http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/ ... ike-a-plan


NFC West is becoming a dominant conference looks like.

Yeah, rumors that Tom Heckert will join him. That's a pretty powerful combination if it happens.

Like Pehawk said, if this was 2006, I'd be worried. Reid is no longer an effective head coach.

I'm actually really sad for that franchise and their fans. The squad of players Reid had at his disposal the last 2 seasons should have easily been good enough to win at least one superbowl. He missed the playoffs both times with them. He's just not that good. In my opinion, he would have been better of taking an OC position somewhere.

I disagree, the dream team was a lot of players thrown together more worried about their stats and touches then working together as a unit. Reid I think had control over personnel in a lot of instances so I still place blame on him but I also think he was in panic mode trying to right a ship and buy a championship. Always risky to do. I also think he lost enough support and brainthrust with people leaving to Cleveland and other places that nobody would hold him in check on bad decisions. Throw in his personal turmoil with his son and it was a dam waiting to burst.

New start, new team,and one thats not a complete overhaul I think he could restart his career on the win side. You don't just go bad if your a teacher and coach in the NFL. Sometimes it's a matter of taking to big a piece of the pie like Holmgren did. Knowing your strength and what your good at is important. Straying to be a GM and stuff is a nice thought but few seem to make that leap. Holmgren was more focused after his GM stint and team did better. I suspect depending on how the authority chain in Arizona if thats where he goes ends up he will be a better coach if thats where he is focused and stays focused.

Pete and John are an anomoly, someone like Pete that acts like he has a 24 year olds body and energy level and John a film room freak on study as a GM wanting to hands on his approach as much as possible. Many relie on their scouts and then at the end screen film with a staff of already selected players.

seahawks08 wrote:http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/87206/andy-reid-to-arizona-sounds-like-a-plan


NFC West is becoming a dominant conference looks like.

Million dollar question, is Vic coming with him. Read earlier it's highly probably the Vic will go where Reid goes.

Shock2k wrote:

seahawks08 wrote:http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/87206/andy-reid-to-arizona-sounds-like-a-plan


NFC West is becoming a dominant conference looks like.

Million dollar question, is Vic coming with him. Read earlier it's highly probably the Vic will go where Reid goes.

Hope so. Vic is exactly the qb we want them to have.

Vick to Arizona would be a mistake for them, a blessing for everyone else in the NFC west. A player to practice the read option on twice a year that throws interceptions.

chris98251 wrote:Vick to Arizona would be a mistake for them, a blessing for everyone else in the NFC west. player to practice the read option on twice a year that throws interceptions.

Not so sure. Give Vick a reasonable oline, all they have to do is send Larry on an 80 yard go route, and Vick will get it to him. I dont want ANY strong armed QB there. No, that wouldnt bring them a championship, but itd ve scary.

With our defense Earl would get an INT every time he thru that deep prayer as he scramled for his life.

chris98251 wrote:With our defense Earl would get an INT every time he thru that deep prayer as he scramled for his life.

We make QB's scramble?

It would just be scary - Vick, Fitz, Floyd would never truly contend but they'd be streaky and formidable. I feel A LOT more comfortable with a weak armed QB in a WCO throwing there.

Looks like this is very close to a done deal: http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/reports-andy-reid-could-arizona-cardinals-head-coach-224644721--nfl.html

I'm split on this. Reid is a very good coach, and a change of scenery may be just what he needs. But he may be a bit behind the times and done. We'll see.

I read where they have yet to even talk to him yet, cart before the horse and media spinning off a popular story line maybe.

Vick showed what happens when you protect him a year ago. Eagles line looked like it was actively trying to punish him this year.

I think this would be a huge mistake on Reid's part. His life both personal and football has been in a huge turmoil for the last 3-4 years. He needs to take a break for a year and get his life and breath back under control

Do it now or be forced to do it in 2-4 years anyway. I like that guy and wish he had more brains than to jump right into another coaching where he has no control over team acquisitions.

Reid probably thinks he could save Kolb, no Vick in AZ i think.

peachesenregalia wrote:Like Pehawk said, if this was 2006, I'd be worried. Reid is no longer an effective head coach.

I'm actually really sad for that franchise and their fans. The squad of players Reid had at his disposal the last 2 seasons should have easily been good enough to win at least one superbowl. He missed the playoffs both times with them. He's just not that good. In my opinion, he would have been better of taking an OC position somewhere.

Reid, like Holmgren was, is a coach who is trying to apply 1980s football paradigms in the modern NFL. You just can't get by with execution alone anymore. The NFL today is schematically much more complex than it was in the days of Bill Walsh's prolific offense. He is a dinosaur who refuses to adjust his offensive mindset to match the complexion of the contemporary game. Reid would be a disaster in Arizona. I hope like hell he gets the job.

Reid with no quarterback. Haha! Who cares.

Vince Lombardi could rise from Hell (where he is from being a horrible father) and still not coach that crap team to a winning record.

When they get a QB, I will start paying attention.

This just a bad patch job if you ask me. He has had great talent in Philly for many years and hasnt been able to do anything with it. This hire will keep the Turds weighted to the bottom of the bowl.

SmokinHawk wrote:

peachesenregalia wrote:Like Pehawk said, if this was 2006, I'd be worried. Reid is no longer an effective head coach.

I'm actually really sad for that franchise and their fans. The squad of players Reid had at his disposal the last 2 seasons should have easily been good enough to win at least one superbowl. He missed the playoffs both times with them. He's just not that good. In my opinion, he would have been better of taking an OC position somewhere.

Reid, like Holmgren was, is a coach who is trying to apply 1980s football paradigms in the modern NFL. You just can't get by with execution alone anymore. The NFL today is schematically much more complex than it was in the days of Bill Walsh's prolific offense. He is a dinosaur who refuses to adjust his offensive mindset to match the complexion of the contemporary game. Reid would be a disaster in Arizona. I hope like hell he gets the job.

This. The game has passed them by. WCO just doesn't win you championships anymore. Defenses have progressed, offenses have progressed. I think Holmgren and Reid have let the game pass them by and haven't progressed with the game.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100000 ... kevin-kolb

oh great. Andy Reid says he'll "fix" Kolb. I do not want that to happen in the slightest.

hawksfan515 wrote:http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000121034/article/andy-reid-to-tell-arizona-cardinals-hell-fix-kevin-kolb

oh great. Andy Reid says he'll "fix" Kolb. I do not want that to happen in the slightest.

Dont fret 515, the most underrated poster on seahawks.net, it took Andy 7 YEARS to BUILD a system where ANY QB could succeed there. And, in Philly he was awarded QB's in McNabb and Vick who are VERY strong-armed, so he threw long more than most WCO coaches. With Kolb, he'll have to run a more traditional WCO, which is a WASTE of Fitzgerald.

If Reid is the guy, Horton probably takes a job somewhere else, the D has to start over again right?

Not to concerned with Reid, could be a bad hire. Really, the Cards should keep Horton, draft a left tackle.

For a team that has a huge issue with protecting the QB to hire a coach that has a very long history of his QB's getting injured almost every season doesn't make much sense to me. Reid has a good history of working with QB's which is fine, but the Eagles haven't had a good offensive line in years. If I was a Cardinals fan, I'd be very lukewarm on the hire until I found out who he was bringing in as the offensive line coach. I still think that bringing in Chip Kelly to contend with the former Pac 10 dominant coaches would make more sense.

Cardinals should have kept their coaches and went after some Oline, much easier, and painfully obvious that its their problem. Have they EVER had a good oline in their entire history?

I really liked Holmgren's / Heckert's drafts the last 3 years in Cleveland (Weeden exempted). They drafted a lot of players I felt were sleepers and they transformed that defense into a group that was young and talented. They made some good moves on offense too. Too bad the QB position royally screwed it all up for them. Which is pretty ironic given Holmgren's track record.

peachesenregalia wrote:Like Pehawk said, if this was 2006, I'd be worried. Reid is no longer an effective head coach.

I'm actually really sad for that franchise and their fans. The squad of players Reid had at his disposal the last 2 seasons should have easily been good enough to win at least one superbowl. He missed the playoffs both times with them. He's just not that good. In my opinion, he would have been better of taking an OC position somewhere.

What about the 12 seasons he had before those last two? Reid has had a terrific career as a coach, he's just down on his luck right now. Same thing was true with Jeff Fisher. Otherwise, coaches like that would never be available.

If Reid were available three years sooner we all would have been thrilled to get him when Seattle was replacing Mora/Ruskell. Obviously we are extremely well off right now with PCJS, just saying our mentality at the time- we would have been stoked for a hire like that.

My guess is that Andy Reid is still a hell of a coach. I think the message gets a little bit stale after a decade in one place, which i'm guessing was the problem in Philly. I would bet that he'll do a great job wherever his next destination is.

kearly wrote:I really liked Holmgren's / Heckert's drafts the last 3 years in Cleveland (Weeden exempted). They drafted a lot of players I felt were sleepers and they transformed that defense into a group that was young and talented. They made some good moves on offense too. Too bad the QB position royally screwed it all up for them. Which is pretty ironic given Holmgren's track record.

peachesenregalia wrote:Like Pehawk said, if this was 2006, I'd be worried. Reid is no longer an effective head coach.

I'm actually really sad for that franchise and their fans. The squad of players Reid had at his disposal the last 2 seasons should have easily been good enough to win at least one superbowl. He missed the playoffs both times with them. He's just not that good. In my opinion, he would have been better of taking an OC position somewhere.

What about the 12 seasons he had before those last two? Reid has had a terrific career as a coach, he's just down on his luck right now. Same thing was true with Jeff Fisher. Otherwise, coaches like that would never be available.

I get that kip, honestly I do, and in his prime he was a great coach, but of late he just appears to be lost. I think the game has changed and he has not, and as such will struggle until he learns to adapt.

Maybe, but it's a great gamble to take, IMO.

kearly wrote:Maybe, but it's a great gamble to take, IMO.

Is it when you're a team like Arizona? They have no QB. Andy Reid isn't going to miraculously make Kolb a quality NFL QB. They have a good D, but id their DC leaves, Reid will have to bring in a top-notch DC that can work with the talent they have, and that might not be so easy. Their O-line is shambolic, they have Fitz and a bunch of semi-decent WRs.....I just don't know. Seems like they're going to want a major rebuild on that team, and I don't know that Reid's the guy you want doing it, especially in the NFCW with dynamic young teams like the Rams and Seahawks, and hell, even the 9ers.

One problem is Old Andy is a good coach and if he get lucky and stumbles on a good QB. They will be very good. Defense is good, great reciever and good 2nd in Floyd they could be scary.

Or maybe he's going to the Chiefs instead. If he goes to Kansas City, he's a fool.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/88090 ... fs-sources

HawkGA wrote:Or maybe he's going to the Chiefs instead. If he goes to Kansas City, he's a fool.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/88090 ... fs-sources

Why's that?

If KC will give him personnel control, he gets a relatively weak division in a relatively weak conference (which should make turning a team around easier), the #1 overall draft pick, and a better owner situation.

Certainly a better scenario than going to Arizona where he'll be in a dogfight with 3 strong-to-dominant teams for the foreseeable future while he's trying to rebuild.

volsunghawk wrote:

HawkGA wrote:Or maybe he's going to the Chiefs instead. If he goes to Kansas City, he's a fool.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/88090 ... fs-sources

Why's that?

If KC will give him personnel control, he gets a relatively weak division in a relatively weak conference (which should make turning a team around easier), the #1 overall draft pick, and a better owner situation.

Certainly a better scenario than going to Arizona where he'll be in a dogfight with 3 strong-to-dominant teams for the foreseeable future while he's trying to rebuild.

That's a fair point about the divisions. I just think Arizona is closer to being a good team than KC. But being a good team and being competitive in your division are two different things.

Still, I've been to Phoenix and I've driven through KC. I'd take Phoenix in a heartbeat!


** Edit **
Of course Reid looks like the kind of guy who might appreciate some good BBQ so maybe KC wouldn't be such a bad choice.

HawkGA wrote:

volsunghawk wrote:

HawkGA wrote:Or maybe he's going to the Chiefs instead. If he goes to Kansas City, he's a fool.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/88090 ... fs-sources

Why's that?

If KC will give him personnel control, he gets a relatively weak division in a relatively weak conference (which should make turning a team around easier), the #1 overall draft pick, and a better owner situation.

Certainly a better scenario than going to Arizona where he'll be in a dogfight with 3 strong-to-dominant teams for the foreseeable future while he's trying to rebuild.

That's a fair point about the divisions. I just think Arizona is closer to being a good team than KC. But being a good team and being competitive in your division are two different things.

Still, I've been to Phoenix and I've driven through KC. I'd take Phoenix in a heartbeat!


** Edit **
Of course Reid looks like the kind of guy who might appreciate some good BBQ so maybe KC wouldn't be such a bad choice.

On the opposite side of the city thing, Kansas City would appreciate Reid far more than Arizona would if he started winning for them.

Sarlacc83 wrote:
On the opposite side of the city thing, Kansas City would appreciate Reid far more than Arizona would if he started winning for them.

Along those same lines, Phoenix may be a little easier to handle if he doesn't turn things around. He might need that after coming out of Philly.

Another article - this one from Doub - on how that 95% chance has moved from Arizona to Kansas City:

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/andy-reid-95-percent-chance-seems-moved-arizona-165828365--nfl.html

Can't say I wouldn't like that better.

HawkGA wrote:

Sarlacc83 wrote:
On the opposite side of the city thing, Kansas City would appreciate Reid far more than Arizona would if he started winning for them.

Along those same lines, Phoenix may be a little easier to handle if he doesn't turn things around. He might need that after coming out of Philly.

Meh, both cities are conditioned to losing at this point.

A good team, amazing running game, something that isn't Andy's strength. Maybe Dwayne Bowe, Tamba Hali, 1st overall pick and I bet he goes with Geno Smith because of his size and athleticism. Excellent choice for Andy. Kansas City actually has a history of being a fairly good team and was one of Seattle's bugaboos when still in the AFC West.

KC is a great city with a lot of history, good weather and other sports franchises that have had success in the past. Much better choice than San Diego who has an "elderly" QB, average defense and holes at WR and RB. I'll lay odds that Andy is above .500 his first year there. Most likely 9-7 or 10-6.

"Andy Reid has told the Kansas City Chiefs that he's a package deal with former Cleveland Browns general manager Tom Heckert, NFL.com's Ian Rapoport"

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000121552/article/andy-reid-tells-chiefs-he-and-tom-heckert-a-package-deal

Now there's a match made in heaven. Didn't Heckert make the decision to draft Brandon Weeden? If so, uh, yeah..... Please come to Arizona. PLEASE!

Arrowhead is a very good home field advantage too

do the chiefs switch from a 3-4 to a 4-3 for andy reid? he isn't a defensive minded coach but he has had someone (jonhson/mcdermott/castillo) run that defensive alignment for him for a long time.

Dwayne bowe is going to floorish, baldwin too. Jamaal Charles should help andy remember to run the ball a bit too

* it would be kind of funny if andy goes to kc and kicks s.d's ass x2 a year after they told him they wanted to go in another direction once it was known he was interested in coaching down there near his hometown of L.A.