Mexico is too different to be a good comparison, but you're willfully ignoring the suggested benefit of looser gun laws: that a gun owner is less likely to disturb the peace when there's other people there who could finish him with their own guns.

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Oh, don't be such a wuss. A 3rd of the entire world's countries have mandatory military service. You think all of those country's citizens whine about not wanting to be taught how to kill? We're just talking about becoming proficient with firing small arms. If that bothers you significantly, I don't know what to say, except that you have zero survival instinct.

I don't own any firearms, but everyone should know how to use them and be comfortable doing so. People have gotten too used to a "safe world", which is how you end up like that guy in Marysville or wherever it was that advertised jewelry for sale on craigslist a few years back, and a couple people came and held his family hostage, and he got killed.


@Sonic: You are a lying idiot. What you just quoted were universal homicide rates. What 12evanf said was countries like the U.K. that have much stricter gun control laws have much higher knife violence, and that's true. You're TWICE as likely to be stabbed in the U.K. as you are in the U.S. Look it up. Lying sack of shit, get the fuck outta this discussion if you're going to purposely try and deceive people.


Also, I agree with Montana that for a variety of uncommon reasons, Mexico is a poor example; but that being said, if most of their civilian population was armed, I dare say you'd see some small towns rise up against cartel violence. How many parents watching their kids get gunned down in the street do you think it takes before that happens?

I agree. Which is why I want all countries to have nuclear weapons. A lot less likely to start WW3 if all are nuclear capable.

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@ryanadamdavis

Culturally we're probably split between UK and Mexico.

Land-wise, we are much more like Russia and Mexico.

Population-wise, we are much more like Russia and Mexico.

I get the point you're trying to make, but there are too many ways to compare a country to single one of them out and correlate that to gun control.

I'm telling you guys, you're on to something. Carry this "arm everyone" logic forward. How great would that be? Every country has nukes! We can finally nuke our pussy ass moon, like I've always dreamed.

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@ryanadamdavis

Actually you're 100% correct. One of the reasons we've never seen any country to this date use a nuclear weapon is because other countries have them.

...we've used two nuclear weapons...

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Exactly. We used them when we were the only country that had them.

Oh wow, twice as likely to get stabbed... but 4X less likely to be murdered. I guess I'll take my chances.

I'm a lying sack of shit? What the fuck are you talking about? God you're a fucking moron.

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RIP ROAD WOES 12/2/2012

Wait... so what about all the wars in the past 500-900 years where guns have existed... both sides had guns... didn't stop them from using them.

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RIP ROAD WOES 12/2/2012

What? I've read your statement several times and confused of what you are trying to say?

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RIP ROAD WOES 12/2/2012

Yes. The statistics you posted were irrelevant to what you quoted, and it was purposely misleading. Purposely misleading = a lie.

They aren't fucking irrelevant.

If you are 4x more likely to get murdered in the US over the UK but only twice as likely to get stabbed --- which one is better?

There are only ~300 stabbing deaths in the UK a year and only ~40 gun deaths in the UK (which would equal to about 200 if they had the pop of the US)

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RIP ROAD WOES 12/2/2012

Knife violence includes getting stabbed and NOT dying from it too, numbnuts.

Can we AT LEAST AGREE TO NUKE THE FUCKING MOON?

I fucking hate the moon. Faggoty thing doesn't even spin.

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@ryanadamdavis

It was not envisioned in the constitution because "the right to keep and bear arms" wasn't meant to apply to specific weapons. It was meant to give the people the ability to protect themselves with the same types of weaponry being used by those whom they might need protection from.

The founding fathers would wipe their ass with the current 2nd amendment, and amend it. All this bullshit from the right about the founding fathers, is utter bullshit. All these same assholes who act like they know what the founding fathers meant 2nd amendment, think they were all Christians too. They DONT KNOW WHAT THE FUCK THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT.

If anything, the founding fathers would take everyones guns and shoot every current Republican for being Christian nutjobs.

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@ryanadamdavis

We live in a society which fosters depravity and depraved behavior. I will never understand how even a delusional psychopath could commit such an atrocity. I will not rest easy tonight as I mourn not only the deaths of so many innocent children, but also the very erosion of human morality as I understand it.

What happened today isn't about guns. It's not about the availability of guns, or how powerful they are, or how many rounds you can crank off in 10 seconds. What happened today is a sign that there is something fundamentally broken in our country's system of values. Are we so self-involved that we are blind to the pain of others? People don't just suddenly go off the deep end and do something like this. It's cumulative, aggregate, builds over time. This was planned, premeditated, and isn't just something which happened as the result of a sudden breakdown. This guy was on a slow skid and nobody fucking cared to notice, not even his own goddamned mother, who was probably too wrapped up in watching reality TV to bother. Now, because of her negligence (and yes, I put this on her), she, along with nearly two dozen small children, are dead.

Sickening. Really, truly, gut-wrenchingly, sickening.

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Programs designed to care or notice, or even offer this sick fuck help, cost money. Money that our society currently deems unnecessary. Its more important to show "concern" or "outrage" than actually prevent it. Maybe if counseling wasn't so expensive this guy would've sought help. Maybe if his high schools funding wasn't ripped to shreds, someone could've reached him. Maybe if college was more affordable, his life would've been different.

The problem is, in our current society its more important to post shit like you did, than to actually make a difference. Just look at this forum, there's morons up in arms over illegals getting .0000000001% of our tax dollars, nothing about the rest.

Everyone will act as if they mourn, but ask for a penny to prevent it, its whiny time. You get what you pay for.

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@ryanadamdavis

I agree. Today was less about gun control and far more about mental health. We can argue about the macro result of gun control but today was preventable through mental health awareness, not gun control.

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RIP ROAD WOES 12/2/2012