49ers OC claims he didn't use real offense during 42-13 loss

hawker84":vhr5p7hi said:

Marvin i actually read through this entire thread, and i'll commmend you , you held your own, congrats...

my problem with this argument that they scaled back the offense is why?

seems to me, any playoff team could go back to whatever week Kap took over and start looking at game film from those games.... unless of course they scaled back the offense starting in week 10 and did so all the way through the rest of the season... so i'm not sure what this actually accomplished... everything your team did on offense in the playoffs was on film from week 10 on... am i wrong here..

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Thanks,

Obviously, but they did roll out a number of things they'd never done. Also, DCs can't prepare for every single thing an NFL team ever did all season. They can only look at tendencies. There just isn't enough time. As a coordinator himself, Roman probably knew just how far back a coordinator could reasonably go.

I think this is specifically the case with Seattle because there was a good likelyhood that the 49ers and 'hawks could have played each other in the playoffs...the Niners weren't going to roll out their entire bag of tricks.

To be clear, it's possible the Seahawks did the same thing...they just haven't said so publically.

As I've said all along...it may not have changed the outcome of the game. It wasn't that the 49ers weren't trying to win. The OC was just careful about what packages he installed and what plays were run.

Teqneek":2fch1cyg said:

Marvin49":2fch1cyg said:

CamanoIslandJQ":2fch1cyg said:

RW had the playbook significantly limited until the second half of the season. From that point on it became evident that the Seahawks had found their FIRST ever franchise QB (the 49-er's have had several back in the day). That is what makes this fan very jacked up for the coming seasons. Look at RW's stats from the first half vs the second half to see why. I liked Kaepernick when he was available in the draft, but our guys thankfully went in a different direction. I will say that Kaepernick has a pretty good chance to be a *very good* QB, but the Seahawks have a QB that has a chance to be a *great* QB as he continues to improve and excell at the position. That's what has all of us Seahawks fans really, really excited.

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See this stuff just amazes me.

Wilson can be great but Kaep only "very good"? Based on what? Kaep took his team to the Super Bowl in his 10th freakin start. Is Wilson the only one who can improve. It seems like this conversation is always that somehow Wilson will continue to improve till he is the second coming of Jesus Christ (unless he is already that) and that Kaep is a pretender who will obviously decline (jeez, who doesn't know that?).

I think both guys have the potential to be the among the best in the NFL. I understand liking the QB who's on your team, but dude....Kaep has a chance to be INCREDIBLE.

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Because Wilson was a Rookie? Didnt have a year and almost a half to learn his teams playbook, players and work with them before hand consistently in camp and practice.

THIS is what amazes me.. people act as if a QB gains nothing from being on the team already for a year and a half. Im not sure how Kaepernick took SF to the superbowl... Did you miss Alex Smiths numbers before he got knocked out? Its a system, the system prevailed, doesnt mean Kaepernick with a headstart on Wilson is a world beater.

Kaepernick will be incredible when he stops running straight line or always bootlegging left to take off... and stops staring down his receivers.

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Well for a guy who stares down his receivers and can only run in a straight line (2 criticisms I only read on this site...I wonder why that is), he played pretty damn well in the playoffs. If that is really all you see it can only be for 3 reasons.... 1) You don't know what your looking at (which I'm hoping isn't the case), 2) You haven't actually seen that much of him (more likely), 3) You simply don't WANT to see what Niner fans see (most likely).

All of this crap I read about Kaep and his 1 read thing is all wishful thinking. The straight line thing is nothing more than trying to draw a line in the sand between Wilson and Kaep.....Wilson DOES have better lateral mobility. Granted....but Kaep is 6'5", 240 pounds and has a HUGE arm. Pick which one you like better....I'm sure you'll pick the lateral movement.

As for having a year to learn...I'll give you some of that...but remember he has had only 1 real offseason. The lockout was on last year. Also, regardless of how much time you spend watching, NOTHING can prepare you for the games. This also doesn't say ANYTHING about why Wilson can improve but you guys seem to think Kaep can't. I could even spin this to say Wilson had an ADVANTAGE because he came into the NFL FAR less raw than Kaep did. Its all perspective. Both of those guys have a world of potential. Stop acting like one has so much more potential than the other. Its false.

Its the system? Give me a break. Of COURSE the system helps. It helps ALL QBs. Do you really think that Wilson would be the exact same guy if they didn't run play action to Lynch? Do you really think that the system has nothing to do with Wilsons success?

Harbaugh has been a QB guru everywhere he's ever been (Josh Johnson at USD, Luck at Stanford, Smith and Kaep in SF). He is a master at grooming QBs. Is it your contention that Wilson is in a bad system and Harbaugh is a genius and that he has created a far superior system? I can't possibly imagine any Seattle fan making that argument...in particular when it gives Harbaugh credit for ANYTHING.

lol. You can thank your own fans for enlightening us on Kaepernicks stare downs.

http://www.ninersnation.com/2013/1/31/3939606/super-bowl-2013-ron-jaworski-colin-kaepernick

If I did have to point to an area where Kap could improve, it would be the fact that he stares down receivers a little too frequently at times. He's got the arm to fire the ball past defenders anyway, but the stare-down is something he will need to work on. Hopefully he is able to avoid that this Sunday against a smart, veteran Ravens defense.

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http://www.modestopress.com/turlock...-qb-battle-for-49ers-over-scott-tolzien/2687/

Kaepernick lacks patience in the pocket. He is too antsy and takes off when there is an opening. He has the mentality of a run-first quarterback rather than the pass-first one that win playoff games. He has a big arm but stares down his receivers too much. Kaepernick seems to not be going through his full progressions/read properly in order to make the right play.

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http://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/2011/08/inside-the-49ers/kaepernick-the-good-and-the-not-so-good/

The two interceptions. Unlike Alex Smith, who doesn’t do enough when he’s playing poorly, Kaepernick was trying to do too much. He kept trying to force the ball to rookie receiver Ronald Johnson, who just wasn’t open. When he threw the picks, he stared his receiver down. If he wants a shot to play quarterback in the 2011 regular season, he’s going to have to clean this up, because Alex Smith has for the most part.

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As far as one reading, over 10 starts he targeted Crabtree almost as much as he targeted the next 3 receivers, combined. Why do you think the Ravens fouled the hell out of Crabtree on the goal line? No secret that blitzing Kaep would make him force the ball to Crabs.

See this stuff just amazes me.

Marvin49:

Wilson can be great but Kaep only "very good"? Based on what? Kaep took his team to the Super Bowl in his 10th freakin start. Is Wilson the only one who can improve. It seems like this conversation is always that somehow Wilson will continue to improve till he is the second coming of Jesus Christ (unless he is already that) and that Kaep is a pretender who will obviously decline (jeez, who doesn't know that?).

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I think both guys have the potential to be the among the best in the NFL. I understand liking the QB who's on your team, but dude....Kaep has a chance to be INCREDIBLE.

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this is the very point I try to make over on your board... and i get the exact same responses you got here... goes with the territory my man.. But please don't lump all Seahawk fans together...

i for one don't see any reason Kap won't improve next season, nor do i see any reason he won't be a top 10/5 QB in the league in the next couple years... Only time will tell on these two.. the only difference i see in the two at this point is Kap has pure talent and the attributes to succeed, where Wilson has these as well but also has the "IT" factor.... you can just sense greatness with him..

hawker84":2par1hco said:

See this stuff just amazes me.

Marvin49:

Wilson can be great but Kaep only "very good"? Based on what? Kaep took his team to the Super Bowl in his 10th freakin start. Is Wilson the only one who can improve. It seems like this conversation is always that somehow Wilson will continue to improve till he is the second coming of Jesus Christ (unless he is already that) and that Kaep is a pretender who will obviously decline (jeez, who doesn't know that?).

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I think both guys have the potential to be the among the best in the NFL. I understand liking the QB who's on your team, but dude....Kaep has a chance to be INCREDIBLE.

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this is the very point I try to make over on your board... and i get the exact same responses you got here... goes with the territory my man.. But please don't lump all Seahawk fans together...

i for one don't see any reason Kap won't improve next season, nor do i see any reason he won't be a top 10/5 QB in the league in the next couple years... Only time will tell on these two.. the only difference i see in the two at this point is Kap has pure talent and the attributes to succeed, where Wilson has these as well but also has the "IT" factor.... you can just sense greatness with him..

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LOL. There you go again.

I was with you right up until that last line.

Seattle fans ALWAYS do that...and I will lump them together in this regard. Why does Wilson have "it" and Kaep does not? Kaep took his team to the Super Bowl in his 10th NFL start. Kaeps career QB rating through his FIRST 10 starts is nearly 100. He broke an NFL record in his first playoff start.

The guy has Terrell Suggs of all people, a notorious QB hater, singing his praises. He calls him "special" and that Kaep will play in "a few of these" in reference to the Super Bowl.

Don't believe me?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jj_9ackcS6k

PLEASE tell me what the "it" is that Wilson has that Kaep does not?

In his 1st start, he ripped the Chicago Bears a new one on Monday Night Football.

In his 5th career start he went into NE. In December. He threw FOUR TDs to beat the Patriots who hadn't lost there in that month in a decade.

In his 8th career start he started the game by throwing a pick 6 and then rebounding with one of the most impressive performances by a QB in playoff history (263 yards passing, 2 TDs, 181 yards rushing, 2 TDs). He accounted for 444 yards and FOUR TDs in his first playoff game...and again....8th NFL start.

He was down 17 to Atlanta and took the team all the way back for the win...in the NFCCG.

He was down 22 in the Super Bowl and almost pulled off the biggest comeback in SB history.


What the hell is the "it" that Kaep seems to be missing!?!

I understand what you mean about the "it" factor in terms of what it is. I agree with you that Wilson has it. Some guys just have "it" while others do not. What I object to is that fact that only the Pacific Northwest seems to think that Kaep does not. It's kinda comical.

IMO, it's because Kaep is 6'5", 240, has a huge arm and can run like the Wind. Wilson is 5'11", 210 lbs, has a good arm and can run. When those are the two guys dimensions, fans of that smaller guy tend to try to look elsewhere for the argument as to why he's better. Therefore, any intangable they use in regards to Wilson CAN'T be attributed to Kaep. Its the same reason people are critical that Kaep can "only run in a straight line". Its because Wilson is one of the most elusive QBs in the NFL. Its simply an attempt to draw a line in the sand and find something that Wilson is better at.

There is no need. I don't need to be convinced. I already think Wilson is a great young QB. I don't need to find holes in his game to diminish him in an attempt to make Kaep look better.

Marvin49":1dloit23 said:

Seattle fans ALWAYS do that...and I will lump them together in this regard. Why does Wilson have "it" and Kaep does not?

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What is with niner fans, why are they so insecure about Kaep?

I see it on other boards too(and here), especially ProFootballTalk, anytime Wilson is brought up, hordes of niner fans start screaming in unison, "But but but... what about Colin Kaepernick, he's really good too!! Right guys?! Guys? Kaperdick is just as good! Isn't he?!"

It's the strangest thing. You have a good QB. Enjoy.

You know i don't know how to explain it Marvin... you either have it or you don't... again i'm not saying he won't have it, i just don't see it now.. Maybe it's because he portrays himself like an immature person with his interviews and on field antics.. maybe that's what turns me off.. and i'm not saying he is immature because i don't knonw him personally, just how i see him with the short snotty answers and the on field crap..

i could very well be wrong, and he'll go on to be a Hall of Famer, he certainly has every skill to do just that.. i guess for me, time will tell.... but right now i don't see him like a Michael Jordan, or Montana, or Elway... Guys like that, that as soon as you see their team on the schedule you say crap, we got to face Jordan this week... Now i feel that way about the niners as a whole, but Kap alone does not strike fear into me, AT THIS POINT, that could very well change very quickly..

With RW, i already see it being said... Crap we got RW in our division.. That little Fu**er is going to be a pain in our ass for the next decade.. he has that whatever it is that strikes fear in you...

sorry, best i could do, don't know how to explain it better.

twisted_steel2":1shb6b7j said:

Marvin49":1shb6b7j said:

Seattle fans ALWAYS do that...and I will lump them together in this regard. Why does Wilson have "it" and Kaep does not?

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What is with niner fans, why are they so insecure about Kaep?

I see it on other boards too(and here), especially ProFootballTalk, anytime Wilson is brought up, hordes of niner fans start screaming in unison, "But but but... what about Colin Kaepernick, he's really good too!! Right guys?! Guys? Kaperdick is just as good! Isn't he?!"

It's the strangest thing. You have a good QB. Enjoy.

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ROTFLMAO!

Perspective is funny. I feel the EXACT same way about Seahawk fans. This conversation has been going on for awhile on both this board and a Niner board where he's registered.

Like looking in a mirror eh Marvin.. go to the Web, you'll see this exact convo in reverse.. pretty funny.

Marvin49":2xxxebfh said:

twisted_steel2":2xxxebfh said:

Marvin49":2xxxebfh said:

Seattle fans ALWAYS do that...and I will lump them together in this regard. Why does Wilson have "it" and Kaep does not?

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What is with niner fans, why are they so insecure about Kaep?

I see it on other boards too(and here), especially ProFootballTalk, anytime Wilson is brought up, hordes of niner fans start screaming in unison, "But but but... what about Colin Kaepernick, he's really good too!! Right guys?! Guys? Kaperdick is just as good! Isn't he?!"

It's the strangest thing. You have a good QB. Enjoy.

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ROTFLMAO!

Perspective is funny. I feel the EXACT same way about Seahawk fans. This conversation has been going on for awhile on both this board and a Niner board where he's registered.

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But yet here you are.... on a Seahawk board.

hawker84":36cgxmit said:

You know i don't know how to explain it Marvin... you either have it or you don't... again i'm not saying he won't have it, i just don't see it now.. Maybe it's because he portrays himself like an immature person with his interviews and on field antics.. maybe that's what turns me off.. and i'm not saying he is immature because i don't knonw him personally, just how i see him with the short snotty answers and the on field crap..

i could very well be wrong, and he'll go on to be a Hall of Famer, he certainly has every skill to do just that.. i guess for me, time will tell.... but right now i don't see him like a Michael Jordan, or Montana, or Elway... Guys like that the as soon as you see their team on the schedule you say crap, we got to face Jordan this week... Now i feel that way about the niners as a whole, but Kap alone does not strike fear into me, AT THIS POINt, that could very well change very quickly..

sorry, best i could do, don't know how to explain it better.

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Well...in regards to the way they handle the media, Wilson has Kaep beat hands down. No argument there. Kaep seems uncomfortable in front of the camera. He also is a fierce competitor and doesn't handle losing well. I remember after the Super Bowl most of his answers were one line. "Thoughts on the Super Bowl?". "I wasn't good enough". "How long will you remember this?". "The rest of my life".

Some who have that opinion you stated at the top point to a couple things in particular...."Kaepernicking" and the spike of the football vs the Packers. The Kaepernicking this is misunderstood. During the season there was this really offensive article that was published by the Sporting News I think. It was VERY durogotory in regards to his tatoos. The theme was somehting like "Kaepernick will probably raise a Lombardi trophy in the near future and the inmates at San Quantin will rejoice". It was BAD. I think its one of the reasons he kinda distrusts the media.

Kaep never said much about it....but when he scored a TD vs Miami on a 50 yard run he kissed the Tattoo on his arm and Kaepernicking was born. His management company ended up trademarking the term and made T-Shirts that he sold and gave the money to his favorite charity. Colin was adopted because his parents had lost two infant sons to Heart Disease. His charity is a foundation to fund research for Heart Disease.

The other thing people point to was spiking the ball at a defender vs GB. This one is less defendable, but he was pumped up. He didn't really realize what he was doing till he had done it. It wasn't because he had just made a big run...it was because he had just been sandwitched and took a pretty good hit. It was more "you can't hurt me" than anything else. Still, it was a young players mistake and it was stupid.

Bottom line....I understand why you think what you think. I just don't think you know the whole story.

You aren't going to change your mind tho until you see it on the field.

One thing is for sure tho...this certainly ain't the NFC Worst anymore.

twisted_steel2":11wv0082 said:

Marvin49":11wv0082 said:

ROTFLMAO!

Perspective is funny. I feel the EXACT same way about Seahawk fans. This conversation has been going on for awhile on both this board and a Niner board where he's registered.

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But yet here you are.... on a Seahawk board.

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...and as I said...the conversation is going on in both places.

hawker84":1f87cm5e said:

Like looking in a mirror eh Marvin.. go to the Web, you'll see this exact convo in reverse.. pretty funny.

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Totally.

I know that lots of Niner fans marginalize Wilson on their boards. I'm guilty of calling Wilson an umpa lumpa among other things...but mostly just to get under a Seahawks fans skin. LOL.

I'm also capable of seeing the humor in the Kaep/Gonzo Avatar I've seen on here. LOL.

Marvin49":2tlgioig said:

twisted_steel2":2tlgioig said:

Marvin49":2tlgioig said:

ROTFLMAO!

Perspective is funny. I feel the EXACT same way about Seahawk fans. This conversation has been going on for awhile on both this board and a Niner board where he's registered.

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But yet here you are.... on a Seahawk board.

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...and as I said...the conversation is going on in both places.

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Oh other places. Got it. :roll:

You are proving my point. You are on a Seahawks board, trying to prop Kaepernick up to Wilson's level. You are pissing into the wind here. Why?

If you were truly confident in his abilities, you wouldn't be here trying to convince us all. Trying to show us the light.

Your presence here is transparent.

twisted_steel2":346g1usd said:

Oh other places. Got it. :roll:

You are proving my point. You are on a Seahawks board, trying to prop Kaepernick up to Wilson's level. You are pissing into the wind here. Why?

If you were truly confident in his abilities, you wouldn't be here trying to convince us all. Trying to show us the light.

Your presence here is transparent.

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Then why respond? I'm not telling Hawker not to post on my "home" forum. Its a fun conversation.

If you don't like it, move on and don't respond. Its really quite simple.

I AM confident in Kaeps abilities just as Hawker is confident in Wilsons when he posts on the Niner boards.

i'm sure a lot of what you say is true.... but that's get's into a whole other discussion for another time perhaps..

i'll even take it into another direction..

when RW brought us back against WA and ATL, he cemented his status with most hawk fans as a clutch QB... he proved no matter what the score is, we are always in the game with a chance to win.. he also did this against CHI and DET.. He's a clutch player and has proven this time and time again already in just his rookie season... Keep in mind those 5 losses, were by a combined 26 points with a chance to win in almost every one.

Detroit and ATL especially were in the last minutes and he led us to go ahead TD's on the last drives , only to have our defense lose it in the end... you could say those drives were Elway or Montana-esk... both excelled at this...

Kap had chance to do just this, and failed against BAL... to me that's the difference in the two.. You put Elway, Montana, Manning, Brady in that situation, chances are they're scoring...Kap coudn't get it done..

Wilson is 1-0 against Keep head to head. So there's your answer.

Wilson didn't have a healthy Lynch in that come back against Atlanta.

hawker84":359zqrg4 said:

i'm sure a lot of what you say is true.... but that's get's into a whole other discussion for another time perhaps..

i'll even take it into another direction..

when RW brought us back against WA and ATL, he cemented his status with most hawk fans as a clutch QB... he proved no matter what the score is, we are always in the game with a chance to win.. he also did this against CHI and DET.. He's a clutch player and has proven this time and time again already in just his rookie season... Keep in mind those 5 losses, were by a combined 26 points with a chance to win in almost every one.

Detroit and ATL especially were in the last minutes and he led us to go ahead TD's on the last drives , only to have our defense lose it in the end... you could say those drives were Elway or Montana-esk... both excelled at this...

Kap had chance to do just this, and failed against BAL... to me that's the difference in the two.. You put Elway, Montana, Manning, Brady in that situation, chances are they're scoring...Kap coudn't get it done..

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....yet Kaep DID complete the comeback vs Atlanta, DID respond to a pick 6 with a record setting performance against GB, and was only 5 yards from completing the biggest comeback in SB history. Saying that Elway, Montana, Manning or Brady would have is false....because it's NEVER been done.

Ive talked to alot of 49er fans who blame Kaep for not scoring on that final drive saying that Montana or Young would have. Ya know what tho? They never had to. They were never down by 22 points. They never had the D completely fall apart in the first half and then see the second open with a kickoff return for a TD.

The fact is tho that this kid was on the biggest stage of his life and he took the team all the way back to have a chance to make a throw on that final drive.

It wasn't lack of "it" that didn't get it done. It was a lack of experience, some bad playcalling, a Ravens D playing well in the red-zone, and ...ahem....HOLDING!!!

Sorry.....last one still smarts. ;-)

crappershit would rather take body shots and celebrate a loss, while his opponent is perfecting his craft and working out with his teammates. The off season hasn't even started yet, and Wilson already has the edge. I'll take the guy that is 100% dedicated to the QB position...EVERY time.