutes a day better.
That article was from July 2012, he had just been drafted 3 months before; just sayin'. When they both leave the facility, on average, also makes just as much of a difference, but I can't find any evidence on that for either of them at the moment. Also, another thing; I pointed out that your own 49ers player was referring to Kaepernick always working out. I didn't say it. Stop mischaracterizing what I'm saying. I also have never said Kaepernick has a bad work ethic or anything like that, you're making some leaps of logic based on your negative feelings towards my comments, I think.
 

Scottemojo

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Nah, dude, talk about who showed up for work first to your heart's content. I was just a little embarrassed for Seahawks fans, but if that's your thing, go for broke.

And to your opponent in early morning supremacy, 757, why? Do you think we will all fall down at the temple of Kaep because you convinced all he he actually is awesome and not a douchebag? Do you think we will suddenly fear the Niners more when we discover Kaep is so much more than Wilson. and even taller?

BTW, I suspect he HAS to get to work at about 4 AM, because teaching remedial football to Lockette with colors and rape whistles probably eats up about 6 hours of each morning. After all, they are roomies. And BFF's.
 

RolandDeschain

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I'd say anytime someone spouts off 42-13, that's far more embarrassing representation of Seahawks fans; but that's just my opinion.
 

Comeinpeace

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RolandDeschain":uq3suisp said:
Ok, please show me some articles with 49ers players quotes referencing ridiculous work ethic habits. You know, stuff like these about Wilson, except for Kaepernick:

If he really does have an equal work ethic to Russell Wilson, I want to know about it.

That is what you said. Nothing was mischaracterized. You were insinuating that Kaep didn't have an equal work ethic, otherwise why would you ask for articles and then question if his is equal. You said you wanted to know about it. Also, I have no negative feelings about your posts, they are typically some of the more insightful and thought provoking. I don't let forum posts and banter get to me, s**t I live in Seattle. I deal with you a**holes daily and need thick skin :D

@Scottemojo

Yeah, but what else is there to debate about? Who's gonna get injured next in minicamps? Rolands one of the more entertaining posters here when it comes to debates so I figured I'd join in and provide him with the information he seeked. Btw, great writeup earlier about the "43-14."
 

RolandDeschain

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It sounds like he's got more work ethic than I assumed, (Kaepernick) so I'll give him that; but I'm not convinced it's equal to Wilson's. I don't want to get Scotte upset though, ;) so let's skip over that topic.

I honestly can't wait for this season to start. I may even start making a weekly "Wilson vs. Kaepernick" stats thread, for entertainment's sake. (That might stroke too many 49ers fan egos around here, though; we'll have to see.)
 

Comeinpeace

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Roland, once the season starts, I don't think you'll need to start a weekly thread. I'm sure that the Wilson vs Kaep or Kaep vs Wilson debate will be going on for a looooooong time.
 

kearly

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RolandDeschain":2u2npyhg said:
I'd say anytime someone spouts off 42-13, that's far more embarrassing representation of Seahawks fans; but that's just my opinion.

But it's so much fun. 49ers fans can't really say anything back that doesn't sound dumber, so the smart ones have to resort to pointing out that "42-13" is lame. And of course, they wouldn't complain about it if it didn't bother them. The more they bring it up, the more I know it's working.
 

Giedi

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RolandDeschain":8etdxue3 said:
Question for you. What would you say if Wilson leads Kaepernick by the end of the regular season in TDs, TD-int ratio, completion percentage, and QB rating?
Kaep's projected 16 game stats if you do the math was pretty comparable to Wilsons.

One thing I will add to the discussion that may not have been addressed already on this thread, is simply from here forward, who can coach their respective Qb's better? Darell and Pete with Russel, or Harbaugh and Roman with Kaep? My personal opinion of course is Harbaugh, but it would be interesting to find out what the what the 'Hawk fans say. Not that I don't already know what they *might* say. :mrgreen:
 

Giedi

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kearly":xuiz0wbt said:
RolandDeschain":xuiz0wbt said:
I'd say anytime someone spouts off 42-13, that's far more embarrassing representation of Seahawks fans; but that's just my opinion.

But it's so much fun. 49ers fans can't really say anything back that doesn't sound dumber, so the smart ones have to resort to pointing out that "42-13" is lame. And of course, they wouldn't complain about it if it didn't bother them. The more they bring it up, the more I know it's working.
The reason it's bothersome is that it indicates that Seattle is a really good team. To anybody *not* a fan of Seattle, of course it would bother them. Having said that, the smart 49er fans have their own historical information that would counter that and bother the Seattle fans because these facts also indicate the 49er team is pretty good too. all in all, past history is a wash if you are just focusing on the present, this is a new season and it's looking good for both teams, that's what makes it fun and irritating at the same time.
 

RolandDeschain

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Giedi":dlp296ud said:
RolandDeschain":dlp296ud said:
Question for you. What would you say if Wilson leads Kaepernick by the end of the regular season in TDs, TD-int ratio, completion percentage, and QB rating?
Kaep's projected 16 game stats if you do the math was pretty comparable to Wilsons.

One thing I will add to the discussion that may not have been addressed already on this thread, is simply from here forward, who can coach their respective Qb's better? Darell and Pete with Russel, or Harbaugh and Roman with Kaep? My personal opinion of course is Harbaugh, but it would be interesting to find out what the what the 'Hawk fans say. Not that I don't already know what they *might* say. :mrgreen:
Well, it's only logical that Harbaugh is the winner of that question. He was a QB. Carroll is a DB guy, and it's pretty obvious which team finds and develops DB talent better. ;) We have an embarrassment of riches at that position, and I'm including our backups in that. (We were all surprised at how well Jeremy Lane filled in for Brandon Browner while he was suspended, and the 49ers @ Seahawks game was one of those.)

However, my question was one going forward for the 2013 season. If Wilson beats Kaepernick in those aforementioned categories this year, what would you think/say? It's only at the conclusion of the 2013 regular season that we will mostly know enough about both Wilson and Kaepernick to set realistic expectations for the rest of their careers.
 

Giedi

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RolandDeschain":1zetfuf4 said:
Giedi":1zetfuf4 said:
RolandDeschain":1zetfuf4 said:
Question for you. What would you say if Wilson leads Kaepernick by the end of the regular season in TDs, TD-int ratio, completion percentage, and QB rating?
Kaep's projected 16 game stats if you do the math was pretty comparable to Wilsons.

One thing I will add to the discussion that may not have been addressed already on this thread, is simply from here forward, who can coach their respective Qb's better? Darell and Pete with Russel, or Harbaugh and Roman with Kaep? My personal opinion of course is Harbaugh, but it would be interesting to find out what the what the 'Hawk fans say. Not that I don't already know what they *might* say. :mrgreen:
Well, it's only logical that Harbaugh is the winner of that question. He was a QB. Carroll is a DB guy, and it's pretty obvious which team finds and develops DB talent better. ;) We have an embarrassment of riches at that position, and I'm including our backups in that. (We were all surprised at how well Jeremy Lane filled in for Brandon Browner while he was suspended, and the 49ers @ Seahawks game was one of those.)

However, my question was one going forward for the 2013 season. If Wilson beats Kaepernick in those aforementioned categories this year, what would you think/say? It's only at the conclusion of the 2013 regular season that we will mostly know enough about both Wilson and Kaepernick to set realistic expectations for the rest of their careers.
The more difficult question is if both are pretty even in those stats, then what would be the conclusion? Having said that, the most imporant stat in my opinion is wins and losses and whether or not the 49ers win the superbowl. Having come close to 5 yards of winning it all, this year would be a disappointment. I woudln't mind if russell wins on the QB stat category, so long as the wins are more than seattle's and another Lombardi is in the cabinet.
 

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RolandDeschain":2i9pvjxu said:
However, my question was one going forward for the 2013 season. If Wilson beats Kaepernick in those aforementioned categories this year, what would you think/say? It's only at the conclusion of the 2013 regular season that we will mostly know enough about both Wilson and Kaepernick to set realistic expectations for the rest of their careers.

I don't know anyone who would particularly care; all that matters is playoff success. Manning smoked Brady in every regular season stat for their first 7-ish years. Brady won 3 super bowls in that time. You strike me as the type of person who uses players being voted to the pro bowl as some sort of indication of how good they are. Having awesome regular season numbers is the same vanity crap that Tony Romo apologists cling to every year.

kearly":2i9pvjxu said:
RolandDeschain":2i9pvjxu said:
I'd say anytime someone spouts off 42-13, that's far more embarrassing representation of Seahawks fans; but that's just my opinion.

But it's so much fun. 49ers fans can't really say anything back that doesn't sound dumber, so the smart ones have to resort to pointing out that "42-13" is lame. And of course, they wouldn't complain about it if it didn't bother them. The more they bring it up, the more I know it's working.

It bothers people in the same way that a kid screaming does. So if that's what you're going for, carry on.
 
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