Matt Flynn expected to be cut?

volsunghawk

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scutterhawk":3q30xdi9 said:
theENGLISHseahawk":3q30xdi9 said:
CrimsonWazzu":3q30xdi9 said:
He's not grossly overpaid for what he is...a starting caliber NFL QB.

The guy has two starts in his career. We have no idea if he's a starting calibre NFL QB.

Apparently John Schneider believes he's "a starting calibre NFL QB". Or is he also full of it?


Well, he IS an NFL GM. So that means that nearly every time he's speaking to any member of the media, he's feeling them at least a little bull. :mrgreen:
 

seedhawk

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Another point. Right now the cap is flat, but it will go up in the future, and the teams" WILL" spend basically 90% of their free/cap money every year. Rollover in that instance just guarantees you wind up spending more.

Many here subscribe to the plan that we should find a backup more like Wilson. RW is unique! Even RG3 is not a clone. Close perhaps. Many bring up Portis. He could perhaps be 40% RW.

I respect English for his analysis and pointers, however, when it comes to Flynn, it seems to me Rob is wearing blinders.

Simply because RW fell to us, one way or another, and perhaps winding up a 3rd rould pick drives him more than any of us know, seems to me our team would have still made the playoffs with Flynn as our Qb. Would our games look different, certainly! This Qb debate between Flynn and Wilson is equal to the chicken or the egg first debate.
 

DavidSeven

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Am I crazy to think Flynn has more upside than Alex Smith? Obviously, Smith has proven he can thrive in a perfect situation, but what are his game-managing ways going to do for teams like Kansas City or Jacksonville? I feel like the mystery surrounding Flynn's true abilities should benefit him here.
 

Scottemojo

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DavidSeven":2xcwowgm said:
Am I crazy to think Flynn has more upside than Alex Smith? Obviously, Smith has proven he can thrive in a perfect situation, but what are his game-manaing ways going to do for teams like Kansas City or Jacksonville?
No, not crazy. Alex has always been a terrible red zone QB.
 

SonicHawk

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2012 Matt Flynn:
5-9 68Yds

Matt Flynn Career:
5 Years, 1083 Yards, 9TDs, 5INT

I can't believe we don't want to keep this guy around FOREVER? Who else could throw for 1000 yards in 5 years? WHO!!!!?!?!?!!
 

sc85sis

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What if the Falcons had managed to score and beat the 49ers at the end of the game last Sunday? They'd be going to the Super Bowl with a QB who is injured. Would he heal up in time? If not, would he heal up enough that he could play injured but still get the job done? Would they have to go with their backup, and who IS their backup?

If John and company feel they can afford to keep Matt, they will do so. If not, they'll try to shop him. Cutting him would be a last resort--not impossible, but definitely further down the list of possibilities.
 

onanygivensunday

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In my book there are at least eight teams that will be (or should be) looking for an upgrade at QB.

They include the Chiefs, the Jags, the Raiders, the Eagles, the Browns, the Cardinals, the Bills and the Jets... and that is the draft order in the first round with the exception of the Lions who pick at #5.

I am of the opinion that at least two of those eight teams will have an interest in Flynn "at the right price".

I believe that the Hawks will trade Flynn on draft day to one of those eight teams... and it could go down as either swapping picks in the same round... likely no earlier than the third round.... or it could go down with a swap coupled with a draft pick if the swap is in a later round... like the 5th or 6th.
 
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theENGLISHseahawk

theENGLISHseahawk

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scutterhawk":3dkum7e1 said:
Apparently John Schneider believes he's "a starting calibre NFL QB". Or is he also full of it?

Well in that case he also believed Charlie Whitehurst was a starting calibre QB.

JS is a fantastic GM, but he's not invincible.
 

volsunghawk

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Scottemojo":uex3jx4r said:
DavidSeven":uex3jx4r said:
Am I crazy to think Flynn has more upside than Alex Smith? Obviously, Smith has proven he can thrive in a perfect situation, but what are his game-manaing ways going to do for teams like Kansas City or Jacksonville?
No, not crazy. Alex has always been a terrible red zone QB.

In the three games where Flynn played significant snaps prior to signing with Seattle, he was... not great. Then again, there's not a lot of evidence, really.

Against the Lions in 2010 when he took over for Rodgers mid-game, he had only one trip to the red zone:

2 plays, 2 attempts, 0 completions, 1 INT

Against the Patriots in 2010, when he was the starter, he had 5 trips into the red zone:

18 plays, 5 runs, 2 sacks (one where he fumbled the ball away to end the game), 11 attempts, 5 completions, 2 TDs

Against the Lions in 2011, when he was the starter, he had 3 trips into the end zone:

10 plays, 2 runs, 8 attempts, 5 completions, 2 TDs

---

While there is clear evidence that Flynn's play in the red zone improved with each opportunity to start, I wouldn't yet call red zone play a "strength." I'd still consider it an unknown. What is clear is that at least in the famous 480/6 game, Flynn benefited a lot from the big play. For a team to score 45 points offensively and yet only reach the red zone 3 times in a game is pretty incredible.

I don't have the time to track each of Smith's plays in the red zone right now. Maybe I'll investigate that this evening.
 

mikeak

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seedhawk":2kp9uq6p said:
Another point. Right now the cap is flat, but it will go up in the future, and the teams" WILL" spend basically 90% of their free/cap money every year. Rollover in that instance just guarantees you wind up spending more.
.

Except the cap won't really go up for awhile based on the new CBA. Technically you are right but I don't count an extra million as going up (in this case now if it was my salary I would :D)

"As a review, the 2012 official league-wide cap is $120 million. In 2013, that number is expected to grow only to $121 million, with 2014 at $122 million and a modest bump to $125 million in 2015"

http://www.fieldgulls.com/2012/7/16/316 ... paul-allen
 

mikeak

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Just realized something -- except for KC does it really matter if we expect to cut Flynn?

If we cut him he would hardly get past the first team in the draft so KC would pick him up if actually like him. So the other 7 teams that needs a qb would still have to trade for him if they like him and think one team ahead of them on the waiver wire likes Flynn as well.

Don't expect us to cut him regardless
 

The Radish

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seahawks08":tp76ndcg said:
I have a theory about Matt Flynn. I think Dallas will pick him up to compete with Tony Romo and he will win that job. I think there is pressure in Dallas and they are finally figuring out that Romo is an interception machine, I think Jerry Jones is going to do something about it and he may do something crazy that none of us would ever imagine. No, i did not read it anywhere, it is something I came to conclusion based on situations.


I'm on the other side of this argument cause I think Dallas needs to get Romo some help. Anytime you force your guy to throw for 446 yards in a losing effort it seems to me he's doing his part.

The owner there on the other hand seems to be the one holding them back but we don't need a Jerry Jones type cause he can't catch a football worth a shit either and damn sure isn't a defensive genius either.

what he is is offensive,,,,,,,to anyone that knows how to build a football team.

:D
 

CrimsonWazzu

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theENGLISHseahawk":tptxc951 said:
He might be wrong on this one. But he could be right. I'm prepared for any scenario when it comes to Flynn's future. I suspect some people aren't, and they might be in for a surprise.


CrimsonWazzu":tptxc951 said:
He's not grossly overpaid for what he is...a starting caliber NFL QB.

The guy has two starts in his career. We have no idea if he's a starting calibre NFL QB.



The lack of starts is always a fair point, but he's certainly been a victim of circumstance. Backup to a guy who is well on his way to a HOF career, and then gets totally blindsided by a 3rd round phenom. He has all the tools, and certainly would be an upgrade for 6 or 7 teams right now that need a competent quarterback.

It may very well come down to nobody willing to give anything up to take Matt Flynn and his current contract because they don't see the value there....which ultimately means that Schneider and Carroll see a lot more in him than others do....which is, from what we've already learned early and often, par for the course.

I do disagree about the class of QB's this year. It's just not very good, which in turn brings a marginally higher value to Flynn.
 

CANHawk

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theENGLISHseahawk":3asjzawl said:
scutterhawk":3asjzawl said:
Apparently John Schneider believes he's "a starting calibre NFL QB". Or is he also full of it?

Well in that case he also believed Charlie Whitehurst was a starting calibre QB.

JS is a fantastic GM, but he's not invincible.

Well in The Schneid's defense, I think that he thought Whitehurst was a starting caliber QB coming out of college. I think those 3 years at the bottom of the depth chart, bumming about in the San Diego sun NOT working on the shortcommings in his game kinda ruined him. He still seemed to have the physical tools, but looked lost when he was thrown in against live ammo.
 

RichNhansom

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volsunghawk":1q5govpu said:
Scottemojo":1q5govpu said:
DavidSeven":1q5govpu said:
Am I crazy to think Flynn has more upside than Alex Smith? Obviously, Smith has proven he can thrive in a perfect situation, but what are his game-manaing ways going to do for teams like Kansas City or Jacksonville?
No, not crazy. Alex has always been a terrible red zone QB.

In the three games where Flynn played significant snaps prior to signing with Seattle, he was... not great. Then again, there's not a lot of evidence, really.

Against the Lions in 2010 when he took over for Rodgers mid-game, he had only one trip to the red zone:

2 plays, 2 attempts, 0 completions, 1 INT

This isn't to surprising considering he was stepping in mid game. It's not like he game planned all week.

Against the Patriots in 2010, when he was the starter, he had 5 trips into the red zone:

18 plays, 5 runs, 2 sacks (one where he fumbled the ball away to end the game), 11 attempts, 5 completions, 2 TDs

This stat is a little misleading. Tom Brady threw for 158 yards and 1 TD in that same game. The weather was horrific. Raining and snowing with heavy wind gusts that effected both QB's and of the two Flynn looked like the better QB and didn't benefit from one of his O-lineman running back a kick off for a TD. Yep, an O-lineman. Flynn did throw a pick and it was a bad one but there were IIRC 6 missed tackles on the return and they were horrid missed tackles the variety of which players get released over. If NE doesn't get either one of the pick 6 or the O-lineman (fricken O-lineman) TD's Flynn is 2-0 in his two starts. It should also be mentioned that Flynn threw the ball 66 times completing 40 of them. How often do you ask your backup to come in in horrible weather and ask him to throw the ball 66 times?

Against the Lions in 2011, when he was the starter, he had 3 trips into the end zone:

10 plays, 2 runs, 8 attempts, 5 completions, 2 TDs

This is kind of a funny one. If you listen to the "he sucks' crowd, all Flynn did was take the snap and throw the ball and the best receiving core to ever grace the NFL field did the rest. It ignores what Flynn really did in that game including repeat come from behind leads against an opposing QB who threw for over 500 yards in a game with playoff seeding implications for the opponent only and Flynn was without multiple key starters including Jennings playing for a team that had nothing to gain from a win.

If you watched the game honestly you would see how the YAC was possible. It was due to leading his receivers and throwing them open. He wasn't waiting for the receiver to plant like we watched Jackson do all last year, he threw the ball to were the receiver could make the catch with the least interference from DB's and with the most ability to run after the catch. GB has a great receiver group even without Jennings but they aren't so good they can just break every tackle and mow through opponents. They need to ball to be placed where they can catch it in stride or your YAC is meaningless. Even with that said only two of Flynn's 5 TD's were attributed to long runs after the catch and both were because of a perfect throw that enabled the run not despite it.



---

While there is clear evidence that Flynn's play in the red zone improved with each opportunity to start, I wouldn't yet call red zone play a "strength." I'd still consider it an unknown. What is clear is that at least in the famous 480/6 game, Flynn benefited a lot from the big play. For a team to score 45 points offensively and yet only reach the red zone 3 times in a game is pretty incredible.

This is the beauty of only having a small sample size. You can actually go back and watch each play and evaluate them individually. Stats are nice but they don't tell the whole story. You can assume alot of things but the real eyeball test is seeing what actually happened and not what the stats were. They can be very misleading. I mean after the NE game no one was saying Flynn was a better QB than Brady though that day he clearly was.

I don't have the time to track each of Smith's plays in the red zone right now. Maybe I'll investigate that this evening.
 

Largent80

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:lol: you guys that try and hammer your point are quite amusing.

Flynn is simply a backup. What else needs to be said?
 

Mtjhoyas

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Here's a simple way of looking at it...

If you are on the side that Flynn is a no brainer good starting caliber QB, then we should be seeing great offers in the near future (ie 1st to 3rd rounder). If somebody offered GB a 2nd or 3rd rounder for Flynn, how many of you really think they would turn that down, knowing they could acquire a cheap, starting caliber player with that capital? Honest question.

If you are on the side that Flynn is god awful, then why would JS pay good money to acquire him in FA? Yes, he let him walk without an offer, but ultimately paid the man. If he was terrible, why would any GM cough up $ for him? Why is he still in the league?

So, I'm going out on a limb and saying that reality is probably right in the middle of this debate. That being, Flynn has been a good backup QB, with pretty underwhelming physical skills (I didn't say bad) by starting QB standards, who probably has the ceiling of a low end starting QB. Does this make him terrible? No. Does this make him the GOAT? No.

So, really the question is, how do you think other teams view Flynn? I think if some of you take the time to look at what the Chiefs are looking at, you might get a more grounded version of what Flynn truly is. This time last year, would you want to give GB a 2nd rounder for Flynn? My honest answer is no. I wouldn't mind taking a shot with a 5th rounder.
 

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