Gotta put Pete in the cross hairs

SharkHawk

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redeye81":3hhy6c68 said:
Ok assess what?

It's like assessing at half time.. it's not over yet..

Assess what he's done so far. The season isn't one long 84 quarter game. It's a 16 game season. 4-4 is a poor start. We're another step closer to going 7-9 yet again. Assess what has happened in the first 8 games. It's unacceptable. The improvements were supposed to be coming fast and furious this year. The team had goals. Their goals weren't to finish one game better than last year, which is what they'd be lucky to be on pace for. They talked about winning the division and going deep in the playoffs. Those were THEIR goals. Not goals I made for them. So far the assessment is that they aren't really doing that well.
 

redeye81

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We are also a step from being 10-6.. how do you say we're closer to 7-9? come on we played on the road.. we need to win 2 road games and all our home games. We are right on track..

I still think this assessment is chicken little.. but whatever..
 

JSeahawks

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Geez guys, what he's saying is not that radical. All he's saying is that we should look at how things are progressing and how Pete's doing. He's not saying Pete sucks, or what we see now is a finished product or anything.

Seems like some here just like to argue for the sake of arguiing.
 

HawkWow

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The way I see it, we now enter pre-season part 2.

Including next year's pre-season, we now have 12 full games to get this thing fine tuned. If we are 4-4 this time next year, it should be aloha Pete (take Sark with you).
 

redeye81

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lol i agree.. but the title of thread is "Pete in the cross hairs" how you can say that is not radical??? Even the NRA would see that as radical.. lol

You have to look at the whole picture.. We win our home games and steal one more road win we're in.... how that for an assessment?
 

warden

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Holmgren went to the playoffs year one, blew the team up rebuilt and it was not till year 5 that we became a playoff team again.

Sure seems to me that Pete Carroll's rebuild is coming along quicker then Holmgren"s
 
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FlyingGreg

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JSeahawks":p21kdrv8 said:
Geez guys, what he's saying is not that radical. All he's saying is that we should look at how things are progressing and how Pete's doing. He's not saying Pete sucks, or what we see now is a finished product or anything.

Seems like some here just like to argue for the sake of arguiing.

Yeah...didn't think it was be this inflammatory. It's very simple, actually.
 

SharkHawk

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In the cross hairs means he's being focused on. His ability and results are being targeted. That's how I read it. Not that they were going to blow up the front office. It means, it's time to analyze what is going wrong and if it is with the coaching staff then Pete needs to make changes there and turn over some things, whether they be schemes, or coaches. He went through 500 players. Now it's time to fine tune his coaching and his coaching staff. If he can do that with the current guys, then terrific. But it doesn't seem to be the case. Maybe it's time to try 10 new offensive and defensive coordinators eh?
 

redeye81

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Ya Holmgren must have been in the cross hairs in 2004.. just kidding Greg....

I agree i get pissed when we lose.. it sucks but lets just see what happens.. if we lose out go like 6-10.. let's talk about cross hairs.. i'll sight the rifle for you!
 
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FlyingGreg

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redeye81":2lzc5hwf said:
Ya Holmgren must have been in the cross hairs in 2004.. just kidding Greg....

I agree i get pissed when we lose.. it sucks but lets just see what happens.. if we lose out go like 6-10.. let's talk about cross hairs.. i'll sight the rifle for you!

I'm actually NOT pissed. I'm more disheartened. And red I give you a pass because you and I are usually in step. :p

My concern is this fan base has become accustomed to mediocrity and is afraid to open Pandoras Box and look at the top of the pyramid...

Again - I LOVE Pete. He's done remarkable things to turn us into a competitor. We could very well end up 11-5 this season.

The whole point of the thread AT THIS POINT is to assess Carroll. We have nuked the QB position, the WRs, the defense. There is more here to evaluate.
 

BlueTalon

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SharkHawk":4xxaxvkg said:
Assess what he's done so far. The season isn't one long 84 quarter game. It's a 16 game season. 4-4 is a poor start. We're another step closer to going 7-9 yet again. Assess what has happened in the first 8 games. It's unacceptable. The improvements were supposed to be coming fast and furious this year. The team had goals. Their goals weren't to finish one game better than last year, which is what they'd be lucky to be on pace for. They talked about winning the division and going deep in the playoffs. Those were THEIR goals. Not goals I made for them. So far the assessment is that they aren't really doing that well.
While I think the team is underperforming and needs to be assessed and adjusted, I have to point out that at this time last year, we were on pace to be 4-12.

"Pace" is a meaningless term in football, IMO. Or to be more precise, it refers to a flawed/fictional concept.

Back on topic. I like the fact that we are close in the games we have lost. It is much better than getting blown out. I do not like that we can't seem to put a team away when we have the opportunity. And I really can't stand this 3rd down curse/anomaly/whatever this team seems to be suffering. I get that we're a young team, and I sometimes have to remind myself that Wilson, Irvin, Wagner, Turbin, etc. are still rookies, but that doesn't explain the problems the team has had all over. The coaches right now are part of the problem.

I'm still drinking the koolaid, and in PC&JS I trust. But come on, guys, give yourselves a slap in the face and figure this out!
 
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FlyingGreg

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BlueTalon":3c28askk said:
SharkHawk":3c28askk said:
Assess what he's done so far. The season isn't one long 84 quarter game. It's a 16 game season. 4-4 is a poor start. We're another step closer to going 7-9 yet again. Assess what has happened in the first 8 games. It's unacceptable. The improvements were supposed to be coming fast and furious this year. The team had goals. Their goals weren't to finish one game better than last year, which is what they'd be lucky to be on pace for. They talked about winning the division and going deep in the playoffs. Those were THEIR goals. Not goals I made for them. So far the assessment is that they aren't really doing that well.
While I think the team is underperforming and needs to be assessed and adjusted, I have to point out that at this time last year, we were on pace to be 4-12.

"Pace" is a meaningless term in football, IMO. Or to be more precise, it refers to a flawed/fictional concept.

Back on topic. I like the fact that we are close in the games we have lost. It is much better than getting blown out. I do not like that we can't seem to put a team away when we have the opportunity. And I really can't stand this 3rd down curse/anomaly/whatever this team seems to be suffering. I get that we're a young team, and I sometimes have to remind myself that Wilson, Irvin, Wagner, Turbin, etc. are still rookies, but that doesn't explain the problems the team has had all over. The coaches right now are part of the problem.

I'm still drinking the koolaid, and in PC&JS I trust. But come on, guys, give yourselves a slap in the face and figure this out!

Well stated, Blue. Perfect example of being objectionable and yet hopeful and passionate about the team.

Wish we had more of that in here.
 

NFSeahawks

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I like this post.

Debate is good, and is necessary for growth. There is nothing really knee jerk. I don't think I'm the only one who felt today should have been a win I don't care how good the Lions were last year they were 2-4 coming into this game.

I am starting to question Pete Carroll whether it be him or his hired coaches someone is not getting the job done, also who challenges a play that will result in a first down either way? Thats lack of football intelligence and there really is no excuse for something even fans can see.
 
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FlyingGreg

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NFSeahawks628":drc71l9m said:
I like this post.

Debate is good, and is necessary for growth. There is nothing really knee jerk. I don't think I'm the only one who felt today should have been a win I don't care how good the Lions were last year they were 2-4 coming into this game.

I am starting to question Pete Carroll whether it be him or his hired coaches someone is not getting the job done, also who challenges a play that will result in a first down either way? Thats lack of football intelligence and there really is no excuse for something even fans can see.

I still have faith in the coaches...I just think Pete needs to be way more aggressive in his implementation of changes.

We are seeing some of the same disturbing things every week. That's on the head coach.
 

Largent80

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Really. I don't see coaching as a problem.

Players are supposed to make plays, and when they don't ....that is coaching?

Sorry...not true.
 
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FlyingGreg

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Largent80":36ectt9n said:
Really. I don't see coaching as a problem.

Players are supposed to make plays, and when they don't ....that is coaching?

Sorry...not true.

I have never disagreed with you...so I won't start now. :th2thumbs:

But I have to ask--where is the line between head coach and player performance?

I guess it boils down to this...if we end up 7-9 or 8-8 again, is everyone still onboard?
 

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At some point we have to start winning more then we lose.

That's Pete's job. If he can't then they will take it away. And they would be justified to do so.
 

NFSeahawks

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Largent80":26ocobor said:
Really. I don't see coaching as a problem.

Players are supposed to make plays, and when they don't ....that is coaching?

Sorry...not true.

The players don't decide the defensive coverage. Starting with Kolb and going down at least 4 others games the opposing QB has dink and dunked across the middle of the field with great success. We have solid players on defense, something isn't adding up.
 

SharkHawk

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Largent80":36o229zx said:
Really. I don't see coaching as a problem.

In general I don't. It is just certain situations. The 3rd and long defense is a problem. Is that 100% execution. 100% coaching? a combo? Coaching in general has been good. Player acquisition has been better though. There needs to be some assessment here to determine why we aren't much better than an average team right now. 3 years in, we should be better. There are teams that started "rebuilding" at the same time, that have rebuilt much quicker. The question is why? How did San Francisco get better so quickly? Was it because they were just underperforming for years? What about the Rams already beating us this year after being godawful just a year ago? What about the massive improvements seen by some teams that were much worse than us? We're kind of stagnant. Average from year to year. We could have a bad year and a great year (like the Jets seem to do). But why aren't we at the point where we're at least able to stop a team on 3rd and long. It's just that one issue that's driving us all bonkers. That is something that needs fixing ASAP, and this will be a seriously good team.
 
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