The Jaguars makes a lot of sense.
Maybe for Cecil Shorts and their 3rd round pick.....

There's also the Jets perhaps.

or perhaps will Flynn play next year at all?

joeshaney wrote:The Jaguars makes a lot of sense.
Maybe for Cecil Shorts and their 3rd round pick.....

There's also the Jets perhaps.

You may not be able to get a third round pick at all for Flynn, and certainly not combined with a quality player.

KC. We trade second round picks and then select Margus Hunt to go along with our first round selection, Cordarrelle Patterson.

Jets

hawktawk wrote:KC. We trade second round picks and then select Margus Hunt to go along with our first round selection, Cordarrelle Patterson.

Patterson has shot up draft rankings as of late.. No chance he's still around at 25.. We'd have to move wayyy up.

KC, Jags

Patriots. That brady kid is a bust and was a waste of a pick.

He will go wherever Wilson goes.

Obviously there's a chance he stays.....but if he leaves.....

And I could understand a 3rd plus a quality player being thought of as a bit much, but at the same time quarterback is by fa the most important and difficult position to fill.
If Gus Bradley likes Flynn enough to trade for him than he would also be a shoe in to start.

A third round pick is the minimum I see us giving him away for and I could see a player, maybe not as good as shorts, coming as well.

Jaguars are getting Tebow.
Cardinals are getting Mike Glennon from NC State
KC is going to get Flynn. We better get one of their studs.

joeseahawks wrote:Jaguars are getting Tebow.
Cardinals are getting Mike Glennon from NC State
KC is going to get Flynn. We better get one of their studs.

Uh, why?

Andy Reid rips people off with backup QBs, not the other way around. He's not going to give up an elite player for Matt freaking Flynn.

lol We are not getting anything higher than a 4th for Flynn, book that, and we sure aren't getting a player for him.

pinksheets wrote:

joeseahawks wrote:Jaguars are getting Tebow.
Cardinals are getting Mike Glennon from NC State
KC is going to get Flynn. We better get one of their studs.

Uh, why?

Andy Reid rips people off with backup QBs, not the other way around. He's not going to give up an elite player for Matt freaking Flynn.

I agree with you, however, it sounds like you are undervaluing Flynn.
The guys a good, starting caliber quarterback. I don't expect us to get a first round pick or likely even a second. Nonetheless, for any of you who think he won't be targeted by teams in need of a qb, you are blinded by Russell Wilson's success.

Matt Flynn is a good QB plain and simple. He's not a worthless asset as some of you seem to assume. He will either be in Seattle next year or net us something of value.

joeshaney wrote:

pinksheets wrote:

joeseahawks wrote:Jaguars are getting Tebow.
Cardinals are getting Mike Glennon from NC State
KC is going to get Flynn. We better get one of their studs.

Uh, why?

Andy Reid rips people off with backup QBs, not the other way around. He's not going to give up an elite player for Matt freaking Flynn.

I agree with you, however, it sounds like you are undervaluing Flynn.
The guys a good, starting caliber quarterback. I don't expect us to get a first round pick or likely even a second. Nonetheless, for any of you who think he won't be targeted by teams in need of a qb, you are blinded by Russell Wilson's success.

Matt Flynn is a good QB plain and simple. He's not a worthless asset as some of you seem to assume. He will either be in Seattle next year or net us something of value.

When has Matt Flynn proven that he's a good, starting caliber quarterback? He had his 2 big games in GB, then played some preseason games here. I don't know when it was established that Flynn is a proven starting QB in this league, let alone a good one. At this point we're just declaring what we hoped Matt Flynn to be when we signed him/before Russell was in the picture as reality, when we never got to that point.

You really think Brady Quinn and Matt Cassell will flourish under Reid? This is a win now league. You win now or you need to look for another job. KC needs a QB who is ready to play. I think Flynn is readier to play than the other choices they have. KC will need to find a QB or at the minimum ... create some serious competition. Flynn is the best asset on the market. Not sure what he will cost, but I can imagine some veteran wanting to walk and get a chance to win.

pinksheets wrote:

joeseahawks wrote:Jaguars are getting Tebow.
Cardinals are getting Mike Glennon from NC State
KC is going to get Flynn. We better get one of their studs.

Uh, why?

Andy Reid rips people off with backup QBs, not the other way around. He's not going to give up an elite player for Matt freaking Flynn.

If your asking me if Matt Flynn has won a ton of NFL games or played a full season the easy answer is no.
What has he proved. Every opportunity he's been given he's performed better than good. Whether we are talking about college or pros.

In the event that Gus Bradley targets Matt Flynn, it would be pretty obviously due to the fact that (despite lack of in game experience) he has proved his value as a starting QB. Bradley knows all he could know about Matt. He is a smart and extremely accurate quarterback he would relish the opportunity to start.

Don't jump to conclusions just because Russell Wilson beat him to the punch this year. That's flat out retarded. Wilson is a special, special player who beat and has beaten all odds stacked against him. Flynn is a far superior option than anything the Jaguars will be able to get on their roster, through free agency, or through the draft.

Don't jump to the conclusion that just because the guy who beat him out is really good, that he himself must be at least close to really good.

He's still a guy, who is now 28, who has not proven that he can be a starter in this league. Maybe someone wants to give him a shot to prove it, but that's where he is. We're overstating his value anytime we talk about him being "proven", because he isn't. He's a guy that had shown enough in his 2 starts to get a shot, he didn't win on that shot, now we'll see if anybody else is willing to give him another shot, but that doesn't usually mean a high pick. Somebody like Reid will probably be more inclined to go after Foles in Philly if Kelly wants nothing to do with him, or if he doesn't want a QB at 1.1, look at a guy in the 2nd or 3rd. There is no sure thing guy in this draft, but there is depth in terms of prospects, and these our kids that the league will see as having higher upside most likely. There isn't any evidence to suggest, yet, that people in the NFL view Matt Flynn as a starter. I find it unlikely, unless a team makes a bonehead move, that they're going to give up a high pick or "stud" player for an unproven 28 year old career backup. A mid to late-round pick and losing Flynn's cap space is a big win for us and a semi-realistic goal.

Neither me nor you know how good he really is.....
But I assure you that Bradley knows.
He will either be a Seattle Seahawk next year or he will be moved to a team who values him as more than a backup. In such a scenario he will net us value.

I'm not saying that I am sure he is going to be a great quarterback. However, if he is traded it will be because someone values him as such.

"You're undervaluing Flynn!"

"No, you're overvaluing him!"

"Shut up!"

"No, you shut up!"

I think it's hilarious how this argument has morphed over the last year. I most definitely side with those who say certain fans are massively overvaluing Flynn. And I really don't think too many are saying he's a bum. Just overly sensitive folks taking "he's not amazing" comments way too harsh.

I disagree that any team trading for him is going to do so because they think he's amazing and the man. We acquired him last year while at the same time drafting a rookie that we liked a lot with a decently high pick. I could most certainly see another team do the same. Acquire Flynn as a low risk starter for the interim while also drafting a rookie with a 2nd or 3rd rounder to develop. Wouldn't be surprised at all to see that happen.

Not sure how much Bradley knows about Matt being a good QB. He wasn't in the QB room with him so assuming he knows a lot about Flynn or has a good relationship with him is just conjecture. Maybe the defensive coaches got a chance to go against him in scrimmages or walk through but I think if it was Bevell in Jacksonville you could make a stronger case that he was intimate with Flynn.

I think he and Alex Smith would be a couple of names getting play this off-season but how hot the market is hasn't been determined yet. The 8 teams with new HCs and 5 new GMs have to get their plans together and the remaining 24 could contain some interested parties as well. I am not sure who is going to be looking. Jets look like a cap issue with dropping Sanchez. KC with Reid is a wildcard. Eagles and Kelly is yet another unknown. Are the Jags completely done with Gabbert or will the new regime consider him fixable? Cards, doubt it. Is there a starter in trouble like Freeman?

SeaTown81 wrote:"You're undervaluing Flynn!"

"No, you're overvaluing him!"

"Shut up!"

"No, you shut up!"

I think it's hilarious how this argument has morphed over the last year. I most definitely side with those who say certain fans are massively overvaluing Flynn. And I really don't think too many are saying he's a bum. Just overly sensitive folks taking "he's not amazing" comments way too harsh.

I disagree that any team trading for him is going to do so because they think he's amazing and the man. We acquired him last year while at the same time drafting a rookie that we liked a lot with a decently high pick. I could most certainly see another team do the same. Acquire Flynn as a low risk starter for the interim while also drafting a rookie with a 2nd or 3rd rounder to develop. Wouldn't be surprised at all to see that happen.

Here's the thing. Your right. Teams may be interested in doing just what you say. The Seahawks, however, will not be interested in trading with such teams and would just as well hang on to him. The only benefit to trading him would be to get in return a higher value to our team than Flynn currently provides. In other words Flynn remains in Seattle unless some teams values him as a starter. Its certainly possible that no team will. If a team does value Flynn as a starter, however, why would they have a hesitation moving a 3rd round pick in order to fill the most important position on their team.

Example, though surely not the best one..... Charlie Whitehirst. The guy a project qb and look what we were willing to give for him. Hindsight is 20-20 and we way overpaid for this guy, but the point remains particularly if a team sees Flynn as a starter.

Once again, if no team does than he stays put.
I think there will be teams calling but we shall see.

[quote="drdiags"]Not sure how much Bradley knows about Matt being a good QB. He wasn't in the QB room with him so assuming he knows a lot about Flynn or has a good relationship with him is just conjecture. Maybe the defensive coaches got a chance to go against him in scrimmages or walk through but I think if it was Bevell in Jacksonville you could make a stronger case that he was intimate with Flynn.

I think he and Alex Smith would be a couple of names getting play this off-season but how hot the market is hasn't been determined yet. The 8 teams with new HCs and 5 new GMs have to get their plans together and the remaining 24 could contain some interested parties as well. I am not sure who is going to be looking. Jets look like a cap issue with dropping Sanchez. KC with Reid is a wildcard. Eagles and Kelly is yet another unknown. Are the Jags completely done with Gabbert or will the new regime consider him fixale? Cards, doubt it. Is there a starter in trouble like Fr

Bradley's defense went up against Flynn in practice daily and he is sure to have and likely still have access to whatever evaluations of Flynn that are relevant. Does this mean that Bradley is a shoe in to be drooling over Flynn? No, but he will certainly have a solid basis for determining the guys value. Blaine Gabbert, on the other hand, is a worthless bum. Let's not get blinded by his draft status and recognize the in his many opportunities to produce hes proven himself to be a significantly worse option than even Henne.

I to believe Flynn is the best FA option this off season and there is definitely a much better market for his services but I still don't know how hot a commodity he will be, there are just to many factors that come into it.

KC seems like a very logical location but they have the #1 overall pick and I believe they will take Barkley. Now do they expect him to come in and start immediately? I don't know and even if they don't are they going to pony up draft picks for Flynn who would be seen as a stop gap QB while Barkley learns. Even if they like the idea of Flynn, how much is it worth for a stop gap? I could definitely see KC sticking with Cassell for a couple of reasons. Reid has had much success developing QB's and he might think he can still get the most out of Cassell. They may just want to open up a competition between Cassell and Barkley. A new coach is also going to want as much draft ammo as possible so they very well could avoid sending picks away even if they think Flynn is superior. Reid will have several years before he is expected to make that a top shelf franchise so while I am sure he would love to win now, if he had Barkley in the wings he likely would not feel a severe amount of pressure.

Jacksonville is another can of worms with Gabbert but is it to soon to give up on him? With the second overall pick and a QB needy team, I think Geno Smith lands there and then you are asking some of the same questions as KC. Not to mention if they decide to go away from Gabert, that puts another QB into the FA equation.

What I could see happening is the Jags and Seahawks play a little negotiations game (even if they are not really interested) to try and create/drive up a market for Flynn.

Raiders are heavily invested in Palmer and while you and I think he sucks (sorry DramaHawk) he still puts up huge numbers and often shows flashes of elite potential (and then he brain farts for another pick six of course) so will the Raiders move on? Maybe they could see a competition between Palmer and Flynn but that means giving up picks to a team that has squandered for to many and appears to be changing there philosophy about draft picks. I would be surprised if they went away from Palmer unless they want to put him on the market and then again you have more FA competition.

Philly? Uhm maybe but who knows. It makes sense they will move away from Vick but again that is another FA QB. They can't be completely disappointed in Foles but I could see a potential market for a QB competition between Flynn and Foles.

Cleveland? Weeden hasn't been a complete bust but could definitely see the possibility of an upgrade. He is going to be 29 (if not already) so bringing in another 28 year old would be kind of odd. They have to be thinking going young makes more sense but where do they find young? It's a possibility but again I don't see a high priority.

Arizona really seems to me like it could be a very good fit but would we trade him to a division rival? I think Flynn would be a huge upgrade over Kolb as he has all the attributes Kolb has but is much better at getting the ball out quickly and IMO is much better at reading defenses. It would be a heavy investment for AZ but with the 7th pick in the draft unless they pay through the nose to move up, the QB options are pretty slim pickens. When you consider Kolb's injury history and Fitzgerald's age I could see them making a push for Flynn and that is where the Jacksonville trade talks could really help out.

Buffalo is definitely a possibility but we just fleeced them for a draft pick for Tarvaris Jackson and he didn't even show enough to be activated for a single game last year. We also fleeced them a couple years prior for Lynch. I would think they would become a little Leary of dealing with Pete and John but who knows, it is Buffalo after all.

NY Jets? Uhg, who knows what that team will do. They are strapped pretty heavily to Sanchez but they definitely need to make a move however they are still getting over the burn of Tebow so they may want to be careful. I do think Flynn would be a huge upgrade over Dirty Sanchez but I don't know if the Jets are ready to jump back into the high profile life of the NFL QB market. The bright side is that Ryan maybe feeling pressure to do something and they don't have a ton of other options. Bringing in Flynn to compete with Sanchez could be as low profile a move as they could make and if Flynn performs the way I believe he would, Ryan would look like the franchise hero. Although Ryan would be under scrutiny for bringing in any QB to compete as he just failed miserably at just that last year.

Vikings? Maybe but IMO unlikely. To early to move on from Ponder who reminds me alot of Palmer in his ability to look great one minute and completely shit the bed the next. Flynn with AP though would put them right on the map and in the the thick of NFL talks but they did make the playoffs this year so they may already believe they are there. Do they see Ponder as part of the problem? If not then they should. He is easily upgraded and IMO would benefit from some time on the bench watch a QB that can actually read defenses and distribute the ball properly.

I think the entire NFL knows how in love Pete and John were with Wilson and with how he performed this year I think they understand why so I doubt anyone (with half a brain) is looking at Flynn and saying he must suck to lose to a short third round rookie. I also think GM's are smart enough to look beyond the preseason stats and see why Flynn's numbers looked so poor. In reality what you wanted to see from Flynn was would his ability to process the game be diminished without all the weapons he had in GB and what you seen him do in preseason was make good throws all over the field, including some very clutch perfectly thrown third down conversions and potential TD's if not for the worst collective performance ever put on but an NFL receiver crew. He showed he could step into a new system and acclimate nearly immediately and that his skill set is in fact transferable. It was obvious his ability to read defenses was on par with quality NFL caliber QB's and he proved to anyone with a question that his arm strength myth was exactly that, a myth. He showed excellent pocket presence and good speed when he did scramble along with very good awareness of his surroundings.

I think some believe in GB all Flynn had to do was take the snap, step back and throw it and his receivers would do the rest but even in a statistically poor preseason he showed he was much more to blame for the success of the GB offense than some want to give him credit for and in fact if paired up with a decent team could likely be the difference of being a playoff team or a pretender.

Seattle.

Maybe the Jets, they just got our cap guy as there new GM. Maybe they'll give us Wilkerson for him

Left End
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of Seattle's bench.

Mthete are not any first round qbs IMO. Surely a desperate team will reach, butcall me crazy. Matt Flynn w8th Jones drew, blackman, shorts, and Lewis could work well. Bradley will build the defense through the draft.

since Flynn seems to be an ok guy in the locker room, even though he didn't win the starting QB position with the Hawks, there is every chance he stays a Hawk,...the Hawks will move him if they get a decent offer, but he's not being a troubled malcontent, so he may well remain here,...

Largent80 wrote:Seattle.

I'm with you here Rob, and only plays sparingly or when we need to win a coin toss.

BTW it seems moves like that are Pete's trying to involve Flynn with the team whereever he can. A good idea.

I'd like Flynn here, but I'd love to bundle him up with our 1st and maybe something more to get the Jag's 1st.

I think Flynn had conditional round pick written all over him. I doubt any team at the top of the draft will be interested as they can draft a QB. I think the most likely scenario may see him traded after the draft so whichever team wasn't able to satisfactorily get it's QB (and depending on Seattle's ability to get a new backup).

Two things are going to screw the Seahawks and Flynn over though - Alex Smith's availability and the fact that I doubt Seattle with trade him to Arizona.

Largent80 wrote:Seattle.

bingo

RichNhansom wrote:I to believe Flynn is the best FA option this off season and there is definitely a much better market for his services but I still don't know how hot a commodity he will be, there are just to many factors that come into it.

First off, Flynn isn't a FA option for teams. It would require a trade for a team to acquire him, or he'd have to be cut for teams to be able to bring him in and offer him a deal. And Flynn's not even the best TRADE option this offseason. Not with Alex Smith eating up even more cap room in SF than Flynn's taking up in Seattle.

What's more, Smith is a more attractive option for teams because he's got much more starting experience than Flynn. His 2011/2012 season numbers (over the course of 25 games) will be far more attractive to teams than Flynn's 2 starts from 2010/2011. Smith racked up a 64% completion percentage, 4881 yards, 30 TDs, and 10 INTs over that stretch. And he's the same age as Flynn. Smith looks the part of a franchise QB (even if it's just a game manager type of QB) far more than Flynn does right now.

Volsung covered all the bases here. The only thing I'll say is this - next year there are quite a few QB needy teams and not a whole lot in the way of great looking draft QB prospects. KC and Jax are almost certainly going QB in the draft. The Jets need a QB, The Bills might be in the market. The Cards need a QB, don't be surprised to see Dallas test the waters, maybe even Philly. Cleveland is another possiblity. Even oakland.

Point is, a LOT of teams will be looking at upgrading at QB next season, and that makes it a sellers market. i think we trade Flynn, but I think a 3rd rounder is probably the most we could realistically hope for, and even that is a bit on the high side. I think PC and JS would jump at a 4th to dump Flynn's salary.

But Volungshawk which Alex Smith are you going to get because there is alot more poor stats on him than good. If my GM expects those good numbers without the best O-line in football, Crabtree, Davis, Gore and a defense that allows you to be patient, I want my GM fired. Ignore all the stats and ask if he passes the eyeball test.

Again I disagree with you about Smith and Flynn and I am willing to make a sig bet if you like that Flynn will dramatically out perform Alex Smith next year and the reason I believe that is we have seen Smith perform poorly but even in a new system woth all new team mates we have yet to see Flynn play as poorly as Smith has the majority of his career.

RichNhansom wrote:But Volungshawk which Alex Smith are you going to get because there is alot more poor stats on him than good. If my GM expects those good numbers without the best O-line in football, Crabtree, Davis, Gore and a defense that allows you to be patient, I want my GM fired. Ignore all the stats and ask if he passes the eyeball test.

Again I disagree with you about Smith and Flynn and I am willing to make a sig bet if you like that Flynn will dramatically out perform Alex Smith next year and the reason I believe that is we have seen Smith perform poorly but even in a new system woth all new team mates we have yet to see Flynn play as poorly as Smith has the majority of his career.

You've missed the point. Volsung is talking about perceived value to other teams. every team in the NFL would give up more for Alex Smith than they would for Matt Flynn. It's an indisputable fact. Doesn't matter who will perform better next season as a starter.

RichNhansom wrote:But Volungshawk which Alex Smith are you going to get because there is alot more poor stats on him than good. If my GM expects those good numbers without the best O-line in football, Crabtree, Davis, Gore and a defense that allows you to be patient, I want my GM fired. Ignore all the stats and ask if he passes the eyeball test.

Again I disagree with you about Smith and Flynn and I am willing to make a sig bet if you like that Flynn will dramatically out perform Alex Smith next year and the reason I believe that is we have seen Smith perform poorly but even in a new system woth all new team mates we have yet to see Flynn play as poorly as Smith has the majority of his career.

That's because in a new system, we have yet to see Flynn play at all, really. You don't judge stats based on preseason and mop up duty.

I know we got in a pretty fun habit here of bashing Alex Smith, but the fact of the matter is that he has a winning record against us as a starter and he's put up some pretty good performances against us. He's not a scrub QB.

And remember how earlier this week many of us were concerned about Bevell leaving because we felt it would be good for Wilson's continued development to keep the same OC? Smith had a different OC every single year in his first 7 years, and had to readjust to multiple different systems as a result. Once there was some consistency in the coaching staff, Smith played pretty damn well.

And you can talk about how Smith's stats were only reflective of a great O-line and Davis/Crabtree, but you have to apply that same caveat to Flynn's TWO performances in Green Bay. Sure, really nice games playing with an offensive cast that ranked in the top 10 in points scored and in yards gained every single season from 2007-2011. That wasn't all just Favre/Rodgers. It's the system and all the offensive pieces in it. Flynn benefited from that just as much as Smith benefited from anything he had in SF, if not more.

I guess we'll agree to disagree. I think you can look at the preseason games and easily extrapolate expected results based on all the throws, defensive reads, speed of getting the ball out and adjusting for horrific timing of key drops. Only if you discredit Flynn for receiver drops can you grade him poorly but the ball in 90+% was put were not only it should have been caught but was placed in a leading position that positively impacts YAC.

I honestly believe Flynn has better value than Smith and I would be surprised if the Niners will garner as much as Seattle will for each. Neither are UFA's and they're contracts are not hat dissimilar so we will see how things play out. I know I would be worried about my FO if they viewed Smith as viable starter and how each gets treated as far as traded or released as well as how each performs next year is my exact point.

If I am playing GM and need a QB to start for me next year, I am willing to invest more for Flynn than Smith. There are plenty of dumb GM's out there or we wouldn't have got anything for Jackson but I think the smart ones will actually look at the performances rather than the stats and will see more potential in Flynn.

RichNhansom wrote:I guess we'll agree to disagree. I think you can look at the preseason games and easily extrapolate expected results based on all the throws, defensive reads, speed of getting the ball out and adjusting for horrific timing of key drops. Only if you discredit Flynn for receiver drops can you grade him poorly but the ball in 90+% was put were not only it should have been caught but was placed in a leading position that positively impacts YAC.

I honestly believe Flynn has better value than Smith and I would be surprised if the Niners will garner as much as Seattle will for each. Neither are UFA's and they're contracts are not hat dissimilar so we will see how things play out. I know I would be worried about my FO if they viewed Smith as viable starter and how each gets treated as far as traded or released as well as how each performs next year is my exact point.

If I am playing GM and need a QB to start for me next year, I am willing to invest more for Flynn than Smith. There are plenty of dumb GM's out there or we wouldn't have got anything for Jackson but I think the smart ones will actually look at the performances rather than the stats and will see more potential in Flynn.

Yeah, we'll just disagree then. Saying you'd be "worried about your FO if they viewed Smith as a viable starter" is ridiculous, imo, especially when compared with your unwavering support for Flynn. Flynn has not come close to proving himself as much as Smith has. All you're banking on with Flynn is potential, whereas Smith has proven that he can manage a game very well for you, and make some plays when necessary. All of 2011 and half of 2012 PROVE that for Smith. He's got tons more experience than Flynn does no matter how you measure it, and that matters to the FO types.

In 2011, Smith started all season long for a team that played deep into the postseason and played well. He was very much a game manager, but he showed flashes of being able to air it out when necessary (see the 299-yard, 3 TD, 0 INT performance against the Saints in the playoffs). In 2012, he was showing even greater accuracy, and outside of a bad game against the Giants, protected the ball well. Half of his first 8 games generated a passer rating above 100, and his Week 8 game against the Cardinals was one of the best passer performances of any QB in the league all season long. And he didn't lose his job because he played poorly... he lost it due to injury.

Smith's got 80 regular season games under his belt, and he's posted very, very good performances in at least a quarter of them. Of his top 20 games (all of which have a passer rating above 98), 13 of them have come in the last 2 seasons. That's what a FO will look at when considering Smith. They're not going to focus on his struggles in '05 or '06. His 2 postseason games last year were also strong performances.

Honestly, I don't see how you can be such a huge Flynn fanboy and yet dismiss Smith so readily. There is zero evidence of how Flynn will perform when a team can prepare for him as the starter. There's zero evidence for how he will perform when faced with a strong defense. There is zero evidence of how he will perform when given the keys to an offense that isn't among the very best in the league. In other words, Flynn remains an unknown quantity as a potential starting QB. Smith, on the other hand, is more of a known quantity - he's a game manager who avoids turnovers for the most part, with the potential to put up decent numbers, even against strong defenses. Smith isn't the inspirational leader type, but neither is Flynn.

Smith is so good that his coach replaced him mid season for a completely unknown. Not a guy with a couple amazing performances. He went with the unknown based off extremely limited information and in the middle of a super bowl run. You seem to have forgotten that or even question why a coach would go with the less experience. It is a reason why I think others will view Smith similarly.

You can call me fan boy but not without acknowledging that your just a hater. I'll take mine if you take yours.

RichNhansom wrote:Smith is so good that his coach replaced him mid season for a completely unknown. Not a guy with a couple amazing performances. He went with the unknown based off extremely limited information and in the middle of a super bowl run. You seem to have forgotten that or even question why a coach would go with the less experience. It is a reason why I think others will view Smith similarly.

You can call me fan boy but not without acknowledging that your just a hater. I'll take mine if you take yours.

Couldn't agree more. Smith certainly has a more expansive resume, but what does it really say.
A team knows exactly what they are getting with Smith. A inconsistent, mediocre quarterback who hasn't done anything impressive.

Flynn's mystery is definitely the issue, but that is exactly why I see him going to the Jaguars.
If Gus Bradley does not see Flynn as a starting QB in the league, we could hang on to him knowing Flynn's market value is not worth moving him.
If Gus Bradley does like him to start he will have no problem sending a 3rd round pick at the least.

In Jacksonville, Flynn would have a decent set of weapons to work with in Jones-Drew, Blackmon, Shorts, and Bennett. With a little help on their offensive line I think it'd be rather fun to see what kind of success Flynn would have. This way, Bradley and Jacksonville could shift their attention on their biggest problem (defense).

joeshaney wrote:Bradley's defense went up against Flynn in practice daily and he is sure to have and likely still have access to whatever evaluations of Flynn that are relevant. Does this mean that Bradley is a shoe in to be drooling over Flynn? No, but he will certainly have a solid basis for determining the guys value. Blaine Gabbert, on the other hand, is a worthless bum. Let's not get blinded by his draft status and recognize the in his many opportunities to produce hes proven himself to be a significantly worse option than even Henne.

You are making assumptions in relationship to how the Jags view Gabbert. Is the owner willing to eat the investment or will he insist on giving Gabbert another chance, with competition from Henne or some mid-level veteran to provide competition? Not blinded to draft status but it isn't my money to totally write off the guy. Would Flynn want to leave one situation for another with no guarantees of starting? He doesn't have much say but he has some.

Yep, the 1's vs the 1's was done quite a bit during the regular season practice but there were times Flynn practiced against the 1's on defense. Portis was here for awhile, running scout team against the 1's. Yep, Flynn's evaluation was available to Bradley. Does Bradley have enough info to make Flynn his first major acquisition and would Caldwell buy in?

drdiags wrote:

joeshaney wrote:Bradley's defense went up against Flynn in practice daily and he is sure to have and likely still have access to whatever evaluations of Flynn that are relevant. Does this mean that Bradley is a shoe in to be drooling over Flynn? No, but he will certainly have a solid basis for determining the guys value. Blaine Gabbert, on the other hand, is a worthless bum. Let's not get blinded by his draft status and recognize the in his many opportunities to produce hes proven himself to be a significantly worse option than even Henne.

You are making assumptions in relationship to how the Jags view Gabbert. Is the owner willing to eat the investment or will he insist on giving Gabbert another chance, with competition from Henne or some mid-level veteran to provide competition? Not blinded to draft status but it isn't my money to totally write off the guy. Would Flynn want to leave one situation for another with no guarantees of starting? He doesn't have much say but he has some.

Yep, the 1's vs the 1's was done quite a bit during the regular season practice but there were times Flynn practiced against the 1's on defense. Portis was here for awhile, running scout team against the 1's. Yep, Flynn's evaluation was available to Bradley. Does Bradley have enough info to make Flynn his first major acquisition and would Caldwell buy in?

I am definitely making an assumption that they are done with Gabbert. I am doing so for two reasons. One, Gabbert is dreadful. Two, after hiring a new coach you must allow him to operate the team the ways he sees will bring the team the most success. This I am thoroughly confident will not involve Blaine stinkin' Gabbert.

However, though I am confident Gabbert is finished I am not assuming that Gus Bradley will make Flynn his starting quarterback. I am only suggesting that Bradley may or may not be interested. If he is interested it would certainly be because he sees Flynn as a starter (and thus worth decent trade value as staring qbs are the most valuable asset a team could have). If he is NOT interested than it provides strong indication that Flynn will not likely be viewed as anything more than a backup and therefore not be worth trading (as the return would be worth less than what we'd be losing - a solid backup).

If there were some quality quarterback prospects in the draft the situation would be even more unclear. However, I don't see the Jaguars burning such a high pick on an unworthy QB out of desperation when there is much better value on defense. I am pretty confident that Bradley will be looking for defensive linemen and possibly secondary help early in the draft.

This is merely my opinion and only worth as much the next guys.

joeshaney wrote:

RichNhansom wrote:Smith is so good that his coach replaced him mid season for a completely unknown. Not a guy with a couple amazing performances. He went with the unknown based off extremely limited information and in the middle of a super bowl run. You seem to have forgotten that or even question why a coach would go with the less experience. It is a reason why I think others will view Smith similarly.

You can call me fan boy but not without acknowledging that your just a hater. I'll take mine if you take yours.

Couldn't agree more. Smith certainly has a more expansive resume, but what does it really say.
A team knows exactly what they are getting with Smith. A inconsistent, mediocre quarterback who hasn't done anything impressive.

Flynn's mystery is definitely the issue, but that is exactly why I see him going to the Jaguars.
If Gus Bradley does not see Flynn as a starting QB in the league, we could hang on to him knowing Flynn's market value is not worth moving him.
If Gus Bradley does like him to start he will have no problem sending a 3rd round pick at the least.

In Jacksonville, Flynn would have a decent set of weapons to work with in Jones-Drew, Blackmon, Shorts, and Bennett. With a little help on their offensive line I think it'd be rather fun to see what kind of success Flynn would have. This way, Bradley and Jacksonville could shift their attention on their biggest problem (defense).

Some really good points, except this one, which is mixed:
"A team knows exactly what they are getting with Smith. A inconsistent, mediocre quarterback who hasn't done anything impressive."

It's a BAD CALL: New Orleans playoff game, last year, Alex Smith was the only reason the 49er's made it to the NFC Championship game, leading the team to 2 TDs in the last 2:11. Do you really think his performance in that game wasn't impressive? Smith led the 49ers to a 13-3 record, and home field advantage. Smith played well enough in the NFC championship game for SF to be in the Super Bowl. The only reason they weren't was Kyle Williams 2 lost fumbles on punts, including one with unbelievably bad timing, that gifted the game to the Giants. Smith played well enough to win against an ELITE Giants defense. Brady didn't have the greatest game against that defense in the Super Bowl...

It's a GOOD CALL: Yeah, Smith sucked against the Giants in the NFC Championship game, 12-26, and just not putting enough points on the board. It would have been impressive if Smith had lit them up for 300 yards and SF gotten a win by 2 TDs.

Bottom line, Flynn and Smith are both above-average NFL starting QBs. If I'm a GM looking for a QB that can get my team to the playoffs, it's almost a tossup. I like Flynn better as a pocket passer, think he's better at reading defenses, and running an up-tempo, no-huddle type of offense. (So maybe Chip Kelly in Philly will be interested). On the other hand, I like Smith's mobility, athleticism, and escapability a little better, and maybe with more continuity with the same coordinator, Smith can become more consistent as a passer. I also have to think Smith will be that much hungrier, willing to work hard, put in the study, having been cast aside. On the downside, if Harbaugh didn't buy into Smith, what is it that Harbaugh knows about Smith? The same stuff that Harbaugh knew about Sherman? (In which case Smith becomes the obvious choice) or is Harbaugh correct in his assessment of Smith's "limitations"? Anyway, as a GM of an also-ran who needs a QB, I probably go for Flynn over Smith by just a tiny margin, but I'm happy if I can get either one.

joeshaney wrote:
This is merely my opinion and only worth as much the next guys.

Same here. Not assuming I am correct, just discussing various angles. Not saying you are wrong, just responding to you after you raised some questions/counter points about my post. I have no stake in this discussion. Just thinking out loud.

RichNhansom wrote:Smith is so good that his coach replaced him mid season for a completely unknown. Not a guy with a couple amazing performances. He went with the unknown based off extremely limited information and in the middle of a super bowl run. You seem to have forgotten that or even question why a coach would go with the less experience. It is a reason why I think others will view Smith similarly.

You can call me fan boy but not without acknowledging that your just a hater. I'll take mine if you take yours.

http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/ ... ssion.html

Smith had a concussion and wasn't cleared to play, man. He was out for two weeks, and Kaepernick came in and played really well, giving the 49ers offense an element it didn't have with Smith. Harbaugh chose to stick with the new guy (or the "hot hand" or whatever you want to call it), and he got a lot of flack over it - especially after the subpar performance Kaepernick put on against the Seahawks.

Quit trying to paint it like Smith was being ineffective and just got pulled for Kaepernick.

drdiags wrote:

joeshaney wrote:
This is merely my opinion and only worth as much the next guys.

Same here. Not assuming I am correct, just discussing various angles. Not saying you are wrong, just responding to you after you raised some questions/counter points about my post. I have no stake in this discussion. Just thinking out loud.

Good conversation friend.
It is quite likely Flynn isn't traded at all. If so, I just cant see a better fit than with the Jags.
Alex Smith, on the other hand, is extremely difficult to imagine with the 9ers and all of their cap issues next year.

He would also be a goo fit in Jacksonville and who Bradley targets should provide some conclusion to who the better option is.

volsunghawk wrote:

RichNhansom wrote:Smith is so good that his coach replaced him mid season for a completely unknown. Not a guy with a couple amazing performances. He went with the unknown based off extremely limited information and in the middle of a super bowl run. You seem to have forgotten that or even question why a coach would go with the less experience. It is a reason why I think others will view Smith similarly.

You can call me fan boy but not without acknowledging that your just a hater. I'll take mine if you take yours.

http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/ ... ssion.html

Smith had a concussion and wasn't cleared to play, man. He was out for two weeks, and Kaepernick came in and played really well, giving the 49ers offense an element it didn't have with Smith. Harbaugh chose to stick with the new guy (or the "hot hand" or whatever you want to call it), and he got a lot of flack over it - especially after the subpar performance Kaepernick put on against the Seahawks.

Quit trying to paint it like Smith was being ineffective and just got pulled for Kaepernick.

By the same logic Flynn got signed to a pretty decent contract but got REPLACED PRESEASON BY A COMPLETE UNKNOWN.

If someone is trading for Smith or Flynn, I don't think they're thinking they're getting a franchise QB in return, so set your expectations for the price accordingly. Further, Smith is still far more proven. Hold his early seasons against him, fine, but he also quarterbacked a 13-3 team last year and even singlehandedly won a playoff game. People are overrating Flynn and underrating every other available QB whether that be by FA, trade, or the draft class, I assume because it supports their desire to get some kind of killer deal for Flynn.

Joeshaney, I don't know that we will get a third, I think that is on the high side because there are to many variables surrounding the position?. I did a wright up on page two about some of thr variables. I do believe if we were capable of getting anything for Jackson then trading Flynn should be no problem. I just don't know how much he will actually garner.