The Chris Harper dilemma

SmokinHawk":1fjcp6zx said:

Force feed him in game four. Give him enough work to get a couple deep bruises, which would allow us to stash him on IR. :mrgreen:

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That might be my strategy if I was PC and JS. He has very little chance of making the 53 man roster, so figure out a way to get him onto the IR for this season.

FlyingGreg":2aybma9s said:

Sarlacc83":2aybma9s said:

If we go by the 3 season rule, then it's too early to give up on him. Just like Tate. However, if he's a non-entity in practice, then there's not much you can really do this point but hope he clears waivers.

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Herein lies the dilemma. Do we keep him on the roster as the #6 WR - at the expense of another position we could use a body -or risk him to waivers and hope?

And then what happens when Harvin gets activated?

No wonder John Schneider sounded so tired on the radio today...this stuff has to weigh on him and Pete.

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When the time comes to clear a spot for Harvin, we'll have at least 6 weeks of real game film with the 1's to help with the decision.
Maybe all the WR play lights out (One of those "good problems"), or one is clearly way behind and it makes the decision clear.

Basis4day":1th3uaq5 said:

FlyingGreg":1th3uaq5 said:

Sarlacc83":1th3uaq5 said:

If we go by the 3 season rule, then it's too early to give up on him. Just like Tate. However, if he's a non-entity in practice, then there's not much you can really do this point but hope he clears waivers.

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Herein lies the dilemma. Do we keep him on the roster as the #6 WR - at the expense of another position we could use a body -or risk him to waivers and hope?

And then what happens when Harvin gets activated?

No wonder John Schneider sounded so tired on the radio today...this stuff has to weigh on him and Pete.

Click to expand...

When the time comes to clear a spot for Harvin, we'll have at least 6 weeks of real game film with the 1's to help with the decision.
Maybe all the WR play lights out (One of those "good problems"), or one is clearly way behind and it makes the decision clear.

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Yes, but I doubt there will be much "film" on Harper as the #6 WR. I'd be surprised if he is even activated on game days.

The dilemma is do we eat a roster spot because we want to keep him or throw caution to the wind and hope he clears waivers.

It's a pretty safe bet we'll try to keep at least one WR on the PS.

Yes, but I doubt there will be much "film" on Harper as the #6 WR. I'd be surprised if he is even activated on game days.

The dilemma is do we eat a roster spot because we want to keep him or throw caution to the wind and hope he clears waivers.

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I was more speaking of the WR core as a whole. Whomever goes into the regular season as the lowest WR of the chart isn't guaranteed to stay there. When we need to make room for Harvin the FO will know who the real contributors are.

Dilemma?

Theres no dilemma. If he makes it to the PS, great. If he doesnt, who cares. Not every 4th rounds WR is gonna make it. And he has shown no reason why he should.

Greg do we care? Are we caring? Would we fret if it was Harper catching the deep balls and Williams not showing much?

I think we would say great draft pick and shucks the FA pick up did not work out. We can say the same thing but reverse it.


Problem: Need a wr that is big and physical that can take the ball away from a defender and make a deep catch.

Solution: Pick up Williams FA and draft Harper.

Results: Williams has shown to be able to be physical and take balls away from the defender and catch the deep pass. Harper has not shown fans if he can catch the deep pass or be physical in the NFL.

Problem Solved

Harper has not earned a roster spot with his play.

I am fine with going 5 WRs until we get Harvin back as the 6th. A lot of teams go 5 even without a 6th coming back, and if there are injuries where we need to fill in our roster, there will always be guys out there on the PS, whether it's ours or someone else's. Clark seems like a good bet to slip through waivers, and he's looked better than Harper.

Maybe another team claims Harper, but I haven't really seen much yet that would make me care even if they did. If we can keep Harper via the PS then great; he's a classic PS type player.

HawkFan72":1sinkwr9 said:

If anything, I think they would look at the pick as worth it for the competition alone. If getting Harper int he mix pushed Kearse and Williams to work harder to make the team and tap into their potential, then I would think the Harper pick was worth it.

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I agree with your take completely; they said throughout the draft process that it was going to be tough for rookies to make the team. As a result, they brought in a bunch of guys with high upside but question marks in other areas to provide competition for the existing players. Some of those will stick and some won't but it isn't the end of the world if our late round draft picks get cut and end up on practice squad or another team.

For those worried about 2014, remember that we will have free agency plus another full draft before then. Even if Harper survives the season on practice squad he will still be competing for a spot on the 90 man roster next offseason with all of the new WR we bring in to compete every season.

Every year we think we have it made at WR and almost every season players get injured/nicked up and we never seem to have enough quality depth.

If a spot is between Harper and Williams, then let em have at it vs. Oakland and the best player wins.

If not PS squad or another team grabs him....that's pretty much it.

WRs take time to develop, and Harper was raw coming out. That was no secret to the Seahawks when they drafted him. I know everyone wants everything right now, but I'm betting Harper is stashed on the 53 somehow, at least until Harvin comes back.

Fuzzman55":250ry71o said:

WRs take time to develop, and Harper was raw coming out. That was no secret to the Seahawks when they drafted him. I know everyone wants everything right now, but I'm betting Harper is stashed on the 53 somehow, at least until Harvin comes back.

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Hey its possible. But lets be honest here. The way NFL players are being coached up through High School and College, we do expect more right away now. This isnt the same league as 10 years ago. These players are way faster, way stronger, and way smarter when it comes to football. We should have all expected that reality. There will always be projects, but too much talent is available at a higher frequency. If you cant cut the cake right away, someone else will.

Cartire":23nyat7b said:

Fuzzman55":23nyat7b said:

WRs take time to develop, and Harper was raw coming out. That was no secret to the Seahawks when they drafted him. I know everyone wants everything right now, but I'm betting Harper is stashed on the 53 somehow, at least until Harvin comes back.

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Hey its possible. But lets be honest here. The way NFL players are being coached up through High School and College, we do expect more right away now. This isnt the same league as 10 years ago. These players are way faster, way stronger, and way smarter when it comes to football. We should have all expected that reality. There will always be projects, but too much talent is available at a higher frequency. If you cant cut the cake right away, someone else will.

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I definitely get that line of thinking, but look at Golden Tate. Can you imagine moving on from him in his first or second year because he wasn't putting it together on gameday? Now, to be fair to Tate, all you ever heard from practice was that he was ripping it up and making spectacular catches. We haven't heard Harper praised at that level. But if the Hawks made the Harper pick knowing his development might take some time I'm not sure they're going to change course now.

Also, Williams seems to be a roster lock to a lot of people, and he probably is, but how many years has he been in the league? Talk about a slow development. Harper could possibly be the better player when his ceiling is reached. How much better can William be? This is obviously the stuff coaches get to see in practice that we have no idea about.

What would really be interesting would be if they had drafted Quinton Patton. We'd really be wringing our hands over what would happen with the cuts and when Harvin returns

DavidSeven":cizraf71 said:

Harper's only on the fringe because Kearse and Williams have flashed a ton in camp and in pre-season. I think the sudden depth we have at WR is unexpected. People around here were ready to dump Kearse and considered Williams a long-shot before camp started. Just bad luck and timing for Harper. If it's me, I'm rolling the dice that he'll clear waivers and hit PS, especially since he's likely competing for a spot with our backs and O-linemen.

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This is true. We went from WR as a perceived problem spot to WR as a perceived strength in very little time. And it is a dilemma. Harper has a lot of potential to be a big time player. That he hasn't developed as quickly as some would like puts us at risk of losing what we felt was a future asset at receiver. Our bump receiver is no longer a guy like Bumpus who couldn't make it anywhere else either, and it isn't a guy like Obomanu who reached his ceiling as a backup receiver and special teamer. Harper's shown the potential of being another quality receiver, but happens to be too green and undeveloped to make an impact on the 53 right now. Therein lies the dilemma.

Wrong place, wrong time.

I am in the camp that thinks he makes the 53 but will probably not be active on game day. Harper was raw even in college. His tape screamed project but he had some unique characteristics that when developed could allow him to become a very good player. It is not as if JS and PC thought they were getting a polished player when they drafted him, there is no way they could have from watching his college tape. They were willing to take him in the 4th round (ahead of guys that were much more NFL ready right now like Patton)because they were willing to let him develop. I do not see how their minds would suddenly change on that now.

could be his potential as a receiver is better or worse then say another position with someone on the fringe.. at what point do you decide to keep the better potential over a position? you could make a statement that there are weaker position groups that we will cut simply based on top end potential?

for example.. consider this..
we carry 10 db's usually. and 9 are awesome and one has the potential to be an average DB some day.
And we have harper who lets say sucks now but has the potential to be the best receiver of all time.
when cutting to you Single it to the position group or do you look at the entire teams position groups, I mean we are talking about depth. and future depth at this point right?

Sorry if that rambled a bit.

pcbball12":vsk6sz09 said:

I do not see how their minds would suddenly change on that now.

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The sudden and unexpected emergence of Kearse and Williams as NFL-ready talents is what I think would change their minds. This is information they didn't have back in April. If the choice was among Harper's potential, Obamanu, or Charly Martin, then there wouldn't be much of a dilemma. It's just bad timing for Harper. We have an embarrassment of riches at WR, and we just don't have the space to stash someone for the sake of development.

I'm not saying he's a sure-fire cut, but I think the top-5 is basically set in stone. With Harvin due back at some point in the season, it's going to be hard to justify keeping Harper, especially with tough decisions to be made at RB/FB/OL.

This is what you do

PC - Hey Harper come over here
Harper - what up coach
PC - OK I want you to play lights out then in the 2nd half I want you to run a route and just fall down and grab your leg
Harper - ok coach whatever you say

After the game Seahawks announce that Harper is on the IR and will be back next season