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 Post subject: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:07 pm 
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On thirds downs it seems like irvin is 10 yards deep on his rush but nowhere near the QB. Qbs have a 3 5 7 yard drops not 10 step drops.

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:15 pm 
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I think he's just trying to speed rush around and under the RT, but he's consistently getting pushed back behind the LOS a good 10 yards as you're observing. The problem is that it seems like he has no other moves, particularly inside. He's definitely struggling right now. Hopefully the 2 game home swing will right the ship.


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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:16 pm 
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He does seem to favor the back-door approach (hanging curveball). And yes I have noticed this and wondered about it myself. Still a work in progress.

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:25 pm 
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If he can develop a good spin or swim move to go with his speed of the ball than he is going to be hard to block. Until then all he has is his speed, and rushing up field and hoping to beat the tackle around the corner is what he is. Like the Dr. said "still a work in progress"

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:38 pm 
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I'd expect this out of a rookie, but not out of...

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:22 pm 
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i think what you're seeing is good film study and coaching on our apponents side.. irvin is back to his speed rush to the outside, and the defenders is looking like a matador and escorting him 10 yrds past the qb, clemons on the other hand looked really good against SF as far as technique, his spin move was lightning quick, but the defender (can't remeber who) looked like he knew it was coming every time, and just side stepped and picked the block back up... so i think the scouting report is out on those two, there going to need to start using different or more blitzing schemes to become effective again... that's what i observed....

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:25 pm 
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My son, a freshman in high school, just led the league in sacks this year. 14 sacks in 8 games. I know the competition level is like comparing ants to elephants, but he beats the defenders around the edge and when he doesn't he spins inside, catching them off guard as they're trying to lead him too deep. I asked him why he doesn't try a fish move and he said it's conditional upon the size of the defender, who are often much larger than him. It's the same reason he doesn't slash them. A good spin against a defender that's trying to drive you deep, when the guy can't afford to let you hook around and take the QB from behind, is really hard to defend against.

Seems like my 15 year old understands the position very well. Why can't Irvin, a 1st round pick, be taught this?

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:33 pm 
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SalishHawkFan wrote:
Seems like my 15 year old understands the position very well. Why can't Irvin, a 1st round pick, be taught this?


QBs at the high school level don't get the ball out in 2 seconds. It's a situation that is nowhere near as matter-of-fact as you think it is.

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:49 pm 
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One advantage, it opens a gap there by taking the tackle out of the play. Just need a speedster, like Wagner to zip through there :D

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 3:24 pm 
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its you.

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:01 pm 
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He may take the right line, but he is easily overpowered by competent NFL linemen who shove him back 10 yards into the backfield.

My question is, why not move him around occasionally pre snap as a pass rush LB? Let him try and knife through the middle once in a while. One on one against NFL RTs he is getting nothing done.


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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:08 pm 
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SalishHawkFan wrote:
My son, a freshman in high school, just led the league in sacks this year. 14 sacks in 8 games. I know the competition level is like comparing ants to elephants, but he beats the defenders around the edge and when he doesn't he spins inside, catching them off guard as they're trying to lead him too deep. I asked him why he doesn't try a fish move and he said it's conditional upon the size of the defender, who are often much larger than him. It's the same reason he doesn't slash them. A good spin against a defender that's trying to drive you deep, when the guy can't afford to let you hook around and take the QB from behind, is really hard to defend against.

Seems like my 15 year old understands the position very well. Why can't Irvin, a 1st round pick, be taught this?


Maybe your kid is a future hall of fame pass rusher.

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:03 pm 
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SmokinHawk wrote:
SalishHawkFan wrote:
Seems like my 15 year old understands the position very well. Why can't Irvin, a 1st round pick, be taught this?


QBs at the high school level don't get the ball out in 2 seconds. It's a situation that is nowhere near as matter-of-fact as you think it is.



:th2thumbs:


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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:05 pm 
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He is better with stunts and in open space as well I believe. Vs Detroit they hoped to run 4 and get there. Never moved him (Stafford)


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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:58 pm 
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Zebulon Dak wrote:
SalishHawkFan wrote:
My son, a freshman in high school, just led the league in sacks this year. 14 sacks in 8 games. I know the competition level is like comparing ants to elephants, but he beats the defenders around the edge and when he doesn't he spins inside, catching them off guard as they're trying to lead him too deep. I asked him why he doesn't try a fish move and he said it's conditional upon the size of the defender, who are often much larger than him. It's the same reason he doesn't slash them. A good spin against a defender that's trying to drive you deep, when the guy can't afford to let you hook around and take the QB from behind, is really hard to defend against.

Seems like my 15 year old understands the position very well. Why can't Irvin, a 1st round pick, be taught this?


Maybe your kid is a future hall of fame pass rusher.

nah, he's going to be a rock star. Really. He's already lead singer in a band. He taught himself how to play the piano like a pro in TWO MONTHS. He's got musical talent that's unbelievable. Didn't get it from me, that's for sure.

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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 8:31 pm 
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I think Bruce would be ok if we could get some interior pass rush. It would help his speed rush a lot better. Would be kind of interesting to see us line up in a 3-4 look on 3rd downs with Irvin as the 4th Linebacker and trying to overload a side with him and clem on one side. Will never happen but would just be interesting to see how they would play alongside each other.


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 Post subject: Re: Is it me or is Irvin not taking the right line to rush theQB
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 3:44 am 
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We need to continue to look for improvement at the DT position. Still haven't found the perfect compliment to Mebane. After finally seeing our DL line-up against one superior and one above-average OL, I'm starting to get he feeling that what we have now is highly exploitable. Pete and Gus have successfully mixed and matched players with various unique skill sets and bound them together with sticks and bailing wire, but we don't really have -minus maybe Clemons- any DL players with well rounded skill sets. Oh, to have another Cortez Kennedy in his prime...what an instant improvement that would make.


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