huh? not saying that at all

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where anywhere in my post or post's did i say i want to see more vunerable players getting hit? reaching.

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All scoring views are up for review, yes. There is a two step process though. They are either buzzed down to the field to be looked at, or are confirmed. This specific instance Mike Carey actually went under the hood to examine the play, which doesn't happen automatically.

And no, I am not saying the play was whistled dead. I am saying the play is dead as soon as the ball crosses the end line in the possession of a player. Similar to how a play is dead as soon as the whistle blows on the field. You are asking for the plays in the endzone to be consistent with what is called on the field, and I am showing you exactly that. Just because you don't understand it, doesn't mean it isn't true.

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1) In the field of play the Rice catch is complete and he is without a doubt DOWN. He lands on the ground with the ball in possession (which is why it was deemed a TD) then gets hit and the ball comes loose when he is on the ground. That is down by contact at the moment of impact. No fumble would be called if this was in the field of play, endzone, in his backyard, Madden NFL or wherever this was played. The only place that is a fumble is on the Chicago Bears message board........

2) When you break the plane the play has to end. The whole goal of the game of football is to get more points than the opponent. This is accomplished by getting the ball across the plane into the opponents endzone or kicking a FG. If you break the plane the play is dead the second it happens. Otherwise what he lands everyone can pile up on him and take a few licks and then we see if the ball is still in possession.

What about a play in the middle of the field. The player reaches out the ball is at the 40 yard line, the body is at the 38 yard line, knee is down, he is touched, the ball comes loose. Where do you want the ball placed? The rules say it is on the 40 yard line and the offense keeps the possession.

Should this also be a turnover then? Should the ball be back on the 38 yard line? if you place it on the 40 yard line then why would a touchdown be different?

I am another old codger I hear ya I feel your pain.

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Exactly. These type of plays show the uniformity I was trying to express. It is the same call regardless of where it is at on the field, granted that the officials call it correctly.

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it's not the same,nor is it true... the rule states (correct me if i'm wrong) that the play is dead as soon as the ball crosses the plane.. a play on the field is dead after the whistle blows.. therefore it is nothing alike. so what am i not understanding? plays on the field and plays in the endzone are no where near consistent as to how to they are called dead..

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I had a great freaking post but hit post reply instead of submit - AAARRGGGH

In the field of play the play is not dead based on a whistle. It is dead based on the player being down by contact either on the tackle causing him to go down or touched on the ground.

The play in the endzone is dead based upon accomplishing the goal of brining the ball across the field into the endzone. There is nothing else to accomplish.

my original post was much better so give me credit for that instead

first of all those are two different plays arer entirely different

.. but to answer, i've always felt the ball should be placed where the ball carriers body first touches the ground, be it a knee, hand or whatever... if the ball comes loose, during the stretching it out process, then i feel it should be ruled a fumble..because he is still making a football move.. i know the ground can't cause a fumble , yet another rule i don't like..

the rice play .. he was hit and the ball was dislodged at the same time he was contacting the ground, had that play been on the 20 yrd line, you cannot tell me that play wouldn't have been reviewed and possibly called a fumble...

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It mind boggling that you don't see this, maybe you are just being obtuse on purpose.

Each play has a designated end, where upon that point the play is dead, and nothing after that matters. In the field of play, that is the whistle being blown (either due to a player being down or forward progress stopped), a player stepping out of bounds, or the ball crossing the end line in the possession of a player. They all essentially achieve the same thing, play over. You are calling for the continuation of a play which has been deemed dead, just because you don't like the finality of it.

Would you rather go back to the rules pre-1889 where you had to physically place the ball on the ground in the endzone? At what point would a play be over in the endzone then? This is the problem, you are taking something which is arbitrary in nature (the endline) but universally agreed upon, and wanting to replace it with something much more complex in applying in action, but also arbitrary. My vote is for the universally agreed upon rules, which everyone and their mother can see with their own two eyes (unless your name is Bill Leavy).

With that said, I am out of this discussion. If you don't get it by now, you never will.

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credit given... but to retort.. how many plays have you seen when a player appears to be down by contact , but gets up and continues the play because the whistle wasn't blown? happens quite a bit..

and again you guys keep quoting the whole breaking the plane rule to me, like i don't get it.. i do... i just don't like it..

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Aros breaks a plane almost every week.

I gest, but regarding this play.....if it were a mere 3 yards before the goal line and the player was fumbling or didnt have control it would be ruled as such. Therefore the break the plane rule is bullshit in my opinion if they are fumbling without having both feet down and inbounds crossing the friggin goal line.

Start watching rubgy = problem fixed

it's mind boggling to me that you don't get that i do get it, i just don't agree with it... it's an opinion guy, nothing more nothing less.... my opinion about the rule.. whether i'm right or wrong , it's my opinion... i could care less if it's been around since the roman games, i don't like it, among other rules... why is it so hard for you to understand that?

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give you an example, there was a DB a couple weeks back, had a pick six took it to the house, but tossed the ball away in celebration just before he crossed the goal line, it was ruled a TD, wasn't even reviewed when he clearly didn't cross the plane..

another one, less we forget NY Jets and testeverde's bullsh*t TD, his helmet crossed the plane, not even the ball , ruled a TD, no playoffs for hawks... that was the play where i started quetioning this rule.

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Ummmm.....how are those examples of the rule? Those are examples of refs botching calls.

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Oh man, I couldn't resist. Neither one of these plays brings into question the play being dead once the ball crossed the end line. But, considering the rest of posts, it doesn't surprise me that you don't get that either. Pretty much every example you have posted here, or complained about, is the result of human error (i.e. the refs) which if you want to start bitching about the refs, I will whole heartedly back you up on that one.

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I am making a white russian, anyone want one?

ya that's true, damanit, thought it sounded good at the time.. but that is when started disliking the crossing the plane thing,

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tell you what FTW, you're right i'm wrong, i gracefully accept defeat to a clearly far more educated football fan than I.. congrats on your victory.. maybe i should start watching rugby.. might as well i don't know their rules either..

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