Clearly. But what I'm saying is, if teams are thinking this way causing him to fall to 3rd round or beyond, maybe its worth considering. No way in hell id want him in 1st round.

I just don't see a need for him in the first 2 days. I expect us to draft some LB cover, but no earlier than round 4. first 3 rounds will be D-line and WR, most likely.

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FrankerZ FrankerZ FrankerZ FrankerZ FrankerZ FrankerZ FrankerZ FrankerZ

Te'o has claimed talking to her on the phone and stories have been written about them meeting in person. The person who set it up is a close friend of Te'o's. For argument's sake, let's say Te'o really is innocent. That would mean that the perp (who is male) had to bring in a girl act the part on the phone for a 4 year period as part of this scheme (and this is assuming that Te'o is telling the truth about the phone calls, which he may not be), and it would also mean that Te'o didn't bat an eye and find anything suspicious when reports came out the last few years talking about how he and his GF had met and spent time together, met at Stanford, etc, all of which was 100% false and he knew it, lying or not. If he really was innocent, he should have been tipped off by the false stories claiming they had met in person.

Frankly, I am amazed that ESPN is buying it.

Edit: Te'o said in his own words that he and his dad had met her in person. Now let's say that the girl was a fake, which is really reaching. But for argument's sake, it's a fake. Don't you think he would have noticed that her picture was different on facebook (the picture on facebook is of a girl who had no idea of what was going on and had never met Te'o).

Also, a teammate has now come out saying that the whole team knew it was a hoax and kept their mouths shut. Said Te'o was a great actor.

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"I believe there’s merit to the idea that once something in life becomes conventional, it’s no longer the safest path to success." -Matt Waldman
"If everyone's thinking alike, no one's thinking." -Bill Walsh

ESPN isn't buying it. They are trying to both cover their ass for not fact checking, and minimize their role in the huge push to get him a heisman. SVP today was saying that if Teo was in on it, he is a better actor than anyone in Hollywood.

Also, they are spinning it as a generational gap, where us old dudes don't understand how 20 year old kids can have internet relationships. And trying to say that at most, he is guilty of embellishing by adding the parts about actually meeting her.

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SEAHAWKS.NET. We All We Got, We All We Need

Much ado about nothing.

For all we know, he was pretending to have a girlfriend to keep people and family from passing judgement on him about it (something guys have been known to do), and when the pressure was on for people to meet her, his only option was to say she died.

Really don't care. I've met people who lie all the time about stupid stuff and it's almost always to garner attention or to avoid it. Manti is a good football player and the only issue I see is the effect of the media and fans going gonzo over it. I hope he comes out of this okay.

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Joe Vellano, DT, 6'1", 300lbs, 61 tkls 14 TFL, 6 sacks" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc_yzeVi-eU, Mike Catapano 6'4" 271
QB Jordan Rodgers 6'1" 212# 2539 Yards, 60% completion 15td/5int

SVP?

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"I believe there’s merit to the idea that once something in life becomes conventional, it’s no longer the safest path to success." -Matt Waldman
"If everyone's thinking alike, no one's thinking." -Bill Walsh

Scott Van Pelt (and Rusillo) on ESPN radio.

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SEAHAWKS.NET. We All We Got, We All We Need

This is more than a lie, though. He was trying to manipulate people's emotions, and has shown no remorse for what he's done. In fact he continues to lie saying he was the victim. He is either a ruthless attention whore or he's a mild sociopath. Maybe both. This is a big deal for draft stock. High rated players have fallen far for less. GM's view draft picks as business decisions. And when they get scared off by stuff like this, those players can get scratched off draft boards completely. Imagine if you were caught lying in a job interview. Even if you were clearly the best candidate, you probably wouldn't get the job. The NFL draft process is one giant job interview, and stuff like this matters so much, it can't be overstated.

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"I believe there’s merit to the idea that once something in life becomes conventional, it’s no longer the safest path to success." -Matt Waldman
"If everyone's thinking alike, no one's thinking." -Bill Walsh

Really? So, fabricating a scam to garner attention which then leads to a Heisman trophy nomination isn't a big deal to you? How is not letting it snowball into a 'she's dead," story better than coming clean right away that she doesn't exist? Your post boggles my mind, and I hope Te'o gets what he deserves, which is lost draft status and lost respect for the confabulation. You act like he's some sort of sad victim of powers outside his control. Liars should get what they deserve.

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My single greatest contribution to the board: "42-13" (formerly 24-14)

Neither Scottemojo nor kearly have to concoct stories of dead GF's to mask their private lives (not that there's anything wrong with that).

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@ryanadamdavis

I have a girlfriend in a different state is man code for...I don't have a girlfriend. As Eddie Izzard said, they assign levels of badness to crimes, why not lies? Saying you shagged a girl you didn't is like lying level 9, and there are WMDs in Iraq is Level 1.

Now, Teo seems to have some accomplices, and used it to fuel his Heisman run, so I am gonna say he was about level 5.

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SEAHAWKS.NET. We All We Got, We All We Need

I personally think that Kekua was dead the whole time and this is all some weird Samoan 6th Sense thing we're all witnessing.

I've already stated my opinions on Te'o. He's immature and has been known to lie. I'm sorry some have a problem with me not going into detail, but there is a time and a place for anything. I am also Mormon. We have a "code" so to speak, where we don't go talking about people's past transgressions, even if we know about them. We do it out of respect, and because we believe that people can be forgiven. This is getting religious, so I'll just say that if I knew something about somebody that they had done at some point and they had moved forward with their life then it isn't my place to "out them". So that's why I left what happened here alone completely. It isn't my job. I just stated he was immature and was known to stretch the truth and that was pretty much it. I'll stand by that.

But I'll throw another part of the Mormon culture out there, just as a devil's advocate to myself if nobody else. If young men in the LDS church aren't married by the time they are 22 or so then people start to talk and call them a menace or whatever. If they aren't actively dating LDS girls seeking out their "partner forever" then they are given all kinds of crap. It's a cultural thing. Not a religious rule. It is just the way people are, and the pressure is INTENSE. I wasn't married until 3 days before I turned 27 and my wife was 26 and we got so much crap from people that I really can't explain it.

I am sure each of you in your own culture or community have certain community or cultural things that are common and you just accept them, but if you look at them as an outside observer they seem pretty silly. I always though the "get married ASAP" thing was stupid. I waited a long time. I was in no hurry. I wanted to have at least one college degree finished, a life established, a 401k started, etc. etc. My wife was a career gal and wanted to get married earlier, but she also wanted me to establish a life first.

So.... him being a stud football player and not being married, probably felt a tremendous pressure from his family for not being engaged and married and popping out kids yet. If you look at the typical LDS kid, they are married by 23 at the absolute latest and already have a kid. My sister got married at 23 and people were giving her business for being an "old maid". Kind of weird for sure. But also, he probably had tail chasing him like crazy as the star player on a powerhouse team. How does he explain to "the guys" that he isn't going to parties and hooking up with every girl in sight, while still maintaining his standards (if he did so)? By saying, "No guys, you've got it all wrong. I have a girlfriend, and I see her during school breaks, and I am faithful to her, so I won't go to your parties and be tempted and blah blah blah."

This is an easy out for him if he has a pretend girlfriend, but is waiting to meet somebody 'real' after he finishes school and by doing so keeps the pressure off from family, others of his faith, etc.

Likely? Not really. But i've seen some similar things happen. Guys will make up excuses why they can't do certain things, because deep down they want to follow their religion's rules, but they hate to say it upfront for fear of mockery. Like the guys who just flat-out don't want to drink, it's not acceptable in their religion, and so they say, "Well, I'm allergic to alcohol" rather than, "I don't drink, because it runs counter to my beliefs."

Just another random possible take. There is actually a saying a lot of people use around here, and that is "any young man who isn't married by 22 is a menace to society." It is said tongue in cheek because supposedly Brigham Young said it a long time ago (also half tongue in cheek), but that pressure is very real. It is common in his culture AND his religion, and he's the fish out of water at a Catholic school, so maybe he set it up as a cover, because there was somebody he wanted to be with that was elsewhere (back home perhaps) and he couldn't be with her (or him... who knows???) until he had gotten his first NFL contract and could afford to get married and buy a home and so forth. Again, not saying that's the case, but having felt that pressure firsthand as a nobody, I can only imagine what the pressure would feel like dealing with that same crap and being a real somebody like Manti is. The story gets out of control, he realizes people are going to check and he kills her off hoping nobody notices. The media then runs with it and now he's really screwed and can do nothing but play along, which is something the Manti I've not known personally, but known OF and ABOUT for many many years. He is prone to not thinking things through and ends up in a stupid situation. It wouldn't be the first time and likely won't being the last. He's not a criminal. He's not a terrible guy. He's just not very smart in some ways, and he's not a real forward thinker unfortunately. Consequences seem to be new to him because he's such a terrific athlete.

Tons of great athletes get a free pass their whole life. Leonard Little killed people driving and then went ahead and enjoyed a lucrative NFL career. Don't ever tell me star athletes don't live by a different set of rules. Lawrence Taylor isn't in prison. OJ Simpson was found not guilty. This is small potatoes and the media loves a tragic story and overcoming tough odds. They are complicit.

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R.I.P. Dad. I miss you. You will never be forgotten
1/12/39 - 8/7/08

If anyone has a problem with you, its certainly not due to your lack of detail

Oh, and good post. That perspective is a lot more reasonable than him being a sociopathic liar.

ESPN just ran a new twist on the story. Seems Kekua was real, but Teo only met her one time, and actually a ex-teammate of his who played for the Cards this year, knew her really well. Also they said the players on the team new she wasn't ever his girl friend. Weird story from top to bottom, and why would someone say any of this? Manti just seems to continue to dig a hole deeper and deeper.

I meant not going into detail very early in the season when I said the kid had some issues which I've known about for a few years due to his recruiting visit at BYU. I didn't go into specifics as it wasn't my place to do so, but I have stated before that he's immature, but I like him personally and wish him success. The detail thing is something that somebody ripped me for earlier in this post and asked why I would even mention something about him without giving details. I said because I knew there were character concerns from the time he was 16 years old and sort of left it alone. Notre Dame fans liked to jump on those things and claim I was a hater of Notre Dame. My response was simply that it wasn't true, and in fact I was quite a fan of Manti Te'o and was hoping that he truly had turned the corner on his maturity and ability to be straightforward with folks. It was my hope... but maybe it wasn't the case.

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R.I.P. Dad. I miss you. You will never be forgotten
1/12/39 - 8/7/08

Would these problems (if you were the hawks GM) prevent you from drafting him at #25?

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"??? How do you know he's awful? We've seen the guy play 2 regular season games." -SoulfishHawk
"16 starts in 9 years is all you need to know." - Tsizzle
"OMFG! LOL! Are you for real?" -ivotuk

I wouldn't have drafted him at 25 before this story broke.

I think he is 2nd round talent at best. With this story? lots lower. Dude supposedly learned Dec 6 it was a fraud, but referred to her twice in the next 5 days in interviews. And didn't go to the school with his story for 20 more days.

Fishy. I would draft a criminal before I draft a bullshitter.

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SEAHAWKS.NET. We All We Got, We All We Need

Not if his ability on the field matched what we need. I don't think we need him. So I wouldn't draft him at all. But if you're saying if they looked his physical capabilities and thought he was a match, would I let his stuff from his personal life prevent me from drafting him? No. This is a league where guys like Jerramy Stevens are seemingly given a free pass. Manti is just a knucklehead that likes to be told how great he is, doesn't think ahead, and isn't totally honest with people. He's probably more down to earth and kind than about 95% of the players in the NFL who are just really buttholes. So no.... I wouldn't avoid drafting him. He's not a drug user, a murderer, a wife beater, a drunk driver, a deadbeat father, a violent gang member, or anything else. He's just kind of immature. Typical for NFL players. This is why many have their career end and their life really sucks. They've never learned to manage their own anything.

And seriously..... you'd draft somebody who had committed a CRIME over somebody who got caught up in a lie because he was embarrassed more than likely? Wow. I'd rather have the guy who felt like a fool than one who was willing to break laws. As far as I can tell... no laws were broken here. Just a kid making a really really dumb mistake.

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R.I.P. Dad. I miss you. You will never be forgotten
1/12/39 - 8/7/08

I've been considered a criminal for much of my life, Shark. Would you employ Te'o or I?

I have to hire all the time, I'd take the criminal.

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@ryanadamdavis