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 Post subject: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:00 pm 
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He said something like "he has yet to see big play ability from Wilson" - I assume he's talking about passing.

Not sure what's considered a big play (I assume 20+ yards?), but does anyone know what percentage of Wilson's total throws/runs would be considered "big plays", and where that ranks with other QBs?

The 1st TD in the MNF game was one.

Thanks!


Last edited by LengthMustBe on Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:07 pm 
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With the reigns pete has on the offense, Wilson has been given few opportunities to attempt the "big play" so saying we haven't seen big play ability from Wilson is like saying Miller isn't being targeted when he's staying in to block. The statement in itself is true, but needs context to be real.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:16 pm 
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Yeah. What he said. :13:

I'd argue that the pass to Tate that was nullified was pretty much a "big" play. However, another way to look at what a big play is is Red zone TDs, which we haven't produced much of either.

But once again, that is more on play calling than on RW IMHO.

We definitely know Russ has the arm strength, and he appears to have accuracy deep. Warner isn't wrong, but that doesn't mean that RW won't show "big play" ability as he matures.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:21 pm 
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Wilson has shown the ABILITY to make big plays (accurate deep ball, great mobility, rocket arm), I don't know how anyone can really argue that he hasn't shown that. Someone could argue a LACK of big plays (even though there have been some) compared to other QBs, but to say he has not shown any big play ability only shows that you aren't watching him regularly.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:29 pm 
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sutz wrote:
However, another way to look at what a big play is is Red zone TDs, which we haven't produced much of either.


Tate screwed up one of those, after making one and right before making another.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:29 pm 
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HawkFan72 wrote:
Wilson has shown the ABILITY to make big plays (accurate deep ball, great mobility, rocket arm), I don't know how anyone can really argue that he hasn't shown that. Someone could argue a LACK of big plays (even though there have been some) compared to other QBs, but to say he has not shown any big play ability only shows that you aren't watching him regularly.


I don't think you play QB in the NFL without some big play ability, but how that transfers on game day is what makes or breaks a qb. Wilson has had only a few big play type opportunities given to him, and like sutz said, in the RZ the play calling has been pretty bad, taking away any big play possibilities. We all saw Wilson make big plays in pre season, but it's yet to transfer. That's not all on RW though, since the Coach has reigned him in and kept the playbook simple and left him with better plays for him to execute without the big play/big mistake scenarios involved yet.

I believe we'll start to see more of it come as the season progresses.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:40 pm 
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Kurt Warner doesn't have a whole of room to talk when it comes to grading young quarterbacks. It took him a heck of a long time to make his way into the league. Wilson is miles ahead of where Warner would have been at this point in his career. Warner was the guy that asks you if you want paper of plastic for your groceries in some podunk town in Iowa. Let's not lose perspective. Warner ended up becoming a great QB and might well become a great NFL analyst but on topics like this, he should bite his tongue. This is why players are advised not to read or listen to the media.


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:42 pm 
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Kurt Warner is a Jabroney.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:45 pm 
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Hes made plenty of big plays. Just last week he threw a critical 3rd and Long TD to Golden Tate late in the game to take the lead that would eventually give us the win.

Russell Wilson isn't asked to win games for us. We know and everybody else knows the formula for this team to win is strong defense and a strong running game.

He's not supposed to be a Drew Brees or Peyton Manning type QB expected to carry the team.


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:50 pm 
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LengthMustBe wrote:
He said something like "he has yet to see big play ability from Wilson" - I assume he's talking about passing.

Not sure what's considered a big play (I assume 20+ yards?), but does anyone know what percentage of Wilson's total throws/runs would be considered "big plays", and where that ranks with other QBs?

The 1st TD in the MNF game was one.

Thanks!



Kurt Warner could stand in for Jerry Lewis, good grief who cares what that guy has to say, "oh if he plays against the Cards, he sucks"

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 5:54 pm 
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So if Kurt's a Jabronee, does that make Marshal Faulk Obi-Wan-Jabronee
Just sayin

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:10 pm 
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To me big plays aren't "long" plays, but clutch plays that led to scores. Wilson hasn't had many of those even though there HAVE been opportunities. The GB game I think was more a product of luck than any big plays by Wilson (e.g. overturned int, lucky hail Mary) It would have been interesting to see what he could have done had McCoy not fallen down.


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:18 pm 
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salamander wrote:
To me big plays aren't "long" plays, but clutch plays that led to scores. Wilson hasn't had many of those even though there HAVE been opportunities. The GB game I think was more a product of luck than any big plays by Wilson (e.g. overturned int, lucky hail Mary) It would have been interesting to see what he could have done had McCoy not fallen down.


I dunno? I think that hail mary ginst GB tops a lot of clutchers and big plays, but thats just me, I don't fantasize about warshing Mr. Rogers jock in the back of some dark locker room..

not sure Warner is the guy? he had one decent season in his last 5 seasons, 3 decent seasons in his entire 12 year nfl career, why is he all the sudden the go to guy? last I heard he was doing speeches at local 12 squares... :?

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:31 pm 
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Waitwaitwaitwaitwait...we're giving grades after five games?

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:49 pm 
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SeaHawk80 wrote:
So if Kurt's a Jabronee, does that make Marshal Faulk Obi-Wan-Jabronee
Just sayin


Yes it does.Faulk is one of the worst offenders besides Tim Brown of being a Hawk hater.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:09 pm 
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Big plays generally require others to help make them happen. The offensive line must block. The receiver must get open and then catch the pass. And so on. Oh, and the team cannot commit a stupid penalty that nullifies the play.

It's a team sport, last I knew.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:02 pm 
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Word.


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:03 pm 
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MontanaHawk05 wrote:
Waitwaitwaitwaitwait...we're giving grades after five games?

This. We're working on it.

:)

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:26 pm 
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Twisted wrote:
salamander wrote:
To me big plays aren't "long" plays, but clutch plays that led to scores. Wilson hasn't had many of those even though there HAVE been opportunities. The GB game I think was more a product of luck than any big plays by Wilson (e.g. overturned int, lucky hail Mary) It would have been interesting to see what he could have done had McCoy not fallen down.


not sure Warner is the guy? he had one decent season in his last 5 seasons, 3 decent seasons in his entire 12 year nfl career, why is he all the sudden the go to guy? last I heard he was doing speeches at local 12 squares... :?



hes had a lot more good seasons than that

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:34 pm 
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Warner was a damned good qb who went through hell to get a chance in the NFL. He's kind of a whack job IMHO but he carved us up like a stinky little step pig many times. RW isnt a guy who is going to get fantasy style numbers for sportcenter by definition and design.
That was Carroll's whole idea, right?


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:58 am 
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Things might be a bit different if RW had Holt, Bruce and Faulk at his disposal...along with a Martz style of offense. Heck even Hakim would take most of our WRs to task. Warner seems to forget how pedestrian he suddenly became without those weapons, or the time to throw to them. You didn't hear much from him with the Cards either until he had Bolden, Fitzgerald and a decent OL to play behind.

I think he's taking an awefully myopic view in coming to this conclusion.


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:56 am 
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Ok, shame on me for believing yet another post that only contains part of the story.

I finally had that chance to watch the vid where Warner passed out the grades and what he said was he hasn't seen Wilson show, in a reg season game, the same, big play ability that he showed during preseason, and that he's waiting for him to do that. He said that once Wilson finally shows (and Warners tone indicated he expects that to happen) that he will be a great QB for us. He also acknowledged Wilson's ability to bring us back and give us a chance to win at the end of games. Overall, the review was very positive. The grade for Wilson was how he felt he was doing AT THIS POINT of the season...and Warner was NOT saying that Wilson possessess no big play capabilty..just that he's waiting to see it happen again as sort of a milestone for reg season play.

It gets kinda irritating sometimes reading 1/2 of the truth getting posted just because somebody's playing the disrespect angle to maximize responses to a thread. :les:


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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:34 am 
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ensett wrote:
Twisted wrote:
salamander wrote:
To me big plays aren't "long" plays, but clutch plays that led to scores. Wilson hasn't had many of those even though there HAVE been opportunities. The GB game I think was more a product of luck than any big plays by Wilson (e.g. overturned int, lucky hail Mary) It would have been interesting to see what he could have done had McCoy not fallen down.


not sure Warner is the guy? he had one decent season in his last 5 seasons, 3 decent seasons in his entire 12 year nfl career, why is he all the sudden the go to guy? last I heard he was doing speeches at local 12 squares... :?



hes had a lot more good seasons than that



really?

he had one 9-7 the rest were losers, shall I post up his stats?

NO!

they're easy enough to find, do it yourself

geez

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:45 am 
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HawKnPeppa wrote:
Ok, shame on me for believing yet another post that only contains part of the story.

I finally had that chance to watch the vid where Warner passed out the grades and what he said was he hasn't seen Wilson show, in a reg season game, the same, big play ability that he showed during preseason, and that he's waiting for him to do that. He said that once Wilson finally shows (and Warners tone indicated he expects that to happen) that he will be a great QB for us. He also acknowledged Wilson's ability to bring us back and give us a chance to win at the end of games. Overall, the review was very positive. The grade for Wilson was how he felt he was doing AT THIS POINT of the season...and Warner was NOT saying that Wilson possessess no big play capabilty..just that he's waiting to see it happen again as sort of a milestone for reg season play.

It gets kinda irritating sometimes reading 1/2 of the truth getting posted just because somebody's playing the disrespect angle to maximize responses to a thread. :les:


no he is wrong!

Wilson has made some big plays one of which was the talk of the football world for over a week, good grief whats with you people it was an obvious misnomer and an attempt at a dig by a pro ball player no longer in the game who can see RW may be heads and tails above his rookie year performance?

there's an old saying "if you don't have anything good to say, zip it", Warner is just sounding like those ESPN dolts no matter how much you peddle backwards for the him... Warner had a lot of tools around him to make him look spectacular just like Brady and Mr Rogers, BUT, he was so fragile he couldn't make a decent career out of football

Warner had 6 straight incomplete years in the NFL, not a very good track record IMHO, however when he had a stout O-line and open targets that caught the ball almost every pass he looked good.

Wilson neither has a stout O-line nor receivers that can catch the ball almost every single pass, and EVERYONE knows this! Warner is way out of line.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:45 am 
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Seems to me that RW is a victim of passing stats. The talking heads collectively look at the passing stats and see low numbers, which they then blame RW for. As we all know, and the talking heads don't, the low passing numbers are more a product of a run first offense and PC still has the training wheels on RW. I expect those wheels will be reduced considerably after the next few games and completly removed by seasons end.

Earlier comments in this thread correctly pointed out that the talking heads need to create controversy (IE: The Packers game) to increase hits for TV viewers, news readers & bloggers, etc.. It's what they need to create interest, good or bad, right, wrong or stupid. Yet, many of us read or tune in even though it sounds like the NFL is now on a par with professional wrestling. I can't wait to see a defender knock out an offensive player with a folding chair.

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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:51 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Kurt Warner's grade for Russell Wilson
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 11:01 am 
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Twisted wrote:
HawKnPeppa wrote:
Ok, shame on me for believing yet another post that only contains part of the story.

I finally had that chance to watch the vid where Warner passed out the grades and what he said was he hasn't seen Wilson show, in a reg season game, the same, big play ability that he showed during preseason, and that he's waiting for him to do that. He said that once Wilson finally shows (and Warners tone indicated he expects that to happen) that he will be a great QB for us. He also acknowledged Wilson's ability to bring us back and give us a chance to win at the end of games. Overall, the review was very positive. The grade for Wilson was how he felt he was doing AT THIS POINT of the season...and Warner was NOT saying that Wilson possessess no big play capabilty..just that he's waiting to see it happen again as sort of a milestone for reg season play.

It gets kinda irritating sometimes reading 1/2 of the truth getting posted just because somebody's playing the disrespect angle to maximize responses to a thread. :les:


no he is wrong!

Wilson has made some big plays one of which was the talk of the football world for over a week, good grief whats with you people it was an obvious misnomer and an attempt at a dig by a pro ball player no longer in the game who can see RW may be heads and tails above his rookie year performance?

there's an old saying "if you don't have anything good to say, zip it", Warner is just sounding like those ESPN dolts no matter how much you peddle backwards for the him... Warner had a lot of tools around him to make him look spectacular just like Brady and Mr Rogers, BUT, he was so fragile he couldn't make a decent career out of football

Warner had 6 straight incomplete years in the NFL, not a very good track record IMHO, however when he had a stout O-line and open targets that caught the ball almost every pass he looked good.

Wilson neither has a stout O-line nor receivers that can catch the ball almost every single pass, and EVERYONE knows this! Warner is way out of line.


Zip it? Lol. Warner is now a NFL analyst, that means he's paid to analyze..........good and bad.

We can talk about all the factors involved in why Wilson isn't the same dynamic QB he was in the preseason;

- conservative game plans
- trying not to make mistakes in red zone
- receivers not helping him out
- O-Line's poor pass protection
- game is faster in regular season
- teams scheming against him, not just playing base defenses

But Warner's right when it comes to big plays, Wilson has not made as many of them and been as dynamic as he was in the pre-season when he was running and passing all over the place.

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