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 Post subject: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:55 pm 
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Before the season I thought I remembered Pete talking about how they were going to see how Wagner does at MLB, but also thought he could play on the outside. Consider Wagner does have a ton of speed I think he could handle WLB, he seemed to have some success rushing the passer so maybe he'd get more opportunities on the outside. Does anyone else see us potentially moving Wagner outside and drafting a new MLB if the value is there? Or is this just a crazy idea?

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:04 pm 
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Why move him from the spot he did extroardinarily well at, for a Rookie. He should have been rookie of the year IMO, and he's only going to get better.

You don't fix something that's not broken. Just leave him there and draft a WLB


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:32 pm 
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lots of LBs in this years draft...


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:38 pm 
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If they found somebody who could play MLB better than Wagz and thought Wagz would be the best option at WLB then sure. Doubt they're gonna do anything crazy unless they're absolutely certain though, so probably not.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:43 pm 
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Wasn't Curry an athletic weak minded LB? LOL


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:54 pm 
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I get Wagner was successful at MLB and why change a good thing right, but i was just thinking if we can get an equivilant at MLB easier than an WLB. I figure Wagz could play WLB. It migth cost us a 2nd to get a starting WLB but if we could get a starting MLB in the 3rd would that be worth it?

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:01 pm 
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its like saying we should move sherman to WR.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:13 pm 
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Leave him there and draft someone to slide into the other LB slots. Him and KJ are beasts, one more guy with their potential and loooook out. Excited.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:55 pm 
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Move someone who is excelling at a very critical position -possibly the most critical position because it affects the entire D- and move him to a less critical one? :34853_doh: This off season can't end soon enough. :th2thumbs:


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:14 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:05 pm 
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Axx wrote:
its like saying we should move sherman to WR.


No more like if we had a need for CB should we move Earl to CB and draft Vaccora. Although Vaccora is not better than ET, where as there could be a MLB better than Wagner, Teo, Ogletree, and Minter could all Start at MLB day one.

Would Wagner be a good WLB? Better than Green, Brown or any other WLB prospect this year, Why?

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:11 pm 
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Say we drafted Ogletree, would you let him compete with Wagner at MLB and let the loser play WLB?

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:20 pm 
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If they the idea of improving the WLB spot, why not just find someone that has already excelled there instead of moving a player from a different spot there? Keep Bobby where he is and find someone through FA or the draft to become our next WLB.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:21 pm 
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AAAAARRRRGGHHHH is it april yet???

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:43 pm 
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You aren't crazy Wenhawk. I think Wagner's skillset (strong vs pass weak vs run) suits him best at WLB.

That said, this draft is a lot deeper at WLB than it is at MLB, and if Seattle drafts somebody like Greene, Brown, or Ogletree, then I'd imagine Wagner would probably stay put.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:06 pm 
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kearly wrote:
You aren't crazy Wenhawk. I think Wagner's skillset (strong vs pass weak vs run) suits him best at WLB.

That said, this draft is a lot deeper at WLB than it is at MLB, and if Seattle drafts somebody like Greene, Brown, or Ogletree, then I'd imagine Wagner would probably stay put.


?? Wagner does just fine against the run. Our DL has lacked against it at times, but Wagner largely has not. He will progress even further in year 2. Playing musical MLB every year is ridiculously Maddenesche. Wagner is doing great...especially when one considers he was a rookie playing in that very important and difficult position.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:53 pm 
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He must of done ok against the run to be considered for DROTY I would think. Next up lets move Lynch to strong safety and Kam to Fullback.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 12:09 am 
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Because sliding a guy who would fit great and was even projected by many to play the WILL is that crazy. Wagner had a really good rookie season, he did have trouble with the run at times, though and he hasn't proven himself elite or anything. I don't think it'll happen, but it's not that crazy of a thought that another LB could be brought in and the perfect recipe involves Wagner at WLB.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:34 am 
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If we find another QB in the draft, do we move RW to Tight End? ... Just asking !!! The guy who drove him out of NC State (Mike Glennon) will be available. He is taller than RW (6ft6 ) and has a cannon arm and the ESPN scout love him and he looks like Andrew Luck and .... lol

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:28 am 
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While we are at it lets put Kam at lber, Sherman at Wr.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:34 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:36 am 
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bellingerga wrote:
Why move him from the spot he did extroardinarily well at, for a Rookie. He should have been rookie of the year IMO, and he's only going to get better.

You don't fix something that's not broken. Just leave him there and draft a WLB


Exactly. It's a big risk to have 2/3 of your linebackers in new situations.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:21 am 
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Wow a lot of smart a$$ responses for a fairly reasonable out of the box idea. Moving Lynch, Wilson, Sherman is ridiculous and obviously you don't have any insight to this topic, and neither does all the can't wait for the season, so you post a thoughtless answer and make yourself look silly.

So it seems that Kearly responded with the closest to what I was actually looking for by noticing this draft is stronger at WLB than MLB and that we should be able to fill the WLB easily. But if we did fall in love with a MLB prospect maybe one who is not as athletic but more of a leader type, I don't think it would hurt to have KJ, Wagner and a new MLB know all the calls and be versatile enough to play multiple positions. We have had a ton of success starting rookie MLB's so I would not be too worried.

Anyways I think this is more of an actual possibility, not saying it is a gretest idea, but if anyone ont he team is switching positions Wagner to WLB would be one of the most seamless.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:36 am 
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Wenhawk wrote:
Wow a lot of smart a$$ responses for a fairly reasonable out of the box idea. Moving Lynch, Wilson, Sherman is ridiculous and obviously you don't have any insight to this topic, and neither does all the can't wait for the season, so you post a thoughtless answer and make yourself look silly.

So it seems that Kearly responded with the closest to what I was actually looking for by noticing this draft is stronger at WLB than MLB and that we should be able to fill the WLB easily. But if we did fall in love with a MLB prospect maybe one who is not as athletic but more of a leader type, I don't think it would hurt to have KJ, Wagner and a new MLB know all the calls and be versatile enough to play multiple positions. We have had a ton of success starting rookie MLB's so I would not be too worried.

Anyways I think this is more of an actual possibility, not saying it is a gretest idea, but if anyone ont he team is switching positions Wagner to WLB would be one of the most seamless.


Some of the responses you have gotten are most likely because this has been brought on but with other players since the season has ended not because the topic is stupid. Earl Thomas as a lot cb, Kam as a WLB, Sherman as a WR (situationallly), Bruce Irvin as OLB, Big Red back to DT, Browner as a Safety... etc

As for the idea, I'd like to keep Wagner right where he is dude played a hell of a season and will get better in his second year, I think it would be easier to find a good Will lb than a mlb as good as Wagner in the draft.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 11:39 am 
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Wow a lot of smart a$$ responses for a fairly reasonable out of the box idea. Moving Lynch, Wilson, Sherman is ridiculous and obviously you don't have any insight to this topic, and neither does all the can't wait for the season, so you post a thoughtless answer and make yourself look silly.


Many think your idea is also silly, smart ass maybe a MLB directing the defense that was successful in his first season with the rankings we had he was key. We can find a WLB that has better hips and can cover, we seem to pick them up pretty regular in the draft.
Condesending tones of nobody has any insight that posted except yourself is only going to bring more backlash as well. Glad your so elite in you assessments though, us minions of stupidity can sit back and watch you educate us.

I also remember you blasting many peoples ideas over the years, smart ass or not you get what you give, deal with it quit whining about yourself being picked on my the big blue meanies.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 12:15 pm 
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chris98251 wrote:
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Wow a lot of smart a$$ responses for a fairly reasonable out of the box idea. Moving Lynch, Wilson, Sherman is ridiculous and obviously you don't have any insight to this topic, and neither does all the can't wait for the season, so you post a thoughtless answer and make yourself look silly.


Many think your idea is also silly, smart ass maybe a MLB directing the defense that was successful in his first season with the rankings we had he was key. We can find a WLB that has better hips and can cover, we seem to pick them up pretty regular in the draft.
Condesending tones of nobody has any insight that posted except yourself is only going to bring more backlash as well. Glad your so elite in you assessments though, us minions of stupidity can sit back and watch you educate us.

I also remember you blasting many peoples ideas over the years, smart ass or not you get what you give, deal with it quit whining about yourself being picked on my the big blue meanies.



Don't feel picked on just think completely dismissing the idea and making it a joke is a little unfair, I figured that people could give an actual analysis for pro's and cons and considering Wagner is a LB moving from one LB spot to another is not nearly as drastic as moving a CB to WR or any of the other ideas. Moving Red back to DT can be argued but is not something worth laughing at it is not likely but could happen.

Wagner at WLB shouldn't be out of the question but I guess most feel it is. And I am not claiming to have tons of knowledge I can educate people with, I posted this to gain knowledge as to how he could fit at WLB and besides the obvious don't mess with a good thing argument expected someone to try and convince me he couldn't play that position.

As it stands it seems the consensus is Wagner is firmly entrenched at MLB, yet Keechley who won DROY started at OLB and moved inside and his production was exceptional at both positions. I feel like the position is somewhat interchangeable depending on team personel styles and was mostly intrigued with drafting Bostic out of Florida in the 4th/5th area, if he could start at MLB and play well and WAgner could still excell as a WLB it seems like it would be a good move allowing us to use our other early picks on DT/DE/TE/WR.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 12:51 pm 
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Wenhawk wrote:
chris98251 wrote:
Quote:
Wow a lot of smart a$$ responses for a fairly reasonable out of the box idea. Moving Lynch, Wilson, Sherman is ridiculous and obviously you don't have any insight to this topic, and neither does all the can't wait for the season, so you post a thoughtless answer and make yourself look silly.


Many think your idea is also silly, smart ass maybe a MLB directing the defense that was successful in his first season with the rankings we had he was key. We can find a WLB that has better hips and can cover, we seem to pick them up pretty regular in the draft.
Condesending tones of nobody has any insight that posted except yourself is only going to bring more backlash as well. Glad your so elite in you assessments though, us minions of stupidity can sit back and watch you educate us.

I also remember you blasting many peoples ideas over the years, smart ass or not you get what you give, deal with it quit whining about yourself being picked on my the big blue meanies.



Don't feel picked on just think completely dismissing the idea and making it a joke is a little unfair, I figured that people could give an actual analysis for pro's and cons and considering Wagner is a LB moving from one LB spot to another is not nearly as drastic as moving a CB to WR or any of the other ideas. Moving Red back to DT can be argued but is not something worth laughing at it is not likely but could happen.

Wagner at WLB shouldn't be out of the question but I guess most feel it is. And I am not claiming to have tons of knowledge I can educate people with, I posted this to gain knowledge as to how he could fit at WLB and besides the obvious don't mess with a good thing argument expected someone to try and convince me he couldn't play that position.

As it stands it seems the consensus is Wagner is firmly entrenched at MLB, yet Keechley who won DROY started at OLB and moved inside and his production was exceptional at both positions. I feel like the position is somewhat interchangeable depending on team personel styles and was mostly intrigued with drafting Bostic out of Florida in the 4th/5th area, if he could start at MLB and play well and WAgner could still excell as a WLB it seems like it would be a good move allowing us to use our other early picks on DT/DE/TE/WR.


Would you move Wilson to RB, he has size and speed. Wagner is the defensive QB, Wright called plays till Wagner got up to speed true but you need coverage skills to play outside as well. Thats where Wagner is lacking, speed does not mean coverage ability. He has great range and attack speed and can get thru blocks. Seen it and read about his lack of coverage abilitys. You have a gem in the middle, easier to find a coverage guy outside. In a pinch due to injury you force issues and either Wright or Wagner could play Middle, but we would miss him there and notice it.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:18 pm 
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You've left the realm of reasonable comparisons. Wagner did not play like Patrick Willis last year, it's entirely possible we could find improvement at MLB or similar play at MLB with Wagner providing the best play at WLB.

Wagner has not proven elite at MLB, he had a really good rookie season, but he's not untouchable, and moving him over one spot is not a night and day change. I'm not saying its likely, but you guys are just spewing at the mouth with these stupid comparisons of moving Kam to FB, Okung to FS, and Wilson to hot dog vendor. Let's get some perspective.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:22 pm 
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Wenhawk wrote:
I get Wagner was successful at MLB and why change a good thing right, but i was just thinking if we can get an equivilant at MLB easier than an WLB. I figure Wagz could play WLB. It migth cost us a 2nd to get a starting WLB but if we could get a starting MLB in the 3rd would that be worth it?


hogwash! WILL LBers aren't rare. And it's not a higher priority position over a MLB. There's is no incentive for doing this. We found our starting SAM in the 4th. You can find starters in any round if you know what your doing. Thankfully PC and JS know what they are doing and are very good at projecting the abilties draftees.

Wagner's more valuable at the MIKE where he stays on the field for 3 downs. IN the nickle package the WILL most likely comes off the field and KJ and Bobby are the 2 Lbers.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:26 pm 
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Some of you people are ridiculous. It's not that wacky of a suggestion. If the Seahawks had an opportunity to bring in an elite or potentially elite MLB, moving Wagner to WILL wouldn't be the end of the world. Who knows? He could excel there. Everyone saying "Might as well move sherm to WR" need to step back. This is the kind of thing that stops constructive posters from posting here.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:43 pm 
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Yea, No need to overthink this.
There is no guarantee that a higher pick player in this draft will excel in Seattle as well as Bobby did at the Mike spot.
Shifting Bobby to OLB to create more pass rush opportunity looks good on paper but leaves more questions unanswered.
Only sure thing is that Bobby did his job exceptionally as a rookie at MLB. Who's to say we can't ask Wagner to blitz more from the Mike this year if that's your main objective.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:44 pm 
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Why would a team that has glaring needs at DE and DT and WR spend a high draft pick at a position, where they have an almost rookie of the year? That really doesn't make any sense. I assume here that the type of MLB we are talking about would need to be selected in one of the first two rounds.
Furthermore, this mean, we would be passing on some excellent DT/DE or WR to select a guy, who might or might NOT even be better than what we already have. How does that help this team, honestly ???
Let's assume for a minute that Wagner had some weaknesses against the run. Should we just give up on him after his first year? Can't we see how he can improve /coached up on those weaknesses? I have never seen a player who has NO weaknesses after his rookie year.
Someone brought up the example of Luke Kuechly ... well, Luke was competing for the MLB position with Thomas Davis, who came from his third ACL surgery in as many years and wasn't really ready. Anyone who watched TD play knew he wasn't the same as prior to his injury. It was just a logical step to move Luke there.
Wagner should be coached to improve on his "weaknesses". We should spend our high draft picks on improving areas of glaring weaknesses.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:00 pm 
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Wenhawk wrote:
Before the season I thought I remembered Pete talking about how they were going to see how Wagner does at MLB, but also thought he could play on the outside. Consider Wagner does have a ton of speed I think he could handle WLB, he seemed to have some success rushing the passer so maybe he'd get more opportunities on the outside. Does anyone else see us potentially moving Wagner outside and drafting a new MLB if the value is there? Or is this just a crazy idea?


They do like to have players who can play more than one position. But in the case of Wagner, I have a reservation about such a move beyond building on top of last years development at MLB.

I place a lot of value on a signal caller at middle linebacker that can read lips when it becomes too loud for a helmet head set. We all know how impossible it becomes to hear in a Seahawk game in Seattle when the defense is on the field.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:04 pm 
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I'm not even sure they expected Wagner to be the MLB when they drafted him. It might seem like a ridiculous move to some posters here, but those guys are going to have to learn that "ridiculous" just happens to be the current regime's specialty.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:18 pm 
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I like Wagner at Middle there's stronger Will's in the draft in my opinion. Better in coverage and just as quick. If the Hawks went looking for MLBs in this draft I would be scared to death they'd actually see something in the Manti Teo hype/bust/circus and draft him. It's not often I would elect to miss Seahawk games but that Nothing Dame project gives me an ice cream headache everytime I so much as hear his name.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:36 am 
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I'm not going to ridicule the original poster but I think Wagner belongs where he is, one of the reasons they brought him in was to get more athletic at MLB, Hawthorne was really solid against the run but we saw what happened when we added a better athlete at the position.

His speed at his position is huge, I think he's one of the most athletic MLB's in the league, I don't know if that would be the case at WIL. We've seen this team struggle to find a MLB (remember the days or Orlando Huff, Solomon Bates and Niko Koutevides?) I say leave him where he's at and see if he gets better in year 2.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:38 am 
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Wagner didn't always have good gap discipline against the run. It got better through the year, but he's still learning, thus the "weak against the run" comments. He's also working on the zone coverage, but he was better in pass coverage towards the end of the year.

Saying Wagner was a runner up for DROY so he has to be good against the run is incorrect. It's like saying Keuchly was the best cantidate for DROY based upon him leading the NFL in tackles. He had a ton of tackles, but not a lot of impact plays; very few TFL, interceptions and FF's. Sure, he earned it with a ton of tackles, but many of them were 5 yards or more downfield.

Wagner had a good year, but there could be better MLB's. Lofa was much more instinctive than Wagner is; Wagner just has much better athleticism. It's not a poor suggestion at all (the OP that is), Wagner's skill set seems suited to the outside, but he's good inside as well. It would really depend on what the coaching staff felt comfortable with and how the draft fell to us. The nice thing is that we have versatility; if we get a really strong MLB that falls to us, we can slide Bobby. If we find the elite WLB prospect, Bobby is only going to get better where he's at. I don't see it hurting us either way.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 12:07 pm 
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Wagner didn't always have good gap discipline against the run. It got better through the year, but he's still learning, thus the "weak against the run" comments. He's also working on the zone coverage, but he was better in pass coverage towards the end of the year.

Saying Wagner was a runner up for DROY so he has to be good against the run is incorrect. It's like saying Keuchly was the best cantidate for DROY based upon him leading the NFL in tackles. He had a ton of tackles, but not a lot of impact plays; very few TFL, interceptions and FF's. Sure, he earned it with a ton of tackles, but many of them were 5 yards or more downfield.

Wagner had a good year, but there could be better MLB's. Lofa was much more instinctive than Wagner is; Wagner just has much better athleticism. It's not a poor suggestion at all (the OP that is), Wagner's skill set seems suited to the outside, but he's good inside as well. It would really depend on what the coaching staff felt comfortable with and how the draft fell to us. The nice thing is that we have versatility; if we get a really strong MLB that falls to us, we can slide Bobby. If we find the elite WLB prospect, Bobby is only going to get better where he's at. I don't see it hurting us either way.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:54 pm 
*Scott of Smacksville*
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I think moving Wagner to WLB is legit. I still don't trust his run gapping instincts. And his speed is easy to project.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:53 pm 
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pinksheets wrote:
You've left the realm of reasonable comparisons. Wagner did not play like Patrick Willis last year, it's entirely possible we could find improvement at MLB or similar play at MLB with Wagner providing the best play at WLB.

Wagner has not proven elite at MLB, he had a really good rookie season, but he's not untouchable, and moving him over one spot is not a night and day change. I'm not saying its likely, but you guys are just spewing at the mouth with these stupid comparisons of moving Kam to FB, Okung to FS, and Wilson to hot dog vendor. Let's get some perspective.



The problem with this entire scenario, is you guys are grasping at what PC said before Wagner even participated in OTA's/ minicamps. There is no evidence that Wagner would be more successful at the WILL spot over what he did at MIKE this past year. It's just wishful thinking.

AT MIKE we have a year's worth of data. Whereas at WILL You have none. Are you really willing to gamble that he'll be just as effective? Infact he's have to be appreciably MORE effective at WILL for the move to really pay off. At the same time we'd trying to get another rookie to perform at the same level that he did last year. What is the odds that both Wagner can play at a higher level AND you find a MLB who played just as well. Those are not good odds.

The other thing you have to factor in is -- how valuable is the WILL position in this defense? Usually Wagner and Wright stay on the field for nickle situations and we bring Trufaunt on. Both of those guys have gained invaluable experience in nickle situations this year.
IF you get a new MLB you'd be throwing that experience out the window as Wagner would be coming off the field. What sense does that make- Remember only 1 player get's the headset in their helmet. So it would be impractical to have Wagner play WILL and then have Wagner stay on for Nickle situations (having the new Mike come off the field).


IMO it's much easier to draft a WILL and allow Wright and Wagner continue to develop @ their respective positions.

In short, if you leave Wagner, continuity will benefit these guys and we should see a higher level of player, IF you move him, you insert not just 1 quesiton mark, all of a sudden the Lbing corps is an Unknown commodity with 2 new starters.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:13 pm 
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Didn't Wagner when asked say he was more comfortable and saw himself more as an outside lb than a mlb? If the right player fell I can easily see him being moved to the outside. It would take the right player though, and I doubt the front office would do it if it wasn't the right player.


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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:26 am 
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I've said over and over again since the day he was drafted that Bobby Wagner is an OLB. He was in college. He has the perfect body for it. He has the perfect skill set for it.

He got trounced by just about every team with a power running game this season. Luckily, there just aren't many teams left in the league that play this style, so I can see where a speed cover MLB can actually be a pretty smart addition, but still, you gotta blow up that hole. Part of that is his build. MLB's that are stout against the run carry the bulk of their weight in their buttocks and thighs. Even the taller ones. Wagner just isn't built like that. He certainly has an OLB body. He also had problems rooting blockers. He's typically a half-step slow into the hole as well, which I will gladly concede can improve with experience.

I'm not a Wagner hater. I think he's a very good NFL linebacker. But he was far better going side to side than he was at blowing up plays at the point of attack. Call me old fashioned, but I still believe the MLB's most important role outside of leadership is stopping the interior run. And I think that is the weakest part of our MLB's game.

I think he would be such a stud outside. It would free him up to use his speed to make those hiccup plays that we haven't had at OLB since Chad Brown. I think he can be a special playmaker in this league, which is still something this defense doesn't have enough of, but it is really hard to make those types of plays when you're buried in the trenches.

Is it realistic? I dunno. But if they're sitting in the second round and they're debating two players, a MLB and a WLB, and they think the MLB is a heckuva player, I could see it happening.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:22 pm 
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Dan Quinn sparks my intrest in Florida defenders. MLB Jon Bostic is rated a 3-5 round prospect if we could get him in the 4th and start him, allowing us to slide Wagner to WLB. I think it would be a screwd move by upgrading our WLB and filling our MLB with a player who already knows his coaches defense (lessen the rookie learning curve).

Would Manti Teo be an option at #25?

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:27 pm 
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I'm fairly content to let the runner up for DROY continue to develop at that position.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:43 am 
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I expect this to happen. MLB and WLB are very similar positions and Wagner actually fits the WLB mold better than the MLB. WLB have to engage blockers less and have to have phenomenal tackling, coverage and sideline to sideline speed to make plays on RBs on the front side. Blitzing prowess also helps.

We will draft an LBs this year with more length and size than Wagner. This is better for coming downhill and avoiding blockers - something required for an MLB as well as getting in passing lanes. These also allow him to better transition to SLB should anything happen to Wright - something Wagner could not do easily because he lacks length and leverage at the point of attack.

In our system, think as MLB as a somewhat middle ground between SLB and WLB (though more toward the WLB).

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:48 am 
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Scottemojo wrote:
I think moving Wagner to WLB is legit. I still don't trust his run gapping instincts. And his speed is easy to project.


Yes, and he's excellent in coverage too. His (1st) pick on Tannehill last year takes exceptional awareness.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:44 am 
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T-Sizzle wrote:
While we are at it lets put Kam at lber, Sherman at Wr.



Kam at LB is not too crazy but I think you were just being a smarta$$. After reading some of the others coments have you been convinced Wagner to WLB is not that ridiculous.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:56 pm 
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Wenhawk wrote:
T-Sizzle wrote:
While we are at it lets put Kam at lber, Sherman at Wr.



Kam at LB is not too crazy but I think you were just being a smarta$$. After reading some of the others coments have you been convinced Wagner to WLB is not that ridiculous.


Some around here (myself included) have a tough time justifying moving a player when they have already shown they have what it takes to excel at their position. Wagner is a rookie who was runner up for defensive rookie of the year.

Doesn't it make more sense to address other needs at #25 and find a WILL LB later? They could have replaced Hill with Wagner at the WILL and go with Ruud at MIKE. They didn't. They went with the Rookie at MIKE. And all he did was be the runner up for DROY. I think those facts speak volumes about where he should play. And again, hes a rookie. Let the rookies develop, especially the ones who have shown so much when given the opportunity,

If this front office has shown me anything, it's an ability to find DB's and LB's.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:00 pm 
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Basis4day wrote:
Wenhawk wrote:
T-Sizzle wrote:
While we are at it lets put Kam at lber, Sherman at Wr.



Kam at LB is not too crazy but I think you were just being a smarta$$. After reading some of the others coments have you been convinced Wagner to WLB is not that ridiculous.


Some around here (myself included) have a tough time justifying moving a player when they have already shown they have what it takes to excel at their position. Wagner is a rookie who was runner up for defensive rookie of the year.

Doesn't it make more sense to address other needs at #25 and find a WILL LB later? They could have replaced Hill with Wagner at the WILL and go with Ruud at MIKE. They didn't. They went with the Rookie at MIKE. And all he did was be the runner up for DROY. I think those facts speak volumes about where he should play. And again, hes a rookie. Let the rookies develop, especially the ones who have shown so much when given the opportunity,

If this front office has shown me anything, it's an ability to find DB's and LB's.

Ruud wasn't physically ready to play the Mike, he would not have lasted very long, and they knew it.

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 Post subject: Re: Wagner as WLB
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:14 pm 
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Basis4day wrote:
Some around here (myself included) have a tough time justifying moving a player when they have already shown they have what it takes to excel at their position. Wagner is a rookie who was runner up for defensive rookie of the year.

Doesn't it make more sense to address other needs at #25 and find a WILL LB later? They could have replaced Hill with Wagner at the WILL and go with Ruud at MIKE. They didn't. They went with the Rookie at MIKE. And all he did was be the runner up for DROY. I think those facts speak volumes about where he should play. And again, hes a rookie. Let the rookies develop, especially the ones who have shown so much when given the opportunity,

If this front office has shown me anything, it's an ability to find DB's and LB's.


I wasn't so much arguing that they should move him or that it is best to move him, but mearly brought up the topc of could they move him.
according to some this draft is stronger at WLB than MLB anyways but figured that if the right MLB fell into our lap could Wagner play WLB and be just as productive. Sounds like that is a very real possibility and those that instantly cried for the offseason to be over or to move offensive players to defense or defensive player to offense could have though out their responses in a more useful manner by providing their honest opinion or some actual data. I have not really argued he should be moved to WLB but I wouldn't put it past Pete to do such a thing and that's a main reason why I started this topic.

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