No way in hell we start Whitehurst right now, not when we have a legitimate shot at the division and playoffs.

Whitehurst has been 2nd and 3rd string his entire career for a reason. Hass is the starter, for a reason. One bad game doesn't mean we should bench him. He may not be the 2005 Matt Hasselbeck, but he's certainly our best option.

How about this, Matt Hasselbeck added to the ring of honor...? lol

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~ The Stache'

Whats really sad about this, MH could toss 4TD and 0 Ints. Win the game, beating there second division favorite, and still he wouldn't get any dues. People will find anywhere to give the credit but MH.

Old man hasselbeck has 2 rushing TD's and as many 20+ yd rushes as Frank Gore....too bad he's past his prime, just imagine what he could do.....

Yeah, he's getting old. Back in 2002, who would've though Hass would be in Seattle at age 35?!

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~ The Stache'

Good. Let's put him at RB, then.

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Okay, so maybe that pass rush is still an issue. Lather, rinse, repeat.

I know you want to convince people Matt still has a gun, but how much of those passes were RAC? the 52 yarder to Tate was about a 20 yard pass. The rest was him running.

Last week, Matt said he felt disrespected by Clements on the interception to start the game. Clements bailed on a deep route to undercut a softly thrown 24 yard pass. Point being, Clements was sitting on the route because he doesn't think Hass can throw deep either. Hass may have made a fool of him as the game wore on, but it was not by chucking a 50 yarder over his head.

I understand you liking Hass, even wanting him to start. I like Hass too. But to try and pretend he still throws a nice deep ball is delusional. He never was good at the deep stuff. Not when he was going to Pro Bowls, and certainly not now. When he was at his very best, his arm strength was adequate.

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SEAHAWKS.NET. We All We Got, We All We Need

ENOUGH already with the hater-calling.

And enough already with the thinly veiled insults about "revisionist history", "selective memory", "living in reality", etc. Those comments do nothing but condescend, paint the other debater in a poor light, and inflame things way more than they need to be.

Limit your comments to the Seahawks, not posters, or don't make comments at all.

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GO HAWKS!!!

Visit my Seahawks blog at 17power.blogspot.com!

Follow me on Twitter at @17power

Wrong. I love watching all of our Hawks enjoy success.

I referred back to this because of your comment ..."Like this beauty to Golden Tate" Don't miss understand that I love the connection, but Matt's pass wasn't a beauty. Heck Golden had easily beaten his man. That play showed some of the problems we've be pointing out. Matt's never been particularly strong at hitting a man in stride on a deep vertical route. And in this offense, he needs to be able to do it.

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"You don't always get to play playoff games at home, or conference championships at home, or superbowls at home. You have to have the mindset that you can play to your potential wherever you are." - Pete Carroll

Yes! That is exactly what I'm saying. I think we can all say with nearly 100% accuracy that the Hawks lack the talent and continuity to win a superbowl this year (which is the point of the NFL, not lucking into playoff games), so why not begin auditioning QB's for the future?

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I hate Tim Ruskell.

Aw Jeez - the only way we're going to solve this is if Rock can get JS on another live-chat and we can ask him directly.

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And here I thought it was ok to enjoy the run....so my 35 years as a hawks fan I have NOTHING to show for it? If I'd known the whole point to this was to have a sb winner I'd have picked a different team to root for.

Enjoying the run can still be done but in order to enjoy the run for me, I must believe they are doing everything they can to win the Super Bowl. Sometimes that means moving away from veterans.

That said, going to Whitehurst does not equal quitting on 2010, its simply a different way to try to win in 2010 and beyond.

I'd argue the only chance Seattle has to go beyond the 8-8 division title they are currently destined for is to have an 'out of nowhere' play from a player. IMO, Whitehurst is the most likely guy to do that, doesn't mean I expect it but Matt ain't going to do it so might as while give it a shot.

This is outside the parameters of objective discussion, but it seems as though this thread is designated for all Hasselbeck debate. If I had to compare Hass to one other QB of the last 10 years I'd say Jake Delhomme without hesitation. Delhomme is a solid leader, a knowledgeable QB, an extremely likeable guy and a horribly inconsistent passer.

Both had moderately successful primes and were favorites of their fanbases, but Delhomme fell off the map once his skills diminished even slightly. He started throwing picks at an alarming rate and Carolina realized it could win...just not big, with Delhomme.

I think we're getting to that point. We can win, but I don't believe we can win in January and February with Hasselbeck. I watch games at a sports bar and friends/fans of other teams noticed long before I was willing to admit, that Hasselbeck isn't as good as I was giving him credit for. Last year a friend made the Delhomme comparison and I when I sat down and thought about it I could see where he was coming from.

I'll cheer for the guy all year and hope he proves me wrong, but I wouldn't shed a tear if Carroll decided to give Whitehurst a shot.

put in the new guy he might be better this guy we have now isn't perfect....PC traded for him...PC likes him...PC says it's not Whitehursts time....

Except that he's not horribly inconsistent at all. If you compare him to all the best quarterbacks in NFL history, he is probably more consistent that than the average Pro Bowl QB. He comes up short in other ways, but consistency is not one of them.

Now if you take any of those QBs, including him, and put a new team and system around them, or take away all their good recievers, or their pass protection, and while we're at it, their running game; they will lose their consistency and production. Expecting any of them to maintain Pro Bowl level production and expecting them not to press or force passes to try to win is really beyond ludicrous, isn't it? It's a function of not understanding QB play and how much the QB relies on the rest of the offense. The QB is the one who is out front and looks like he is making most of the mistakes, but it often turns out that someone else on the O made the mistake.

Joe Montana going to KC toward the end of his career is the perfect example. Check out that drop off in stats.

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"Unless you were in that meeting room and know what we're supposed to do, don't assume!" -T.J.H.

When Shaun declined people had tons of excuses for him, too. People said anyone critical of Shaun was a hater and that Shaun would get scooped up immediately and rush a team into the playoffs and Shaun would definitely have several more Pro Bowl years. I distinctly remember witnessing those arguments. How did that end up?

I will say, also, that our running game has sucked since Shaun left as well, to be sure-but it ain't cause those haters jettisoned Shaun too soon.

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"Some people here have been groomed to accept mediocrity and lame ducks, I'm on board with the vibrato!" -SouthSoundHawk

Man, it pains me to say this, but you're right. I knew it before the season. No way can any QB take the kind of punishment Hass has over the years here, and still be in top form at that age. The guy has gotten massively beat up the last few years, averaging something like 38-40 sacks a year. I think that explains a lot about what we're seeing.

Of course, we all knew Matt was done. So do the coaches. The thing is, he's our best QB right now, and we need him to stick around until we can find a replacement. That might be Whitehurst, maybe not.

In the meantime, I think Hass still has that heart of a champ, and can take us to a SuperBowl win, with the right team around him. I don't expect that to happen, but it could. I think as long as Hass is in the game, he's got a damn good chance to force a win.

One thing is for sure - it will be a sad day for the Seahawks and fans when Matt finally does retire. I only hope he retires as a Seahawk. Will they retire his number? Probably not, but I would.

Another example is Kurt Warner after he left the Rams. He ws unsuccessful with the Giants (new system) and then initially with the Cardinals. As a matter of fact, he had a difficult time until Wisenhunt took over and improved their OL and running game. Warner struggled even with having the luxury of playing with Anquan Boldin and Larry Fitzgerald as WRs. I'm not comparing Kurt to Matt. Kurt is HOF and Matt is not. What I'm saying is that even HOF QBs struggle while trying to work with young players or with new systems. Favre had some really lean years in GB. In 2005, they went 4-12, in 2006, they were 8-8. In 2005, Favre threw for 20 TDs and 29 INTs. Hasselbeck hasn't come close to throwing 29 INTs in any year plus he had a QB rating of 70.9. In 2008, with the Jets he threw for 22 TDs and 22 INTs. A HOF QB. Here's the link - http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/F/FavrBr00.htm. Once again, not comparing Favre to Hass. Just making a point that QBs do struggle and HOF aren't immune from it.

QBs can also bounce back if they get a good supporting cast around them. Two games is too early to make a QB change. If the Seahawks are 1-3 going into their bye, (that means they lose to the Rams) then it may be time to see CBJ but until then, MH should start. Just my 2 cents.

I think Warner's extension argument is weak and I'm not buying into it. Maybe the Seahawks offered MH an extension and he refused it. We don't know what type of discussions have taken place behind closed doors, so to assume that nothing is being done is not entirely accurate. Teams do negotiate without mentioning it to the public. I believe that not signing MH to extension right now doesn't signify anything other than they haven't done so yet. It doesn't mean they don't feel he's capable of leading the team the next 2-3 years. It just means that they haven't done so today.

I saw him throw some deep passes at training camp this year. But in all honestly, that's nothing like a real game. I believe he can still throw deep, just doesn't have the confidence either in himself or his receivers. I know he can physically throw the ball deep for a fact, just don't know if he cant do it in a game situation.

You gotta take into account that the Seahawks have a new playbook this year. They had a new playbook under Mora too. It seemed as though the height of his deep passing prime was during the Holmgren era, when he had the same playbook for years. He knew the routes so well that passing on them had become muscle memory, he could anticipate where his receivers would be on deep routes. Now hes had to learn a whole new set of routes on different of formations with pretty much all new recievers except Butler and Branch. I don't count Obo. This really cuts into a QB's confidence.

It seems as though Pete likes to use his TE's in different routes. I've seen John Carlson in places that I would've never seen him under Mora, like down on the weakside sideline?! Carlson has been having a tough time I think, running the wrong routes on several occausions. He looks out of his element. That's also another contributing factor.

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~ The Stache'

Of course Hasselbeck can throw the deep ball still. He could probably throw 50+ yards still, in fact even the QBs with the weakest arms can at least throw 50 yards. What I'm worried about is the zip he puts on the ball. All of his deep passes are high arching rainbows. If you noticed during preseason Whitehurst's balls were not high arching rainbows, they were much smaller archs that reached the receiver before the DBs could even get their heads turned around. Hasselbecks passes give DBs much more time to react to the ball. Now I'm by no means a hater but it's obvious Hass doesn't have a great deep ball or even a good arm.

Interesting fact... in week one hasselbeck didn't throw the football over 20 yards, and he only threw over 10 a couple of times. (DOes not factor in RAC)