Wilson vs. Kaep straight up.... who do you take?

Disp":17bse7my said:

RolandDeschain":17bse7my said:

If he had 2 sacks on 2 plays and wasn't the only QB on the field, I'd be willing to discount them. Despite what Disp thinks about me, I'm being reasonable about it. Call sack average on the year a wash, then. We'll focus on the fumbles, which are more important, anyways.

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I agree about the fumbles; they're a problem that needs to be fixed, and Wilson definitely fumbles less. Kaepernick is doing what every single QB in history, including Wilson does in their first few games, and that's either fumbling or throwing picks. You're straight up bending statistics to fit your agenda and being dishonest about it though. My point from the beginning is they're both great qb's with bright futures, and Wilson is not on a whole different tier that Kaepernick might never get to like you've been saying.

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Couldn't have said it better. Its like they think Wilson is Montana and Kaep is just a fad. Another poster talkes about Wilsons intangibles (which I agree he has) as if Kaep has none. The dude doesn't get nervous. Ever. He destroyed the mighty Chicago Bear D in his first career start. He played very well in his very first road game in the freakin Superdome. He went to Foxborough and calmly threw 4 TDs in December where no visiting team had won since 2002 and where no QB not named Brady or Manning has ever thrown 4 TDs.

He has a QB rating over 100 through his first 5 starts.

Its like people on here give it up for his physical talents and assume he doesn't have the rest. The kid scored in the high 30 on the Wonderlick. He is a model citizen. He is deeply religious (and I am not, but I respect his beliefs). People rip him for his Tats (nobody I have seen on this board), but they are all verses from the bible. The guy works his a$$ off non-stop. He went to college at 175 lbs and is now pushing 235 lbs. After practice, he straps weights to his chest and back and does windsprints. He 's incredibly respectful of the game and other players and just tries to soak up everything he can.

I read one national writer call him Cam Newton without the attitude.

I'm not saying all this because I expect everyone to become Kaepernick fans or because I expect you to think he's the second coming. I say it because your assumptions are way off-base (and I know it ain't all of you).

For years, the NFC West has been ridiculed as the NFC Least. That ain't the deal anymore. Sam Bradford is now probably the 3rde best QB in the division....and it ain't close. (We as a division) for the most part completely obliterated the AFC East including going 3-1 vs the Pats.

Our 2 teams in particular are in for some titanic struggles in the future (starting Sunday Night) and I think some of you need to realize that the 49ers achilles heal (QB) isn't a weakness anymore.

Russell Wilson is having one hell of a rookie year. There is no question, but ya'll need to start realizing that he ain't the only young QB who is making a huge statement in the division.

I think both QBs look good and both fan bases are extremely happy with the guy they have.

hedgehawk":1f1w15py said:

I think both QBs look good and both fan bases are extremely happy with the guy they have.

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Thats totally fair.

This threads shark was jumped pages ago

Do 49er fans realize they aren't being forced to post here?

edit: couldn't have picked a better 6000th post

AbsolutNET":20cxg17h said:

Do 49er fans realize they aren't being forced to post here?

edit: couldn't have picked a better 6000th post

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Of Course!!

The OP asked for 49ers fans, so I obliged.

Let's see...I'd take Wilson because of his leadership ability, work ethic, poise under pressure, intelligence and decision making skills. I'll leave all the stats and numbers to the rest of you. What I've seen from RW, his ability to forget a bad play and progress from one game to the next is unbelievable. It seems like when PC has him focus on one part of his game, it is fixed within a game or two (not bailing out so much, throwing in the pocket, read-option). I see him as the type of player where you can throw anything at him and he'll adapt, respond, and challenge himself to rise above it.

I'm pretty sure you guys (Niners fans) are perfectly happy with Kap, as you should be. He's a damn good QB and like RW, he's going to continue to get better. But I'm happy with RW and wouldn't change it for ANYTHING.

and one more thing...I don't understand why anybody would want to go to a rival's forum and argue about your respective QB's. That's like trying to discuss politics or religion to me. That ish is just going to go in circles.

Dangit it's impossible to separate out homerism from these posts.

AbsolutNET":2xun7hrl said:

Do 49er fans realize they aren't being forced to post here?

edit: couldn't have picked a better 6000th post

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I think most of the 49ers fans' posting would've been avoided if you guys would copy/paste stats instead of copy/paste and adding 2. A little bit of honesty goes a long way .

I say this as someone who liked both QBs coming out of college.

Wilson's feel for the game is miles ahead of Kaepernick's. He progresses through reads with more frequency and without any discomfort. Kaepernick is pretty much a pure 1 read QB- he has shown the ability to switch reads on deep throws- when he has all day to throw it. Wilson runs a much more sophisticated offense than Kaepernick does and has a larger number of long drives (at least based on my viewing sample- I've seen three of Kaepernick's games now as a 49er). Wilson is also a more clutch QB in the end of games.

I think the big strength for Kaepernick is that he is a great athlete (though Wilson ran a better forty) with a great arm (Wilson's arm is also very good, but Kaepernick probably has one of the strongest arms in the NFL). He's a very nice fit for Harbaugh's system.

Remember that Harbaugh and Carroll are extremely similar coaches with extremely similar philosophies and the GM that built most of the 49ers current team had connections to Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson, just like Seattle's GM John Schneider does. According to an inside source we have, we heard that Kaepernick was higher on Seattle's board in 2011 than Andy Dalton, Cam Newton, Jake Locker, and Christian Ponder. So this isn't about ripping Kaepernick. My heart sank when I saw the 49ers move up and nab him.

That said, statistics only tell you part of the story. In terms of results, the two are very close, but in terms of process, Wilson is way ahead. Kaepernick is still improving and I made the Josh Freeman comparison for a reason, because when Freeman has his act together he's a scary QB. Kaepernick isn't erratic like Freeman is, although I do think he needs to continue his growth or NFL defenses will expose him next season. He's a night and day performer when under pressure / not under pressure. Give him fits and he'll make mistakes- and that's not something you can say about Wilson. If anything he almost gets better when protection breaks down.

-The Glove-":3is17sh6 said:

Let's see...I'd take Wilson because of his leadership ability, work ethic, poise under pressure, intelligence and decision making skills. I'll leave all the stats and numbers to the rest of you. What I've seen from RW, his ability to forget a bad play and progress from one game to the next is unbelievable. It seems like when PC has him focus on one part of his game, it is fixed within a game or two (not bailing out so much, throwing in the pocket, read-option). I see him as the type of player where you can throw anything at him and he'll adapt, respond, and challenge himself to rise above it.

I'm pretty sure you guys (Niners fans) are perfectly happy with Kap, as you should be. He's a damn good QB and like RW, he's going to continue to get better. But I'm happy with RW and wouldn't change it for ANYTHING.

and one more thing...I don't understand why anybody would want to go to a rival's forum and argue about your respective QB's. That's like trying to discuss politics or religion to me. That ish is just going to go in circles.

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Its kinda funny....almost that entire first paragraph...I could use that to explain why I like Kaep...just Put Kaeps name in there and us JH instead of PC.

I respect that opinion tho.

As for why I would argue it...well, the question was asked and the OP asked for input. I have no hope of convicing anyone here that Kaep is better....my only jpe is provide perspective.

That, and I'm really bored at work. LOL!

Kearly shutdown this thread with a shotgun. Nice work, broseph.

kearly":gnzfk36o said:

I say this as someone who liked both QBs coming out of college.

Wilson's feel for the game is miles ahead of Kaepernick's. He progresses through reads with more frequency and without any discomfort. Kaepernick is pretty much a pure 1 read QB- he has shown the ability to switch reads on deep throws- when he has all day to throw it. Wilson runs a much more sophisticated offense than Kaepernick does and has a larger number of long drives (at least based on my viewing sample- I've seen three of Kaepernick's games now as a 49er). Wilson is also a more clutch QB in the end of games.

I think the big strength for Kaepernick is that he is a great athlete (though Wilson ran a better forty) with a great arm (Wilson's arm is also very good, but Kaepernick probably has one of the strongest arms in the NFL). He's a very nice fit for Harbaugh's system.

Remember that Harbaugh and Carroll are extremely similar coaches with extremely similar philosophies and the GM that built most of the 49ers current team had connections to Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson, just like Seattle's GM John Schneider does. According to an inside source we have, we heard that Kaepernick was higher on Seattle's board in 2011 than Andy Dalton, Cam Newton, Jake Locker, and Christian Ponder. So this isn't about ripping Kaepernick. My heart sank when I saw the 49ers move up and nab him.

That said, statistics only tell you part of the story. In terms of results, the two are very close, but in terms of process, Wilson is way ahead. Kaepernick is still improving and I made the Josh Freeman comparison for a reason, because when Freeman has his act together he's a scary QB. Kaepernick isn't erratic like Freeman is, although I do think he needs to continue his growth or NFL defenses will expose him next season. He's a night and day performer when under pressure / not under pressure. Give him fits and he'll make mistakes- and that's not something you can say about Wilson. If anything he almost gets better when protection breaks down.

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OK...gonna have to stop you there right at your first comment. Kaepernick WAS a 1 read QB. He is NOT that any longer. In his first game as a starter vs Chicago, he hit Crabtree for a TD as his THIRD option on the play. Against the Pats the long TD to Walker was ALSO his THIRD option. He is moving through his progressions very quickly and that is one of the reasons 49er fans are so excited. The National perspective seems to think this is all about his legs. Its not. Thats just a bonus. The reason Kaep is playing so will is what he's doing between his ears and his accuracy on the deep ball. Don't dismiss him as a 1 read QB...you will be missing the boat.

RolandDeschain":1qxll695 said:

Kearly shutdown this thread with a shotgun. Nice work, broseph.

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Uh...he might have if he weren't WAY, WAY offbase with his very first comment.

How about somebody finds us the numbers on how many completed passes have gone to 2nd/3rd/4th reads over the past 5 games for both of them, and how many seconds they took after the snap? (Within the pocket only.) That'd be the real telling set of stats in regards to this.

How about we all just admit that no one is here to have their mind's changed, and will vote for the QB of their team no matter what?

AbsolutNET":lkjj8lii said:

How about we all just admit that no one is here to have their mind's changed, and will vote for the QB of their team no matter what?

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That's way too obvious. Besides, the OP is a closet 49ers fan that loves Kaepernick.

AbsolutNET":1hoolg1y said:

How about we all just admit that no one is here to have their mind's changed, and will vote for the QB of their team no matter what?

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How about no. killjoy.

AbsolutNET":28qamir5 said:

How about we all just admit that no one is here to have their mind's changed, and will vote for the QB of their team no matter what?

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LOL....probably true.....

RolandDeschain":mrbi14oh said:

How about somebody finds us the numbers on how many completed passes have gone to 2nd/3rd/4th reads over the past 5 games for both of them, and how many seconds they took after the snap? (Within the pocket only.) That'd be the real telling set of stats in regards to this.

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If that's available, I'd love to see it. No idea where we'd even find it tho.

To be honest tho, not sure it would really even tell us anything. If the #1 option is open, there is no need to move on to the second option. All those stats might tell you is that 1 QB is better and moving through progressions OR it could tell you that the QBs #1 option doesn't get open that much.