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 Post subject: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:23 pm 
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Effin' eff.

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Sources: #Dbacks' Justin Upton invoked his no-trade rights to reject a deal to the #Mariners. Story with @jonmorosi: http://t.co/I7RHjAk2


I don't want to talk about it. :34853_doh:


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:46 pm 
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Props to the Mariners for trying their best to try and improve. Can't make players play here if they don't wanna.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:37 pm 
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True but it's the stupidity of ownership and death of a career when someone comes here that now is what a player is looking at.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:41 pm 
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In b4 DohBoy! I'm dreading some of your guys' responses, because many of you are going to burst my bubble that this still may happen...


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:56 pm 
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Seaman wrote:
In b4 DohBoy! I'm dreading some of your guys' responses, because many of you are going to burst my bubble that this still may happen...

It might.

Shannon Drayer says it was a deal for Charlie Furbush, Stephen Pryor, Nick Franklin and one of the Big 3. She also made a good point that this is the deal that Zona decided was the best fit and the best value for them, so they're not going to want to give up on it anymore than the M's. No trade clauses tend to be more about leverage, so we'll see!

Superbowl, Sonics, and Upton. That'd be a hell of a start to the year.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:00 pm 
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wow, two relievers, Franklin, and a pitching prospect? I'd take that. Hate to give up Franklin, but in a package for Upton it's fine.

Also, a lot of players really don't want to come to Seattle for a variety of reason. If we were a great team it'd relieve some of the pressure, but many of these players are east coast or southeast guys natively.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:03 pm 
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Rosenthal doesn't like it nor does his source. Rumor is that the one of the Big 3 was Walker, which would make this deal understandably shakier for the M's and Jack Z.

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Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal
Upton rejected deal, and by doing so, one source said, "saved Jack Z's job." Package from #Mariners to #DBacks first reported by @ScottMCBS.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:06 pm 
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I hope I was clear enough... I really want this to happen! I can't remember a no trade clause waived by a power hitter headed to a pitcher's park, though. And if all those things happened, we would never forget this year for the rest of our lives! Haha I'm already not ever going to forget about RW's rookie success!!


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:23 pm 
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pinksheets wrote:
Rosenthal doesn't like it nor does his source. Rumor is that the one of the Big 3 was Walker, which would make this deal understandably shakier for the M's and Jack Z.

Quote:
Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal
Upton rejected deal, and by doing so, one source said, "saved Jack Z's job." Package from #Mariners to #DBacks first reported by @ScottMCBS.


Shakier, yes, but we'd have said that about Pineda once upon a time. I'd rather the pitcher be Paxton, but you just never know.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:41 pm 
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I would really hate to move Franklin and Walker, I am very high on those 2.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:43 pm 
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Who are the "big 3"?

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:48 pm 
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JSeahawks wrote:
Who are the "big 3"?


Hutlzen, Walker and Paxton.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:58 pm 
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Blitzer88 wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
Who are the "big 3"?


Hutlzen, Walker and Paxton.


Are those all minor league starting pitchers?

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:58 pm 
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I give zero props to the M's. no one wants to play for them due to being last place more often than not, setting records for offensive ineptitude. Why would anyone want to come here? The only way to make it happen is sign and overpay for some frontline players to show you are serious. The front office got the team into this mess not the fans.

Signing former players for a last go round the track is just to get fans in the seats. Until they M's show me a real change I won't attend games.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 7:14 pm 
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JSeahawks wrote:
Blitzer88 wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
Who are the "big 3"?


Hutlzen, Walker and Paxton.


Are those all minor league starting pitchers?


Yes they are sir.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 7:37 pm 
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Him invoking his no trade clause is just grounds for him to get something more out of the deal, In AZ's eyes the Mariners are the "best fit" for their situation.

As far as the pieces go, It hurts a little to lose Nick Franklin but he projects as a 2nd Baseman, but of course Ackley is there, and losing two relievers is not as bad as everything might think. Yes stephen Pryor is good who can throw 100mph but we also have Carter Capps who can do the same exact thing.

As for the Big 3, I keep Walker out of the 3.

Its all on Upton, AZ is basically gonna tell him, "if you want out, your going to seattle" and either he accepts or he sits in AZ and plays till he figures out his drama.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:17 pm 
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Probably a good thing this trade doesn't happen. Upton is not the bat we should trade that type of offer for. Now I understand that it was a 4 for 2 trade and we don't know who the other player was we were getting in return, but trading Walker is a tough pill to swallow. Had it been Paxton in the deal, then I'd be bummed Upton said no. But since it was Walker, thanks Upton.

I just hope the Mariners aren't trying to negotiate with Upton to get him to change his mind. Save the prospects and go after Stanton next year.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:19 pm 
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Happypuppy wrote:
I give zero props to the M's. no one wants to play for them due to being last place more often than not, setting records for offensive ineptitude. Why would anyone want to come here? The only way to make it happen is sign and overpay for some frontline players to show you are serious. The front office got the team into this mess not the fans.

Signing former players for a last go round the track is just to get fans in the seats. Until they M's show me a real change I won't attend games.

No one cares if you don't attend games. And your reasons as why the Mariners on his NTC are completely wrong.

Overpaying for players would be a horrible idea.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:36 am 
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Hawkfan77 wrote:
Probably a good thing this trade doesn't happen. Upton is not the bat we should trade that type of offer for. Now I understand that it was a 4 for 2 trade and we don't know who the other player was we were getting in return, but trading Walker is a tough pill to swallow. Had it been Paxton in the deal, then I'd be bummed Upton said no. But since it was Walker, thanks Upton.

I just hope the Mariners aren't trying to negotiate with Upton to get him to change his mind. Save the prospects and go after Stanton next year.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but who is that bat we should trade Walker for?


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:57 am 
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Sorry, but I really rather not do another Bedard trade where we are forced to watch a handful of young players blossom on another team. Walker alone could end up ridiculous. Not saying Upton would be a Bedard level bust at all. And I'm not against trading prospects. But THAT many for just one guy? No thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 4:30 am 
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Ms fans.... "I'm tired of waiting".... "wait don't trade our future to win"

We can't have it both ways. Me personally I like the deal. Gives up somedecent prospects but maintains the overall integrity of the farm (ie not trading two of the big 3) and brings in a very good hitter.

However, I'm fine waiting one more year for every name in this proposed trade to get a call up. Its taking some time but I could see this team becoming a Twins esque organization in a year or two, all home grown products. (Including taking in some of their players like Jason Kubel)

Either way Uptons choice now. The NTC is there to give Upton some leverage. While many see it as a reflection of @Mariners offensive ineptitude" he also had the Red Sox and Jays on there. Pretty good parks to hit and really good offensive teams. Not sure Upton is worth it all, but this isn't quite like the Bedard deal. Bedard was a pitcher, couldn't play everyday. Jones impact completely outshone him in the end

Just my thoughts. Atleast there is movement.. don't think we are done with this either way


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:29 am 
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SeaTown81 wrote:
Sorry, but I really rather not do another Bedard trade where we are forced to watch a handful of young players blossom on another team. Walker alone could end up ridiculous. Not saying Upton would be a Bedard level bust at all. And I'm not against trading prospects. But THAT many for just one guy? No thanks.


Just counting out the trade on the basis of number of players is a bit misleading. Adam Jones was a major-league ready outfielder with star potential and trading him was incredibly shortsighted. Nick Franklin isn't quite that strong of a prospect. Walker is the one it'd be a bummer to lose, but in return you're getting a 25-year-old outfielder with superstar potential who has already produced at the major league level and is good defensively. He has 3-4 years remaining on his contract. This is opposed to a 29-year-old (or 30 or whatever Bedard was) injury-prone pitcher with 2 years left on his contract.

The other two players are relievers - talented, yes, but the position is among the most replaceable and least valuable in baseball. The cost of losing a talented reliever is not nearly so high as losing other talented prospects.

I'm not saying you should like the trade, but if you dislike it, it's probably more accurate to dislike it because you don't want to give up Walker (I don't) or Franklin (I could go either way).

For my part, I like it but am hesitant to give up Walker. Then again, I saw what happened to Pineda for the Yankees.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:54 am 
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pinksheets wrote:
Hawkfan77 wrote:
Probably a good thing this trade doesn't happen. Upton is not the bat we should trade that type of offer for. Now I understand that it was a 4 for 2 trade and we don't know who the other player was we were getting in return, but trading Walker is a tough pill to swallow. Had it been Paxton in the deal, then I'd be bummed Upton said no. But since it was Walker, thanks Upton.

I just hope the Mariners aren't trying to negotiate with Upton to get him to change his mind. Save the prospects and go after Stanton next year.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but who is that bat we should trade Walker for?


Giancario Stanton, 23 year old OF from the Marlins. He's been in the league for 3 years and already has 93 HRs. He's an absolute stud. He's right up in there with Trout and Harper as the best young players in baseball, and IMO, he has by far the best of those 3. He's going to cost more than Upton, but in a year, in those prospects continue to develop, their value goes up as well which helps us in a trade.

I like Upton, but he's not the elite we should be going after when trading the #1 pitching prospect in baseball. If the best we can do is Upton, I'd rather stay the course and have a rotation of: Felix, Walker, Hultzen, Paxton and Maurer (extremely unlikely I know, but I can dream!)

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:57 am 
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Uncle Si wrote:
Ms fans.... "I'm tired of waiting".... "wait don't trade our future to win"

We can't have it both ways. Me personally I like the deal. Gives up somedecent prospects but maintains the overall integrity of the farm (ie not trading two of the big 3) and brings in a very good hitter.

However, I'm fine waiting one more year for every name in this proposed trade to get a call up. Its taking some time but I could see this team becoming a Twins esque organization in a year or two, all home grown products. (Including taking in some of their players like Jason Kubel)

Either way Uptons choice now. The NTC is there to give Upton some leverage. While many see it as a reflection of @Mariners offensive ineptitude" he also had the Red Sox and Jays on there. Pretty good parks to hit and really good offensive teams. Not sure Upton is worth it all, but this isn't quite like the Bedard deal. Bedard was a pitcher, couldn't play everyday. Jones impact completely outshone him in the end

Just my thoughts. Atleast there is movement.. don't think we are done with this either way

I agree, there's a time to overpay and a time to be "patient". The problem is that now is actually the time to be just a little more patient, which sounds crazy because this team hasn't won in over a decade. We have one of the best farm systems in baseball, AND our top prospects are in the advanced levels of the minors. That's the way this team will get competitive again, home grown talent. We can't overpay for players anymore (in FA or trade) like we do for every FA or like we did for Bedard.

This organization is in a good place, the 25 man roster is getting better and the young guys started to show some promise as last season ended.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Upton invokes no trade clause, rejects M's deal
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:58 pm 
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People in forums and even on 710 am keep saying players don't want to play in Seattle. The truth is POSITION players don't want to play here. Because the air down there next to the Sound is like trying to hit the ball through clam chowder. And not even that creamy nice clam chowder, but that god awful red kind. Yuck. Know what I'm sayin? And I think they'd want to come if the team wasn't so mired in crappiness. We got a bunch of high profile position players in the 00s to come here. I can't remember their names. We built that 2005 team with good free agent postion players.

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