Let's Talk Mariners

CurryStopstheRuns

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SmokinHawk":do20xh1j said:
I would rather Hultzen gets the call. I've never been one to buy into the lefty vs. righty crap. Felix is a righty and he can retire any batter in MLB through his mastery of a half dozen pitches, and ability to throw a few others as well. The need for lefties in the lineup is overstated, at least for starting pitchers. What I like about Hultzen is his ability to throw decent heat, along with an array of strikeout pitches such as his changeup, 2 seamer, and slider. I would like to see he and Walker called up this season as after Felix and Iwakuma, our starting pitching rotation makes me pine for the likes of Jason Vargas.


What?! You say the lefty thing is overrated and then use one of the best pitchers in the game to demonstrate why it is not necessary like somehow Hernandez, Verlander, and the like grow on trees.

Pining for Vargus? I will not miss that guy. He would eat up innings, but was largely helped by Safeco if I remember correctly. He has had two good starts in a row for LAA, but was getting hammered before running into the buzz saw offense of Seattle, and the struggling Orioles.
 

SmokinHawk

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CurryStopstheRuns":1z5qog7i said:
SmokinHawk":1z5qog7i said:
I would rather Hultzen gets the call. I've never been one to buy into the lefty vs. righty crap. Felix is a righty and he can retire any batter in MLB through his mastery of a half dozen pitches, and ability to throw a few others as well. The need for lefties in the lineup is overstated, at least for starting pitchers. What I like about Hultzen is his ability to throw decent heat, along with an array of strikeout pitches such as his changeup, 2 seamer, and slider. I would like to see he and Walker called up this season as after Felix and Iwakuma, our starting pitching rotation makes me pine for the likes of Jason Vargas.


What?! You say the lefty thing is overrated and then use one of the best pitchers in the game to demonstrate why it is not necessary like somehow Hernandez, Verlander, and the like grow on trees.

Pining for Vargus? I will not miss that guy. He would eat up innings, but was largely helped by Safeco if I remember correctly. He has had two good starts in a row for LAA, but was getting hammered before running into the buzz saw offense of Seattle, and the struggling Orioles.

Felix isn't the only dominant RHP in the game. Success as a starter seems to have more to do with how many pitches you can throw well, knowing when to throw them, rather than which hand those pitches are coming from. Lefty vs. righty may become an issue when your relievers start hitting the mound, and they only have one or two pitches at their disposal. Take Carter Capps for example. He's probably our best middle reliever, but he only throws two pitches, so they have to take him out versus left handed bats.

For starting pitchers, it really shouldn't matter whether they are left or right handed. Eventually every starter works through the rotation, and most starters will sit in a game until at least the 5th inning, meaning the quality of their pitches matters more than which hand is hurling those pitches.
 

jkitsune

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SmokinHawk":3vfls4y5 said:
CurryStopstheRuns":3vfls4y5 said:
SmokinHawk":3vfls4y5 said:
I would rather Hultzen gets the call. I've never been one to buy into the lefty vs. righty crap. Felix is a righty and he can retire any batter in MLB through his mastery of a half dozen pitches, and ability to throw a few others as well. The need for lefties in the lineup is overstated, at least for starting pitchers. What I like about Hultzen is his ability to throw decent heat, along with an array of strikeout pitches such as his changeup, 2 seamer, and slider. I would like to see he and Walker called up this season as after Felix and Iwakuma, our starting pitching rotation makes me pine for the likes of Jason Vargas.


What?! You say the lefty thing is overrated and then use one of the best pitchers in the game to demonstrate why it is not necessary like somehow Hernandez, Verlander, and the like grow on trees.

Pining for Vargus? I will not miss that guy. He would eat up innings, but was largely helped by Safeco if I remember correctly. He has had two good starts in a row for LAA, but was getting hammered before running into the buzz saw offense of Seattle, and the struggling Orioles.

Felix isn't the only dominant RHP in the game. Success as a starter seems to have more to do with how many pitches you can throw well, knowing when to throw them, rather than which hand those pitches are coming from. Lefty vs. righty may become an issue when your relievers start hitting the mound, and they only have one or two pitches at their disposal. Take Carter Capps for example. He's probably our best middle reliever, but he only throws two pitches, so they have to take him out versus left handed bats.

For starting pitchers, it really shouldn't matter whether they are left or right handed. Eventually every starter works through the rotation, and most starters will sit in a game until at least the 5th inning, meaning the quality of their pitches matters more than which hand is hurling those pitches.

I think the issue with your argument is that most starting pitchers are not anywhere near the talent level of Felix, Verlander, and any other supremely talented player. For those SPs who are in the middle, handedness vs batters does become a factor. I won't get into quoting numbers, but handedness isn't a myth, and it does apply to starters as well. If a pitcher is good enough, he can certainly transcend that (as in your example of Felix), but most pitchers are still going to have handedness splits in their stats.

That's not to say that you should run out an inferior pitcher based solely on his handedness, but if you have two equally appealing options, and one of them fills a need in your rotation (so that you can work your order around to get him in there vs lineups which feature a ton of lefties, for instance), why not lean towards that one?
 

Storts

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Angels are so bad it's beginning to depress me, another loss today, I really think we are going under .500 this year
 

The Outfield

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3 hits on Sunday
5 hits on Tuesday

Will the M's turn it around today or are we headed toward another offensive slump?
 

therealjohncarlson

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The Outfield":2aompb3b said:
3 hits on Sunday
5 hits on Tuesday

Will the M's turn it around today or are we headed toward another offensive slump?

I think you meant "is there a chance we'll get on a hotstreak?" 5 and 3 hit games are basically our team's average, not a slump.
 

Trenchbroom

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therealjohncarlson":2f800g0t said:
I think you meant "is there a chance we'll get on a hotstreak?" 5 and 3 hit games are basically our team's average, not a slump.

Yes I find my expectations so diminished that when I look at the stat sheet and see 5 hits I think "Hmm, not bad!". :thirishdrinkers:
 

The Outfield

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therealjohncarlson":171anc01 said:
The Outfield":171anc01 said:
3 hits on Sunday
5 hits on Tuesday

Will the M's turn it around today or are we headed toward another offensive slump?

I think you meant "is there a chance we'll get on a hotstreak?" 5 and 3 hit games are basically our team's average, not a slump.

We were on a hot streak prior to the last two games. Hitting about 9-10 hits per game on average for more than a week.
 
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Uncle Si

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The Outfield":2if29opd said:
3 hits on Sunday
5 hits on Tuesday

Will the M's turn it around today or are we headed toward another offensive slump?

3 is all we need when the King is pitching...

(no but seriously, we need to hit better)
 

hawksfansinceday1

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Seems to slowly but surely getting a bit better though it sure would be nice if they'd give Felix some runs on the days he starts. Is a .500 season possible?
 

m0ng0

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I am about as positive a fan as there is and I am just about done with Saunders. Bring back Jamie Moyer !
 
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Uncle Si

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hawksfansinceday1":2v5n150d said:
Seems to slowly but surely getting a bit better though it sure would be nice if they'd give Felix some runs on the days he starts. Is a .500 season possible?

if we move on from Saunders and Harang... yes.
 

jkitsune

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Uncle Si":24o0mn4c said:
hawksfansinceday1":24o0mn4c said:
Seems to slowly but surely getting a bit better though it sure would be nice if they'd give Felix some runs on the days he starts. Is a .500 season possible?

if we move on from Saunders and Harang... yes.

Yeah, I don't get what the insistence is on running Saunders out there anymore. Beavan was better, as long as you understood that all Beavan was ever going to be was an OK 5th pitcher. I know we don't have the arms to replace Saunders and Harang right away, but at least drop one of them.

How long did we sign Iwakuma for? Two years? Wish it had been longer. It blows my mind that Wedge refused to let this guy start OR relieve early last year.
 

m0ng0

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Apparently Saunders is a stud when he pitches at safeco. .090 era or something crazy like that? Maybe rotate Bevan for road games?
 

HawkFan72

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Here's some fun Mariners stats I just looked at.

Justin Smoak has the 3rd highest batting average on the team. At .237.

Saunders leads the team in runs and SB. After coming off the DL.

Morse leads the team in HRs. Even after spending time on the DL. 2nd place on the list? Jason Bay.

Looking good! At least they are better than the Angels.
 

The Outfield

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HawkFan72":jepcxlem said:
Here's some fun Mariners stats I just looked at.

Justin Smoak has the 3rd highest batting average on the team. At .237.

Saunders leads the team in runs and SB. After coming off the DL.

Morse leads the team in HRs. Even after spending time on the DL. 2nd place on the list? Jason Bay.

Looking good! At least they are better than the Angels.

Where do you get 3rd?
Chavez: .288
Saunders: .286
Seager: .283
Shoppach: .264
Morales: .262
Gutierrez: .259
Bay: .253
Smoak: .237

8th.

If you're talking about players with a comparable # of at-bats, then yes. But I wouldn't discount the other guys based on just that.

And yes, Morse is tied for 8th in home runs after missing time on the DL and slumping because of the injury. Pretty impressive.
 
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Uncle Si

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The Outfield":20zjdnm2 said:
HawkFan72":20zjdnm2 said:
Here's some fun Mariners stats I just looked at.

Justin Smoak has the 3rd highest batting average on the team. At .237.

Saunders leads the team in runs and SB. After coming off the DL.

Morse leads the team in HRs. Even after spending time on the DL. 2nd place on the list? Jason Bay.

Looking good! At least they are better than the Angels.

Where do you get 3rd?
Chavez: .288
Saunders: .286
Seager: .283
Shoppach: .264
Morales: .262
Gutierrez: .259
Bay: .253
Smoak: .237

8th.

If you're talking about players with a comparable # of at-bats, then yes. But I wouldn't discount the other guys based on just that.

And yes, Morse is tied for 8th in home runs after missing time on the DL and slumping because of the injury. Pretty impressive.

as is 18-19, taking 2 of 3 from a division opponent, splitting with a very good Pirates team. the averages are starting to rise a bit, and the subtle increase in batting has led to more wins.

Still a fine balance with strong pitching, and if one falters then the team may slump again. But lets enjoy this little surge in wins.
 
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